Who Evil

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Llaaldara
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Who Evil

Postby Llaaldara » Sun Apr 13, 2003 2:46 am

< > who evil

Listing of the Mortals!
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
[50 Rog] Pythrrus Smuggler Blood Raiders (Yuan-Ti)
[48 Inv] Nazma - Qu'ellar D'jiv'undus - Orbdrin D'oloth (inv) (Drow Elf) (RP)
[26 Inv] Asher (Drow Elf)
[38 Dir] Gark - Flamgra'in B'luth'ol - Orbdrin D'oloth (Orc)
[50 Inv] Sesexe (Drow Elf)
[45 Ill] Ssinis (Yuan-Ti)
[50 Lic] Sszantiel - L' Xsa'us - Orbdrin D'oloth (Yuan-Ti) (RP)
[45 Enc] Zusuh (Drow Elf)
[50 Sha] Oosh -Hero- Crimson Coalition (Ogre) (RP)
[48 War] Targsk Mosh Dwarf - To'Ryll Avuna - Orbdrin D'oloth (Troll) (RP)
[47 War] Asup Mad Smasher Blood Raiders (Ogre) (RP)
[50 War] Cuza - Warmonger - Blood Raiders (Troll)
[49 Inv] Ssreev (Drow Elf)

There are 13 mortal(s) on.

Total visible players: 14.
Record number of players on this boot: 105.


< 512h/512H 186p/186P 132v/132V >
< > time
It is 5pm, on the Day of the Sun
The 27th Day of the Month of Marpenoth (Leafall), Year 466.
Time elapsed since boot-up: 0:17:42
Current time is: Sat Apr 12 21:47:34 2003 (EDT)


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Join Evil Today! You see what we need. It's painfully obvious. =^P

-LL
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Postby Snurgt » Sun Apr 13, 2003 3:18 am

I've tried twice, but its a vicious cycle. No one on so I lose interest. People lose interest = no one on!

Its an enigma wrapped up in a mystery!
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Postby Mogoen » Sun Apr 13, 2003 5:49 am

Now we know where the majority of the evils reside. With the recent router problem in europe and outside the US.

Coincidence? I think not!
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Postby Auril » Sun Apr 13, 2003 5:59 am

A challenge:

Choose a date and time, and see how many evils you can get on at once. Make sure you advertise.
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Postby Dalar » Sun Apr 13, 2003 8:09 am

IMHO the evil playerbase shrank when many of the top notch evils left due to boredom/their friends leaving.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.
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Postby Yayaril » Sun Apr 13, 2003 8:37 am

8)

There's no such thing as a top notch evil, Dalar!
Llaaldara
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Postby Llaaldara » Sun Apr 13, 2003 8:51 am

Auril wrote:A challenge:

Choose a date and time, and see how many evils you can get on at once. Make sure you advertise.


For? :roll:

Yayaril wrote:8)

There's no such thing as a top notch evil, Dalar!


Give that man a cigar! :mrgreen: hahahaha

-LL
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Postby Ashiwi » Sun Apr 13, 2003 8:55 am

Ignore that smelly bag-o-bones behind the curtain! I know several top notch evils. Diz, Targsk, Telina, Artikerus... all shining examples of luvable malevolency. They haven't even threatened to munch my bones in quite a while.
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Postby Xisiqomelir » Sun Apr 13, 2003 1:25 pm

Ashiwi wrote:They haven't even threatened to munch my bones in quite a while.


Now they threaten to jump them?

0.o
Thus spake Shevarash: "Invokers are not going to be removed"

Gura: ..btw, being a dick is my god given right as an evil.
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Postby Jegzed » Sun Apr 13, 2003 4:05 pm

A large part of CC is living outside US, so we can't play.
/Jegzed - Sorcere Master - Crimson Coalition
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Postby Sargax » Mon Apr 14, 2003 1:19 am

Ashiwi wrote: I know several top notch evils. Diz, Targsk, Telina, Artikerus... all shining examples of luvable malevolency.



Something doesn't belong in the above sentences. *poke Diz* Are you talking about the same Dizzy I know? *boggle*
I'm just kidding! You know you're loved!

And while the evil playerbase has shrunk due to connection problems and such, I don't think it's a big problem yet. I see lots of new evils around, and lots are making alts to fill in the missing classes that are needed. Still, it'll be nice to see the rest of the evils being able to connect onto Soj *lick Jegzy* Now if only Xisi will log on more so I'm not always stumbling around in the dark!

Ellana
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Postby Azenilsee » Mon Apr 14, 2003 3:14 am

You mean stumbling around in the light, dontcha? :)
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Postby Silsaterur » Mon Apr 14, 2003 4:27 am

Dalar wrote:IMHO the evil playerbase shrank when many of the top notch evils left due to boredom/their friends leaving.


LOL, one way or the other, I'm a statistic! YAY ME!
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Mon Apr 14, 2003 4:58 am

Silsaterur wrote:LOL, one way or the other, I'm a statistic! YAY ME!


So you're saying you left because the top notch evils left, right?

Cause if you say you're a top notch evil..im gonna have to just burst into fits of laughter. :P
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Postby Dalar » Mon Apr 14, 2003 5:03 am

try another isp guys, a european guy told me one isp works but the other doesn't
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

Aremat group-says 'tanks i highly suggest investing 20 silver in training weapons from cm to cut down on the losing scales to shield'
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Postby Silsaterur » Mon Apr 14, 2003 5:45 pm

Arilin Nydelahar wrote:So you're saying you left because the top notch evils left, right?

Cause if you say you're a top notch evil..im gonna have to just burst into fits of laughter. :P


Laugh away.

Because I certainly didn't leave because of that trend... though most of my invites to come back have come from goodies, go fig.
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Postby Gyrx » Mon Apr 14, 2003 9:39 pm

Silsaterur wrote:
Arilin Nydelahar wrote:So you're saying you left because the top notch evils left, right?

Cause if you say you're a top notch evil..im gonna have to just burst into fits of laughter. :P


Laugh away.

Because I certainly didn't leave because of that trend... though most of my invites to come back have come from goodies, go fig.


And you are?
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Mon Apr 14, 2003 11:16 pm

Gyrx wrote:
Silsaterur wrote:Laugh away.

Because I certainly didn't leave because of that trend... though most of my invites to come back have come from goodies, go fig.


And you are?


No one.
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Postby Kifle » Mon Apr 14, 2003 11:34 pm

Ok kids...
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Postby Izzemassix » Tue Apr 15, 2003 8:05 am

I recently joined the evils and IMO,from what I've seen so far,I now know why people go to the goodies. I have spent hours just practiceing skills,because the proper players weren't on for a group,or they were a troll warrior soloing.

I think atleast half the evils are troll warriors...those things don't need groups for the low-mid levels,especially the alts with spanky eq.

There are many cool evil players though,who are always xping me,and all happy because of an active squid. I have only seen one other squid on in like 3 days of nothing but non-stop playing. And it was only on for like 10 mins,and never came back,seems like most of the important classes of the evils are dropping in numbers.

I think the reason why is because there aren't many zone groups,so if you want to be a powerful evil,why not just make a troll warrior? But for the classes such as squid or illus,or even enchanter its really hard starting off if you dont have tons of eq.

The last and seemingly most important reason for the shortance of evils,is the big V E R Y ADVANCED PLAYERS ONLY sign the gods pt up in every evil race helpfile. Newbies start with a goodie. They stay with a goodie. Why should they go to the evils? They already have plenty to mud with.
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Postby Azenilsee » Tue Apr 15, 2003 8:30 am

I think the VERY ADVANCED PLAYERS note should only apply to Yuan-Ti because of their hometowns. For the rest, its no different than starting out in Waterdeep, Mithril Hall or Griffons Nest. IMHO, DK is the most newbie friendly hometown in the mud.
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Postby Birile » Tue Apr 15, 2003 4:24 pm

Izzemassix wrote:I recently joined the evils and IMO,from what I've seen so far,I now know why people go to the goodies. I have spent hours just practiceing skills,because the proper players weren't on for a group,or they were a troll warrior soloing.

I think atleast half the evils are troll warriors...those things don't need groups for the low-mid levels,especially the alts with spanky eq.

There are many cool evil players though,who are always xping me,and all happy because of an active squid. I have only seen one other squid on in like 3 days of nothing but non-stop playing. And it was only on for like 10 mins,and never came back,seems like most of the important classes of the evils are dropping in numbers.

I think the reason why is because there aren't many zone groups,so if you want to be a powerful evil,why not just make a troll warrior? But for the classes such as squid or illus,or even enchanter its really hard starting off if you dont have tons of eq.

The last and seemingly most important reason for the shortance of evils,is the big V E R Y ADVANCED PLAYERS ONLY sign the gods pt up in every evil race helpfile. Newbies start with a goodie. They stay with a goodie. Why should they go to the evils? They already have plenty to mud with.


I agree with a lot of this. Although, I have to say that when I first started playing I first went to the evil side BECAUSE of the notice about playing evils only if you're an advanced player. I figured I was up to the challenge and I was right, it was very easy to play a drow invoker and duergar rogue. But the life of a bard pulled me in very quickly and, well, here I am.

I think there are good points and bad points to both the evil and good races. The two are kind of similar but definitely have their differences, both good and bad. I stopped playing my evil alts awhile ago after too many responses from evilrace players to the extent of, "Oh... you have a goodie main. See ya." Didn't hear it from everybody--in fact many were just happy to see me there, playing my "much-needed" cleric and psi--but I heard it from enough of the so-called respected evil players that I decided it wasn't worth spending very much time around DK if I was going to be treated that way. I'm sure there are goodies who treat players with evil mains the same way. I just don't have the energy to stand that sort of treatment no matter where it comes from. I have enough to deal with just being a bard.

I also dislike the unwritten rules around DK. No shouting? No trading? Drow elves signing to each other about how much they hate so-and-so and laugh 'cause so-and-so is standing right there and doesn't know he's being sh*t on? Just not my cup of tea.

The goodraces have their version of jerks, too, but it's a lot easier to avoid them with the type of playerbase on the good side.

Just some thoughts.
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Postby Ambar » Tue Apr 15, 2003 6:06 pm

hehe lame lame lame :)

we are mid cycle .. it hapepns every few months .. plus the fact the euros cant play right now (sslar i HAVE GOT to talk to you) makes it even more tough

evil pbase has always been smaller .. and its bound to get smaller when the core zoners arent playing .. it happens .. we will get over it .. (chekc the number son other muds .. evil pbase is notoriously lower)

are evils meaner than goodies??

yep, so what :) i have both goodie and evil friends and i STILL prefer the evils :) its a closer knit family that i love dearly ...

talk to me .. im nice to everyone .. i giggle my ass off when people shout .. why?? well .. when in rome .. do as the romans do .. *shrug* we dont shout .. we dont sell eq .. we GIVE it away .. shrug .. thats our life .. dont like it?? what can i say... leave :P ... i personally LOVE to give eq away .. as long as it is spare stuff ..

i always can pick the goodies out .. and i welcome them .. hell most of you knew me as my goodie .. so i reminisce .. but still we welcome most of the goodies unless they are wankers:P who wants wankers anyway:P

dont be offended when we do the drow speak .. most of us who use it are hard core roleplayers (i love you brother stabby) and enjoy it ... i have two drows .. the rest cant undertsnd the drow signing either ... i equate it with poeple of different countries feeling more comfortable speaking in their native tongue ..

hrrm what else ... i guess there are LOTS who welcome anyone .. but sure there are assholes .. you just notice them more cause there are fewer evils .. check the numbers of goodies compared to the number of asshole wankers :P bet in the longrun we have fewer:P

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Postby Izzemassix » Tue Apr 15, 2003 7:01 pm

If you say you quit evils because of assholes treating you bad,then you just wanted an excuse to leave the evils.

But think about it...if you have a goodie main,whats to stop you from takeing the eq and items you get from evil zoning,and bringing them to your goodie? All it does is out further pressure on the evils and economic stance.

right now there are roughly about 14 more goodies on than evils....you know what we could do with 14 more people?
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Postby Birile » Tue Apr 15, 2003 8:34 pm

Izzemassix wrote:If you say you quit evils because of assholes treating you bad,then you just wanted an excuse to leave the evils.

But think about it...if you have a goodie main,whats to stop you from takeing the eq and items you get from evil zoning,and bringing them to your goodie? All it does is out further pressure on the evils and economic stance.

right now there are roughly about 14 more goodies on than evils....you know what we could do with 14 more people?


Nah, I didn't leave the evils solely because of assholes. I left because, on the whole, I didn't prefer goodies OR evils--but I was more comfortable with the goodies and how things were done on the good side of things. An evil who felt similarly might stay with his evil characters more than his goody alts. *shrug*

As for the eq thing, um, no goodies complained when I outfitted my evil alts with some eq I had won/earned/traded for as my bard. Nor did any evils celebrate the influx of eq to the evil side. Not really sure what the big deal is there.

I know several people on the evil side who I talk to quite often and I think they're awesome. *shrug* It's all just a matter of taste.
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Postby Clan Blindhammer » Tue Apr 15, 2003 9:38 pm

1. OMFG Ashiwi, get off the pills. You think -I'm- a top notch evil? ROFLMAO! ;)

Artikerus is the Diet-coke of Evils. *pinkie*

2. Drow speak sucks. Learn Duergar. -=cac=-

3. It's a rotational thing, I agree. We'll come back up in numbers soon. One thing I am proud to announce though, is that Clan Blindhammer has now got 8 members. Duergar rejoice!

4. I like purple.

That is all.
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Postby Dugmaren » Tue Apr 15, 2003 9:46 pm

Last I checked both sides of the racewar were played by humans. :shock:

Duggage
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Postby Jegzed » Tue Apr 15, 2003 9:58 pm

Dugmaren wrote:Last I checked both sides of the racewar were played by humans. :shock:

Duggage


You obviously never met Turg in real life! :)

He's a barbarian or ogre.
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Postby Vahok » Wed Apr 16, 2003 1:38 am

Alright a pointless two cents...

News flash...there are assholes on both sides of the coin. I have played evils, I personally found them to be boring (notice I said personally) so I don't play. If you love them ...great! If you don't love them ...great! But the only thing the makes me laugh is this general "our side rules and your side sucks attitude". Give it a rest ...this "debate" has been going on now forever and it's sad.

P.S. Evils stop bringing up the "we only give out eq crap". I have traded many times with evils, and also watched evils log on goodie alts to be in the WD market.
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Postby Xisiqomelir » Wed Apr 16, 2003 3:19 am

Ambar wrote:(chekc the number son other muds .. evil pbase is notoriously lower)


If this were only true my life would be so much happier ;)
Thus spake Shevarash: "Invokers are not going to be removed"



Gura: ..btw, being a dick is my god given right as an evil.
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Postby moritheil » Wed Apr 16, 2003 5:47 am

Heh...

My squid died a few times, rotted despite preserves, and was looted. Never got my stuff back. 3nj0y|n9 :/

Which isn't to say I didn't have fun - it was a blast.
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Postby Yayaril » Wed Apr 16, 2003 12:52 pm

moritheil wrote:Heh...

My squid died a few times, rotted despite preserves, and was looted. Never got my stuff back. 3nj0y|n9 :/

Which isn't to say I didn't have fun - it was a blast.


It was only a blast? It wasn't even an ultra-blast?
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Postby Izzemassix » Wed Apr 16, 2003 4:50 pm

Evils do trade,just not in the same fashion as goodies.

Birile the goodies dont mind because they can afford to lose a player or two,the evils need all they can get atm.

Right now,there are 6 evils on,and 40 goodies on....
A flash of pain comes over your brain,as something starts draining your energies.



Your brain is drawn out with a final slurp,as you feel yourself falling into the cold sleep of death...
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Postby Salen » Wed Apr 16, 2003 5:08 pm

Bah, we need Tod to pull the Previously Discussed in 87 Posts Book out of his Bag of Infinite Cross-references.
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Postby Ashiwi » Wed Apr 16, 2003 5:44 pm

Izzemassix wrote:Evils do trade,just not in the same fashion as goodies.


Evils trade in the exact same fashion as goodies if they roll an unknown alt so the other evils won't know what they're doing. The ones who don't do that keep it very hush. I still remember every evil who has asked me to trade discreetly for them.

Wow, what would it be like to have to live under those restrictions? Having to worry about your friends finding out about what you're doing and facing consequences over it when you're not even doing something bad would suck.

And Arti... yes I do. I could care less what your level is, you're still top-notch in my book.

And Diz is my all-time favorite evil.
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Postby Llaaldara » Wed Apr 16, 2003 6:15 pm

Vahok wrote:Alright a pointless two cents...

News flash...there are assholes on both sides of the coin. I have played evils, I personally found them to be boring (notice I said personally) so I don't play. If you love them ...great! If you don't love them ...great! But the only thing the makes me laugh is this general "our side rules and your side sucks attitude". Give it a rest ...this "debate" has been going on now forever and it's sad.

P.S. Evils stop bringing up the "we only give out eq crap". I have traded many times with evils, and also watched evils log on goodie alts to be in the WD market.


About the "debate".. Do you mean in this thread or on the mud? I really wasn't seeing anything but playful teasing back and forth in this thread and here you come jumping up and down in the angry chair. :?

I don't even see anyone debating split methods either.

So um.. what ARE you talking crazy wabbit? :roll:

-LL
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Postby Vahok » Wed Apr 16, 2003 7:07 pm

Llaaldara wrote:
Vahok wrote:Alright a pointless two cents...

News flash...there are assholes on both sides of the coin. I have played evils, I personally found them to be boring (notice I said personally) so I don't play. If you love them ...great! If you don't love them ...great! But the only thing the makes me laugh is this general "our side rules and your side sucks attitude". Give it a rest ...this "debate" has been going on now forever and it's sad.

P.S. Evils stop bringing up the "we only give out eq crap". I have traded many times with evils, and also watched evils log on goodie alts to be in the WD market.


About the "debate".. Do you mean in this thread or on the mud? I really wasn't seeing anything but playful teasing back and forth in this thread and here you come jumping up and down in the angry chair. :?

I don't even see anyone debating split methods either.

So um.. what ARE you talking crazy wabbit? :roll:

-LL


Ummm yeah...first of all...reread some other people's posts...

One...if you think I was talking ONLY to you...wrong.
Two...if you think I actually care enough what evils do to be angry...wrong.
Three...if you think nobody mentioned how evils hand out eq only...wrong.

As I said, threads about evils and how the have a small player base have been done to death. Not that pointing out it's current problem and teasing each other is a bad thing. Evils will always have the smaller pbase...enough said.
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Postby old depok » Wed Apr 16, 2003 10:01 pm

I would think that with the low numbers on the Evil side, if a goodie rolled up an evil, took the time enough to level it to zoning level, and then used that char to get evil gear for their goodie main, you would be HAPPY.

At least they were THERE to HELP.

I don't give a Sh@t who is in my zone group as long as they pull their weight and aren't a complete ass. Do I moan a little over Acc when one of the few non Imphras people in the group wins the mantle in Seers when I have been a number of times and not gotten it? Yes. Do we not take them next time? NO.

Who cares if some goodies are coming over to farm the evil gear for their goodie main? Maybe it turns out they ENJOY zoning with you guys and decide to make their evil alt their main (I know of at least one high level goodie that went evil in just this way. Of course they came back to the goodie side recently).

I don't know, maybe I am missing something.
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Postby Llaaldara » Wed Apr 16, 2003 10:33 pm

Vahok wrote:
Llaaldara wrote:
Vahok wrote:Alright a pointless two cents...

News flash...there are assholes on both sides of the coin. I have played evils, I personally found them to be boring (notice I said personally) so I don't play. If you love them ...great! If you don't love them ...great! But the only thing the makes me laugh is this general "our side rules and your side sucks attitude". Give it a rest ...this "debate" has been going on now forever and it's sad.

P.S. Evils stop bringing up the "we only give out eq crap". I have traded many times with evils, and also watched evils log on goodie alts to be in the WD market.


About the "debate".. Do you mean in this thread or on the mud? I really wasn't seeing anything but playful teasing back and forth in this thread and here you come jumping up and down in the angry chair. :?

I don't even see anyone debating split methods either.

So um.. what ARE you talking crazy wabbit? :roll:

-LL


Ummm yeah...first of all...reread some other people's posts...

One...if you think I was talking ONLY to you...wrong.
Two...if you think I actually care enough what evils do to be angry...wrong.
Three...if you think nobody mentioned how evils hand out eq only...wrong.

As I said, threads about evils and how the have a small player base have been done to death. Not that pointing out it's current problem and teasing each other is a bad thing. Evils will always have the smaller pbase...enough said.


One! There isn't one post in this thread about how eq splits are handled compared to evil and goodie. Some people started to talk about how some folks handle TRADING, but that also came AFTER YOUR POST. You YOURSELF have brought up the issue of how evils and goods handle splitting of equipment. YOU. Noone else mentioned anything approaching this topic, until YOU DID.

Two! This apparently IS bothering you or you wouldn't have brought it up out of the blue, IN THE FIRST PLACE.

Three! Anyone can make up non-existant paraphrased quotes in an attempt to hide their whining and rants.

Get re-reading. Apparently you've been reading a different thread then the rest of us. :P

-LL
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Postby Vahok » Wed Apr 16, 2003 11:30 pm

Llaaldara wrote:
Vahok wrote:
Llaaldara wrote:
Vahok wrote:Alright a pointless two cents...

News flash...there are assholes on both sides of the coin. I have played evils, I personally found them to be boring (notice I said personally) so I don't play. If you love them ...great! If you don't love them ...great! But the only thing the makes me laugh is this general "our side rules and your side sucks attitude". Give it a rest ...this "debate" has been going on now forever and it's sad.

P.S. Evils stop bringing up the "we only give out eq crap". I have traded many times with evils, and also watched evils log on goodie alts to be in the WD market.


About the "debate".. Do you mean in this thread or on the mud? I really wasn't seeing anything but playful teasing back and forth in this thread and here you come jumping up and down in the angry chair. :?

I don't even see anyone debating split methods either.

So um.. what ARE you talking crazy wabbit? :roll:

-LL


Ummm yeah...first of all...reread some other people's posts...

One...if you think I was talking ONLY to you...wrong.
Two...if you think I actually care enough what evils do to be angry...wrong.
Three...if you think nobody mentioned how evils hand out eq only...wrong.

As I said, threads about evils and how the have a small player base have been done to death. Not that pointing out it's current problem and teasing each other is a bad thing. Evils will always have the smaller pbase...enough said.


One! There isn't one post in this thread about how eq splits are handled compared to evil and goodie. Some people started to talk about how some folks handle TRADING, but that also came AFTER YOUR POST. You YOURSELF have brought up the issue of how evils and goods handle splitting of equipment. YOU. Noone else mentioned anything approaching this topic, until YOU DID.

Two! This apparently IS bothering you or you wouldn't have brought it up out of the blue, IN THE FIRST PLACE.

Three! Anyone can make up non-existant paraphrased quotes in an attempt to hide their whining and rants.

Get re-reading. Apparently you've been reading a different thread then the rest of us. :P

-LL


Here...since you have such a huge problem with understanding I'll help you out. I NEVER mentioned eq splittng in zones. Find where I did, and lemme know..maybe I was drunk when I wrote it. I was referring to this quote by Ambar ...

talk to me .. im nice to everyone .. i giggle my ass off when people shout .. why?? well .. when in rome .. do as the romans do .. *shrug* we dont shout .. we dont sell eq .. we GIVE it away .. shrug .. thats our life .. dont like it?? what can i say... leave icon_razz.gif ... i personally LOVE to give eq away .. as long as it is spare stuff ..

See the part WE DON'T SELL EQ...now reread up...gee, hmm, I can't find where I mentioned eq zone splitting....

The topic of a small player base doesn't bother me...it's the people bitching and whining about it, or the types of people who characterize the "other" side. As Dug so bluntly put it..we are all humans last time I checked...

So did I use a paraphrased quote? Was I first to mention eq? The time and date of the posts is at the top if it helps you out.
Meatshield
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funy posts :)

Postby Zoldren » Thu Apr 17, 2003 12:11 am

i play when rl dont get in the way *so not often*
or when friends ask me to
other than that....

although goodies ask me to play more than evils...agree gyrx..

top players left? not all some just dont want you to know who they are because they got tired of who evil =14 t %1 lets zone %1 tells you naw exp/questing/goofin gsa ok !zones today, or people not listening, or afking or take your pick of reasons for not leading 101.

so now they just sit back and relax and bs w/friends with a char nobody but friends know. so they dont get bugged and they can relax and keep the fountain or 1w warm :P

i quit playing when oosh moved and my mudwomen stoped playing same ptimes, !sex kills everything :p
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Postby Izzemassix » Thu Apr 17, 2003 1:02 am

Ashiwi,do you play an evil?

Evils DO trade,and not by going and makeing a goodie alt,though sometimes i do that myself.

But I don't do it because evils wont trade with me,I do it because there are only 10 other evils on besides me,maybe 2 in DK.

Evils trade by sitting at the fountain and politely saying "i have some warrior gear that I might give you for some +hps stuff." and that starts the process.

No evils could give 2 sh!ts less if you went and traded with the goodies.
They would actually like it because with better eq you're better at your class.
A flash of pain comes over your brain,as something starts draining your energies.



Your brain is drawn out with a final slurp,as you feel yourself falling into the cold sleep of death...
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Postby Xisiqomelir » Thu Apr 17, 2003 5:04 am

Izzemassix wrote:No evils could give 2 sh!ts less if you went and traded with the goodies.
They would actually like it because with better eq you're better at your class.


Maybe you haven't been playing evil long enough, Izzemassix. ;)

In the Bad Old Days, many evils took the racewars idea very seriously and REFUSED to interact with any goodrace character in any way at all. One evil in particular, who left the mud in a quite a bang, was very vocal about this ideal. Lots of evils took it seriously, and it was a point of pride that best-of-slot eq that came from evil hometowns and aggro-goodie zones (eg purple silk eyepatch) not be traded with goodies at ANY cost. Of course, not everyone adhered to this ideal (some people have mercenary inclinations), but even those who were trading off psilks and pbones pretended to be the other sort of evil, because trading with goodies was punishable by ostra, and you don't want to be ostraed on a racewar side with 20-people wholists ;)

Nowadays, everyone seems to realize that racewars over here don't exist
(however much I'd like to see:
You feel a field of lethal energy start expanding outward.
A Gnome is dead! R.I.P
Your blood freezes as you hear the rattling death cry of A Gnome
A Gnome is dead! R.I.P
Your blood freezes as you hear the rattling death cry of A Gnome
A Gnome is dead! R.I.P
Your blood freezes as you hear the rattling death cry of A Gnome

it's not going to happen)

So you'll see people trading the old "taboo" items.

For myself, I bought Ashiwi the serrated dagger smeared with poison from Ixarkon to help her complete her dagger collection, then RPed with her a little about "Don't tell my associates, they would not understand my reasons", purely out of RP, and not because CC would boot me for acquiring 2d3 0/0 procless daggers for goodies ;) and I enquired around about offers to replace my illithid robe that I fed to dragon breath.

I won't trade psilks though, because I'm hoping that will make Lazzraxxuum come back :D
Thus spake Shevarash: "Invokers are not going to be removed"



Gura: ..btw, being a dick is my god given right as an evil.
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Postby Gyrx » Thu Apr 17, 2003 6:21 am

old depok wrote:I would think that with the low numbers on the Evil side, if a goodie rolled up an evil, took the time enough to level it to zoning level, and then used that char to get evil gear for their goodie main, you would be HAPPY.

At least they were THERE to HELP.

I don't give a Sh@t who is in my zone group as long as they pull their weight and aren't a complete ass. Do I moan a little over Acc when one of the few non Imphras people in the group wins the mantle in Seers when I have been a number of times and not gotten it? Yes. Do we not take them next time? NO.

Who cares if some goodies are coming over to farm the evil gear for their goodie main? Maybe it turns out they ENJOY zoning with you guys and decide to make their evil alt their main (I know of at least one high level goodie that went evil in just this way. Of course they came back to the goodie side recently).

I don't know, maybe I am missing something.


When evils give out eq in zones it's not just to the person, it's to the evils as a whole. Going evil just to farm some EQ is unacceptable in my books. If we I, as well as others, thinks that's your intention then you just don't get any eq.

Sure the EQ is yours, and it may not make sense you a lot of the goodies, but it's also ours as well. We get it for you to help everyone else that we group with.
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Re: funy posts :)

Postby Gyrx » Thu Apr 17, 2003 6:24 am

Zoldren wrote:i play when rl dont get in the way *so not often*
or when friends ask me to
other than that....

although goodies ask me to play more than evils...agree gyrx..


I don't bug you because I know you're busy and when you have time, you'll be back. If something uber happens that's generally the only time I ask people to log on.

Oh, and if you log on to play with goodies instead of us, oosh and i will seriously drive to your house and hurt you.

And oosh is on all the time wanker :p
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Postby Izzemassix » Thu Apr 17, 2003 7:06 am

Xis,thats the past...I have sat at the fountain and have been told by evils that I should try to sell/trade some of my crap to the goodies,they're big on that kind of thing.

More than once have I sat at TP (with my goodie) and had a troll ask me to go shout in WD that a troll at TP had some good items FT. He wasn't discretional about it at all. I have also seen in zone groups ( rarely) an evil rogue check out some things for a goodie zone group so they dont get spanked.

I guess these attempts are a way to coax goodies to the evil side.

Anyway,under these circumstances,an evil won't get blacklisted for tradeing with goodies,openly or not.
A flash of pain comes over your brain,as something starts draining your energies.



Your brain is drawn out with a final slurp,as you feel yourself falling into the cold sleep of death...
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Postby Ashiwi » Thu Apr 17, 2003 2:39 pm

Why in the world would I have to be an evil to see something when it happens right in front of me? When an evil brings out their little goodie in order to shout their FT stuff then guess what, they're trading just like a goodie. You can RP disdain all you want, but behind those keys it doesn't make you somebody else just by changing your pants.

A lot has changed in the last year, and it has its good and bad aspects. You would think that we could shake these old stereotypes. Now that evils are a lot more open about what they're doing we're finally getting beyond those ideas that evils are all xenophobic jerks. You'd think we could get beyond the "all goodies are tradewhores out for themselves" thing. There are jerks on both sides of the fence, unfortunately the larger numbers on the goodie side make it more difficult to see the non-jerks and the smaller numbers on the evil side make every jerky action stand out.

Sojourn is a community, and this fractious sniping isn't doing any part of the community any good.
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Postby old depok » Thu Apr 17, 2003 5:37 pm

Gyrx wrote:
old depok wrote:I would think that with the low numbers on the Evil side, if a goodie rolled up an evil, took the time enough to level it to zoning level, and then used that char to get evil gear for their goodie main, you would be HAPPY.

At least they were THERE to HELP.

I don't give a Sh@t who is in my zone group as long as they pull their weight and aren't a complete ass. Do I moan a little over Acc when one of the few non Imphras people in the group wins the mantle in Seers when I have been a number of times and not gotten it? Yes. Do we not take them next time? NO.

Who cares if some goodies are coming over to farm the evil gear for their goodie main? Maybe it turns out they ENJOY zoning with you guys and decide to make their evil alt their main (I know of at least one high level goodie that went evil in just this way. Of course they came back to the goodie side recently).

I don't know, maybe I am missing something.


When evils give out eq in zones it's not just to the person, it's to the evils as a whole. Going evil just to farm some EQ is unacceptable in my books. If we I, as well as others, thinks that's your intention then you just don't get any eq.

Sure the EQ is yours, and it may not make sense you a lot of the goodies, but it's also ours as well. We get it for you to help everyone else that we group with.


I understand the idea. What I don't understand is the logic behind it. How many people are gonna roll up an evil and level it to zonable level just to farm eq? What a complete waste of time if they have a high level goodie main. They could take half the time to get a spanky zone item to trade with any of the evils out there trading stuff.

You are worried about the motivations of a goodie main who rolls an evil alt and levels it to zoning level. As a result you don't hand them eq that could make their character better. As a result they feel slighted by the inequities of the handout system and go back to the goodie side where they feel more appreciated. You then say "see they were only into evils to get stuff for their goodie main"

I am not commenting on the system you use for EQ splits keep in mind. The same could happen in a goodie group if the main people in the group decided to claim some of the eq that you were going after. I am commenting on the mindset behind the splits and whether it was keeping your numbers artificially low.

I know that the main reason I zone is because I feel appreciated and feel that I add something that makes the group successful. I also feel that I add some things that other players of my class do not. I don't care about EQ that much. Sure I enjoy getting better eq and winning things. But in the end what keeps me coming back is that feeling that I make a difference and am appreciated because of it.

If the way in which you are handing out EQ or the way in which you treat the players who come zone with you leaves them feeling less than appreciated they will not stay around very long.

It is a problem on the goodie side as well keep in mind. The only difference is that you can avoid grouping with the leaders who do not appreciate your help because there are many others that do and who lead.

That also means that those leaders will find it increasingly hard to get people to follow them and will either regulate their behavior or have no one to lead.

Bottom line is that if the player base is as small as you say, and you need people to play, I would think that convincing them that the evils are going to treat them better or appreciate them more than the goodie side would be something to strive for. I would think that it would be the best thing that you could do to increase the population on the evil side.

Of course convincing anyone that they are going to receive more love on the evil side than what they will get from Lilithelle alone on the goodie side is going to be a tough sell :>)

You Group say:"ok guys gotta head out. Thanks for the group!" (the ET trip where I won the Fires earring).

Lilithelle TELLS you "thanks for helping!"
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Postby Gyrx » Fri Apr 18, 2003 3:52 am

I always go far out of my way to thank people for coming to a zone and all those nicities. I don't really feel like going into detail because I'm tired.

I constantly zone, go out of my way, and give my up time that that I had planned on doing other things, to go to a zone and help a group finish or whatever they need. Gyrx has gotten 1 piece of eq in the last half a year or more. There's only 2 things that he needs a group to help get, one being surtur the other an isha, so every time I go to a zone I go to help other people get eq, becuase I don't ask for anything that I don't really want. You're not going to see me bidding on things to go trade them.

I'd much rather have the EQ go to the new people, such as Feezuu, who are just starting up. It doesn't bother me as much when an older evil who's been around the whole wipe and doesn't really need anything occasionally bids to sell it, I just personally havn't done it.

But if you're going to do it at even somewhat frequent rate, I'm going to be offended. Between the people on the evil side that actually really need the eq and are going to play and help others zone and those people that occasionally get items for trades there isn't anywhere near an overflow of "extra" eq. Certainly not enough to go equip a goodie char. If there became this insane amount of extra eq that had no where to go except goodie chars, then myself and many other's who don't trade would start getting EQ to trade and then there would still be no extra eq for someone to give to their goodie char.

I know that was worded poorly, but I hope you get my drift.

Additionally, I don't really want to baby the hell out of people that intend to zone with evils. Sure I have no problem helping people, but I'm not going to baby you. If you feel jipped because you didn't get handed an item and you've only been around for a short time, then I don't really want you around. Those are the people that are simply the EQ whores and are bad for the long run. Additionally, if you baby people to all hell to get them equiped and zoning, you're going to have to continue baby'n them while you zone. I'm not willing to do that, I'm far too busy with everything else to make sure you know how to do everything.

When I'm helping a low level evil (which is quite frequent) they typically ask the questions about how hard it is, etc. The answer is all you need is a brain. If you have the capacity to learn and not be an idiot 100% of the time, then that's all you need to play and get invited over and over on the evil side. People say it's too elite, bla bla bla. Whatever, go bugger off, those are the people that aren't willing to put in the time to become accepted. Once you're accepted you're home free.
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Postby Silsaterur » Fri Apr 18, 2003 5:33 pm

Gyrx wrote:I constantly zone, go out of my way, and give my up time that that I had planned on doing other things, to go to a zone and help a group finish or whatever they need.


How... Humble of you...

But I'm pretty sure a lot of mudders feel/act that way... regardless of which side of the fence they sit.

Everything, from every zone I've lead has gone to my guild, I voted on things that people said they _needed_ because there was nothing that I _needed_ I had the same eq since level 36... *shrug* big fricken deal.

You and I have never gotten along, that's likely because of one bad exp run where you pissed me off to no end while I was doing homework and I walked out. I grouped to group, not for exp, not for eq. I could care less for text on a screen and instances of an item.

Paladin, Elementalist, soloing = pie (yet somehow not as good)

--edit

As Ashiwi said, from my days of Iaiken, I met dozens of lowbie goodie alts with hometowns in BG who were nothing but merchants for eq from the evil side. Not to meantion evils who sit at the TP shouting what long list of sundry items they have FS/T...

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