rantz0r

Archive of the Sojourn3 General Discussion Forum.

Does Mori ever disturb or surprise you?

Poll ended at Mon Sep 22, 2003 11:46 pm

Disturb
5
19%
Surprise
0
No votes
Neither; I know the future before it happens.
13
48%
Oh, Mori, Mori *chuckle*
9
33%
 
Total votes: 27
moritheil
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rantz0r

Postby moritheil » Wed Aug 13, 2003 11:46 pm

Why is it that if something sparks between two people, and they're going separate ways soon, the ONLY thing that can really be done to make something out of it is a one night stand?

I mean . . . Ok, it's not exactly a man's position to complain about these things, but it's rather counterintuitive in many ways. You would think that a society where this sort of thing was happening all the time would have a more varied approach to the outcomes.

Am I just ranting for no reason? Is there something else to be done? Have I been blinded by my own aura? Has the Chicken lost the Funk?

Perhaps I should just count my own blessings. Before this, I was content. I may yet still be. But perhaps a part of me just really, really hates near misses.

PS: Vote on the 40 day survey. Thanks.
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Iaiken Toransier
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Postby Iaiken Toransier » Thu Aug 14, 2003 12:14 am

Mori, you have yet to spank me a second time, I don't know why I never died tanking for you.

As for the whole chicken thing...

Chickens come and go,
Mori is here to stay.
He may get spanked,
But he'll never go away.

Moritheil tells you 'Saddle up, it's time to SHPANK!'
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Postby Ragorn » Thu Aug 14, 2003 3:10 am

Sorry I couldn't reply right away Mori.

Unfortunately, this is just a facet of life. People come and go, lives change, and friends drift apart. The relationship you could have probably can't be described as "fulfilling," but I really don't have any advice for you except not to get too attached. Long distance relationships just don't work.
- Ragorn
Shar: Leave the moaning to the people who have real issues to moan about like rangers or newbies.
Corth: Go ask out a chick that doesn't wiggle her poon in people's faces for a living.
moritheil
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Postby moritheil » Fri Aug 15, 2003 9:42 pm

Actually, I was just talking to Taegost about this.

A girl isn't really interested in me. But it's because she has serious emotional baggage, which makes it very good that she's not interested in me :D

I rejoice!

Still, however, I'm interested in what things can be done to leave a mark besides a one-night stand. Don't any of you, with your vast collective experience, have better ideas?
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Postby Treladian » Sat Aug 16, 2003 5:41 am

moritheil wrote:Still, however, I'm interested in what things can be done to leave a mark besides a one-night stand. Don't any of you, with your vast collective experience, have better ideas?


A hot brand comes to mind.
moritheil
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Postby moritheil » Mon Aug 18, 2003 12:18 am

You know, if you don't have anything positive, I'm sure Miax could save the server space for an intelligent answer in some other thread instead ;)

What do you all think about all the time, anyway? Are glib statements that let you get by all that there is out there? I know you can do better than that.
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Postby Gerad » Mon Aug 18, 2003 4:49 am

That was actually quite witty.

Women are evil.

I mean shit man, what do you need? A bright red sign that says "DONT TOUCH!!!"

I think they should have quills or something as a warning.
<I>When a man lies, he murders some part of the world
These are the pale deaths, which men miscall their lives
All this I cannot bear to witness any longer
Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?</I>
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Postby rylan » Mon Aug 18, 2003 3:06 pm

Mori, are you able to keep in touch with the girl even though you won't be together? Sometimes its worth just being a friend to provide support over the long run instead of just a one night thing and never hear from her again. That is of course assuming you'll stay in touch and you can provide some help with her problems without driving you nuts.
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Postby Osil » Tue Aug 19, 2003 2:40 am

Do you want to leave a mark with her? Do you want her to remember you always? Why is doing this so important to you? These aren't sarcastic questions and you need to answer them before you go for the one night stand.
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Postby moritheil » Tue Aug 19, 2003 2:54 am

Before you go for such a thing, isn't it sensible that you first see what the alternatives are?

I do recognize that you (pl., Rylan, Osil) have important points. But my point is, it doesn't even seem there are alternatives in this society - just that, or nothing. Mind you, that doesn't mean I'll allow that to make up my mind for me.
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Postby Osil » Tue Aug 19, 2003 3:36 am

You are right that there are few alternatives. You could have a long discussion in which she opens up to you and lets you know every hope, dream, fear, wrong, that she could possibly think of. A whole night (or weekend) talking about every dark thing under every rock. But it probably won't happen.

People build walls and only a select few could penetrate them. If you have known her for a very short time, you will not come close to breaching even the first wall. It is easier in our society to just have sex and not get into the emotions. Providing physical pleasure is sometimes easier then providing emotional pleasure.

So basically just talk to her and try to get her to open up as much as she is able. (Or as much as you can stand.) You can be her confidant if nothing else.
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Postby Teyaha » Tue Aug 19, 2003 5:18 am

if you would like to remain friends with her, dont sleep with her. this is not tv - the minute the two of you hit the sack you are either together, or not.
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Postby Iaiken Toransier » Tue Aug 19, 2003 1:06 pm

Teyaha wrote:if you would like to remain friends with her, dont sleep with her. this is not tv - the minute the two of you hit the sack you are either together, or not.


So very true.
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...

Postby Jarid » Tue Aug 19, 2003 2:13 pm

Just sleep with her. There is no such thing as a perfect person or a soul mate, and even if there were there's 6 billion+ people in this world and you aren't going to find them. You'd have a better chance of winning the lottery twice in one day while being struck by lightning...that came from a magical container of cottage cheese that materialized out of thin air.

Humans are animals, go do it like they do on the discovery channel. Emotions will only screw your head up.
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Postby Ambar » Tue Aug 19, 2003 2:57 pm

if two adults can't handle a sexual relationship .. then one of them isnt an adult

set the rules early on ... yes women are mysteries .. but so are men ... i find it odd that this discussion is even being held in 2003.

sex today is scary ... you HAVE to know the person ... we are quicky developing into the (shit who was that?? richard prior?) ...

stick your *i*k in and it explodes ...

sure one night stands are fun for all but damn u pretty much gotta get a medical exam before you do anything (using protection just isnt enough)

(but then again im not your *typical* woman, am i)
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Postby moritheil » Tue Aug 19, 2003 4:26 pm

Thanks to all those who have posted input and suggestions. =)

I find something striking. Despite the fact that Ambar seemed to be amazed that anyone would need to ask about this topic, look at how little people really know. It's biased, I know, but scroll back through the past few posts. It all amounts to, noone knows this, noone knows that, it's a mystery, why do we use green for a green light and red for a red light?

That sort of thing is what I had hoped to clear up.

PS: Osil, you are a very wise man, but I'm not sure you can always bet on the majority.
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Postby moritheil » Fri Aug 22, 2003 2:04 pm

bump in the hopes that someone who knows about this is willing to share their trade secrets 8)
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Guest

Postby Guest » Mon Aug 25, 2003 5:59 am

Look at it this way Mori -

You don't have to sleep with her. You can, as Osil suggested, try to talk to her and get her to open up and take that approach. But that's usually the type of thing that takes time and proximity, the two very things that you have in short supply. So, the easier and more immediate option is sex - which allows for its own physical and emotional connections, if only for a finite amount of time (but has the added advantage of being fun!) Why deny yourself that?

I can tell you I've had a few near misses in my life. But I don't dwell on the negative of what might have been. I dwell on the positive of what was. "We'll always have Paris", Humphrey Bogart says in Casablanca. That's the way I like to think about those sorts of things.

As for "leaving a mark", sex does that - for the very reasons I mentioned. It's fun and it allows for limited connections that don't have to be confounded and confused by the deeper questions of "what does this mean?" and "how do I really feel about this person" etc. Maybe that seems like a cavalier attitude, but in the type of situation that you describe, I think a cavalier attitude is the most pleasure-maximizing one to have for BOTH of you - in both an emotional and a physical sense.

[Oh, and edited to say that I disagree with Teyaha. It doesn't have to be that way, that once you hit the sack you're either together or you're not. It often IS that way, because one party or the other is unable to unentangle the emotional side of sex from the physical side and eventually one side will get more attached than the other and then the friendship suffers. But it doesn't have to be. That's one of those line-of-scrimmage calls though, because it's very hard to accurately predict.]

--D2
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Postby Ashiwi » Mon Aug 25, 2003 1:12 pm

Although 99.9% of the time long-distance relationships don't work, there are the few that do. Take a few minutes out and write her a letter... an honest-to-gosh, hand-written, REAL letter. Try to communicate with her as a person, if she's a real person to you, instead of just a missed opportunity. People really do appreciate those extra little efforts, and just because somebody is far away doesn't mean you can't at least try to foster a friendship. Friendship is, after all, the BEST foundation for a good relationship.
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Postby Tasan » Mon Aug 25, 2003 6:39 pm

Ambar wrote:if two adults can't handle a sexual relationship .. then one of them isnt an adult

set the rules early on ... yes women are mysteries .. but so are men ... i find it odd that this discussion is even being held in 2003.

sex today is scary ... you HAVE to know the person ... we are quicky developing into the (shit who was that?? richard prior?) ...

stick your *i*k in and it explodes ...



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Postby moritheil » Mon Aug 25, 2003 11:45 pm

Ashiwi wrote:Although 99.9% of the time long-distance relationships don't work, there are the few that do. Take a few minutes out and write her a letter... an honest-to-gosh, hand-written, REAL letter. Try to communicate with her as a person, if she's a real person to you, instead of just a missed opportunity. People really do appreciate those extra little efforts, and just because somebody is far away doesn't mean you can't at least try to foster a friendship. Friendship is, after all, the BEST foundation for a good relationship.


Hm. More opinions are good.

I have tried something along the lines of what you're suggesting. I'm wondering about something, however - would you usually say people can tell if there is the possibility of a long distance relationship or not?

I've been privy to the messy failures of several friends' attempts at long distance relationships. It seems to me that in general long-distance relationships fail because one person gives up relatively easily and the other doesn't. (Or one person had no real intent of having such a relationship to begin with.) Is this, in your experience, something that people should pay attention to early on?

Well, at any rate, all of this doesn't mean one doesn't try.

Good advice! Keep it coming :D

D2, your counterpoint has been noted. I can't really think of anything else to say in response to it, however. :)
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Postby moritheil » Mon Aug 25, 2003 11:51 pm

PS - This is turning into a thread about the pros and cons of one night stands, in effect. That's OK.

I was really initially intending to ask questions more along the lines of "What do people do instead of one night stands," since that was more immediately relevant.

But all knowledge is knowledge.
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Postby Guest » Tue Aug 26, 2003 12:39 am

Hmm, I don't think the reason long-distance relationships fail is because one side "gives up too easily". I think the reason they typically fail is because a solid relationship has to be built step by step. In order to have the emotional connections and trust (and all those other things) necessary to sustain the relationship, you have to be able to spend time with the other person on a regular basis so that all the little things slowly start to come together and add up into bigger things. Email doesn't cut it. Phone calls don't cut it.

In the typical LDR, two things happen: either the two people put each other up on a pedestal, so that when they DO spend time together at first all the emotions come rushing out and it's great - UNTIL they realize that the RL person is not the same as the person on the pedestal; or one party or the other realizes that they are not emotionally (and physically) getting what they need to out of the relationship - the little things are not coming together to form the bigger things.

So, is there an alternative to just doing the one-night stand? Sure. You can try the LDR. Sometimes it works. I guess it depends how much of yourself you want to vest in the other person, what the chances are that you will actually find yourself in close proximity to each other at some point in the not-too-distant future, how much "pedestal worship" you think there will be, and how much you think they may or may not get vested in you.

--D2
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Postby moritheil » Tue Aug 26, 2003 1:18 am

D2 wrote:Hmm, I don't think the reason long-distance relationships fail is because one side "gives up too easily". I think the reason they typically fail is because a solid relationship has to be built step by step. In order to have the emotional connections and trust (and all those other things) necessary to sustain the relationship, you have to be able to spend time with the other person on a regular basis so that all the little things slowly start to come together and add up into bigger things. Email doesn't cut it. Phone calls don't cut it.

In the typical LDR, two things happen: either the two people put each other up on a pedestal, so that when they DO spend time together at first all the emotions come rushing out and it's great - UNTIL they realize that the RL person is not the same as the person on the pedestal; or one party or the other realizes that they are not emotionally (and physically) getting what they need to out of the relationship - the little things are not coming together to form the bigger things.

So, is there an alternative to just doing the one-night stand? Sure. You can try the LDR. Sometimes it works. I guess it depends how much of yourself you want to vest in the other person, what the chances are that you will actually find yourself in close proximity to each other at some point in the not-too-distant future, how much "pedestal worship" you think there will be, and how much you think they may or may not get vested in you.

--D2


Interesting. Idealization can be quite destructive.

Are there other alternatives, or was my initial rant too accurate? :roll:
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Postby Ashiwi » Tue Aug 26, 2003 2:59 pm

Alternatives to the one night stand????

Have you considered conversation? Holding hands and gazing at the stars until the wee hours? Bowling? Getting to know her? If you're seriously asking if there are any alternatives to cheap sex, then maybe your question should really have more to do with if there are any viable alternatives for you. There are tons of options, and they're obvious, and if you're just not seeing any of them then you might consider directing these kinds of questions inwards instead of outwards. Building a long distance friendship can be a step towards building a solid relationship that can feasibly blossom into more. Hell, half the time sex, even really good sex, will ruin a decent friendship for any number of reasons, so if you see sex as one of your few options in building a bond between you and somebody you feel attracted to, then you might be setting fire to your rope before you've finished climbing it.
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Postby Mitharx » Tue Aug 26, 2003 3:52 pm

Most people have heard plenty about my gf so you might as well know this. I'm not sure how well you know her, but I think that long distance relationship is a bad way to to get to know her. I know it works for some people, but my gf/I had an excellent relationship when we were long distance (about 8 months or so) and then things got bad when we actually stayed together physically over a long period of time. People find ways to hide or deny the bad things about other people when they're not in that close proximity that you get with one-on-one. If you wanna go for friendship then I say go for it. There is no pressure and no loss, but as for an actual relationship, I say no. Also, you mentioned emotional baggage. Everyone has some, but you need to monitor that for a while before really deciding on anything. This is one of the things that hurt my relationship. Things such as daddy issues and parent controlling issues have killed two relationships I've had.

Also, (and this is probably amazingly unmanly) I tend to form attatchments when I have sex. It's why I try to avoid casual sex (sometimes I fail at this:P).

In summary: NO! Bad Mori! Bad!
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Postby moritheil » Wed Aug 27, 2003 12:37 am

Ashiwi wrote:Alternatives to the one night stand????

If you're seriously asking if there are any alternatives to cheap sex, then maybe your question should really have more to do with if there are any viable alternatives for you.


I think you forgot the 'no time' clause, Ashiwi =). Not that I blame you for yelling at me - it seems I haven't come across clearly in this thread. I'm curious about something. How many long distance relationships have you known about, and what proportion of them properly blossom and grow?

My point is not that I can't think of things I would like to do with a girl. I am asking what people do in lieu of time-intensive bonding, and in lieu of the "cheap sex" you so abhor.

Let me leave it at that.

I am not posting up simply to ask people to convince me that random sex is bad. Come on now.

...

Mitharx, thank you for sharing your own experiences. Do you think this is intrinsic to the nature of the relationship itself (long-distance)? Do you think it would have worked out with those girls if it wasn't long distance, or would it have fallen apart faster?
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Postby thanuk » Wed Aug 27, 2003 1:29 am

moritheil wrote: I'm curious about something. How many long distance relationships have you known about, and what proportion of them properly blossom and grow?


After I graduated, my girlfriend still went to school for another year. We'd see each other one weekend every 2 weeks or so. So what we did alot was have geek dates, where we would watch the same shows on tv and talk on IM or on the phone, with cell fones it was cheap with the free nights and weekends. Long story short, we're still together.
Mysrel tells you 'have my babies'
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Mysrel tells you 'daddy? No, I think you have the terminology wrong'
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Mysrel tells you 'can be where ever you want to be, yer still getting ****** like a drunken cheerleader'
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Postby Ashiwi » Wed Aug 27, 2003 1:47 pm

moritheil wrote:I think you forgot the 'no time' clause, Ashiwi =).


If you have time for sex, you have time for other things. Even fifteen minutes of conversation can be memorable.

moritheil wrote:My point is not that I can't think of things I would like to do with a girl. I am asking what people do in lieu of time-intensive bonding, and in lieu of the "cheap sex" you so abhor.


Who in the world ever said that I abhor cheap sex? Just because I don't indulge at this moment in my life doesn't mean I abhor it.
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Postby moritheil » Thu Aug 28, 2003 2:48 am

Wow.

Teach me to have those kinds of conversations then ;)

I inferred it from what you said earlier, Ashiwi.

Thanuk, let me just say you are the LAST person I thought would come out with a working example. =) Thanks!
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Postby Guest » Thu Aug 28, 2003 6:03 pm

Hmm, not to rain on your parade Mori, but from Thanuk's example I'm inferring that he already had a relationship with his girlfriend before she left. LDR is easier if the building blocks for a solid relationship are already in place. Not easy, mind you. But easier.
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Postby thanuk » Thu Aug 28, 2003 6:07 pm

Yeah we had already been together like 7 months by then Mori. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
Mysrel tells you 'have my babies'

You tell Mysrel 'u want me to be ur baby daddy?'

Mysrel tells you 'daddy? No, I think you have the terminology wrong'

You tell Mysrel 'comeon now we both know i would be the top'

Mysrel tells you 'can be where ever you want to be, yer still getting ****** like a drunken cheerleader'

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