BBQ Cruelty

Elisten · Postby **Elisten** » Mon Jul 22, 2002 11:03 pm

I love you all, really I do.

However, if I ever catch any of you burning cats - http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/07/16/burned.kitten.ap/index.html
or dogs - http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/news/local/3591257.htm ...
I will personally hunt you down and burn you myself.

XOXO
Eli

PS - I just don't understand how people can do such cruel things. I had to rant. Thanks for listening.

[This message has been edited by Elisten (edited 07-22-2002).]

Slavan · Postby **Slavan** » Mon Jul 22, 2002 11:12 pm

That made me sick to my stomach! They shouldnt fine people that do it, they should BBq them too. Sick people in this world!

Grungar · Postby **Grungar** » Mon Jul 22, 2002 11:35 pm

Is it ok to fry ants and make them sizzle and pop by using a magnifying glass?

- Grungar "Fooooooooooocus.... Fooooooooooocus... There!" Forgefire

PS: Using magnifyng glasses to light piles of leaves on fire = tons of autumn fun for everyone.

Blung · Postby **Blung** » Mon Jul 22, 2002 11:52 pm

There are a million things happen in the world each day. Like little kids die of hunger. And here you are worry about a kitten being BBQ?

Come out of the house and smell the roses.

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Blung take no prisoner.

Ambar · Postby **Ambar** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 12:00 am

Man we were just discussing stuff like this today in school...

how the FUCK can people hurt creatures that are so small and defenseless?

I hope to hell that these people go to a place where larger beings roast THEM for eternity

Blung .. of COURSE we understand that children are hungry all over the world.. but to do this SHIT just because???

PUHHLEASE!!!

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Ambar -= Beloved Matron =- Crimson Coalition

Ishul · Postby **Ishul** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 12:07 am

*Agree Elisten*

I love animals, and I get very upset at things like this happening to them. Whoever did this stuff around me would have a real BAD day.

As for the people starving comment, I think society as a whole is hardened to this kind of thing. Its sad, but I didn't feel near the outrage I did when reading about the Runion girl. I read the kitten story and wanted to go hunt these people down.

Ishul, dreaming of opening up a luxury cat hotel

Elisten · Postby **Elisten** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 12:19 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Blung:
There are a million things happen in the world each day. Like little kids die of hunger. And here you are worry about a kitten being BBQ?

Come out of the house and smell the roses.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hehe, there's one person that is a possible "On my list of peeps to BBQ cause they BBQ'd a cat/dog/animal/etc."

Of course I know little kids die of hunger. Every single day. Unfortunately, there's not much I can do about that. Except maybe donate $2 to the Starving Christian Children Fund.

If there's someone tormenting a poor little animal, well at least I *can* do something about it.

Elisten - "A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet."

Ragorn · Postby **Ragorn** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 5:25 am

The guy faces a 5 year maximum jail sentence and a $5000 fine. 5 years is longer than the maximum sentence for burglary, theft, theft auto, assault, and the vast majority of drug convictions (not counting the most serious offenses, like multiple counts of distribution). Statistics taken from a Department of Justice statistics and graph page, your mileage may vary by state.

In other words, it's more heinous to kill a mindless, unthinking cat than it is to beat your ex-girlfriend with a crowbar. Hey, I don't barbecue cats and I think this guy is a space case, but let's not confuse ourselves into thinking the guy deserves to be locked up for 5 years.

Food for thought.

- Ragorn
Spokesperson for PETA (People Eating Tasty Animals)

Kifle · Postby **Kifle** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 6:59 am

Although I find this horrific, I can't say the man deserves prison time for it. I step on bugs all the time. I eat beef/pork. Didn't you know that when they kill a cow for its beef they slit its throat at watch it choke to death on its own blood? But, I am pretty sure they might also bludgen them to death with a huge club, but i am not sure. Then we all make hamburgers and steaks, woohoo!

Make him do community service at some animal shelter or something, prison is for people who take out their agressions and traumas on people rather than animals.

Did they even find out if this man was going to eat his cat?! Maybe he wanted something like veal? Just a thought...

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"Kill them all, God will know his own." -Domingo de Guzman, A.K.A Saint Dominic

Ambar · Postby **Ambar** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 9:58 am

if he wanted veal, the cat would have been dead/skinned

the point is this is disgusting, not the fact that it is an animal not a person .. come on people :P

he was doing it for amusement .. didn't you guys read it at all?? he probably rapes old women and enjoys it too

also noone has said this was the equivalent to killing a person, come on use your brains!

most serial killers start with small anilams and go to humans because the thrill gets too small with animals

*shrug*

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Ambar -= Beloved Matron =- Crimson Coalition

Ragorn · Postby **Ragorn** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 10:15 am

My point above was the ridiculous nature of our animal cruelty laws. Torturing a kitten carries a longer sentence than actual crimes, like theft of property or assault with a weapon. I'm sorry, I like animals, but I don't believe that isolated acts of cruelty toward common, unowned animals constitutes anything more than a misdemeanor. The man grilled a kitten which YES, is kind of twisted... but it's not like he filled his basement with dead kittens or fashioned a puppy-fur coat for himself.

Furthermore, you cannot profile this guy the way you suggest, Ambar. Many (not even most) serial killers have histories of torturing animals.... but just because many prostitutes have a history of sex by age 14, you can't assume that every girl that has sex early on will be a hooker.

What makes me sadder than the death of the kitten is that this guy is going to be harassed for years by animal terrorist groups like PETA, even if he doesn't do any prison time.

I guess my overall view is:

People > Animals

in all cases. But then, it's my goal to be a research scientist, and part of that involves animal research. I think unnecessary cruelty is wrong, but in the end, being on top of the food chain carries certain priviledges.

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- Ragorn
Jenera says 'i managed to match a little, ragorn's outfit is hideous.'

kiryan · Postby **kiryan** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 10:58 am

agree ragorn

not much you can do about starving children eh elisten? seems to me just taking care of one of those starving children for a month might be a pretty big deal to them. but send your money off and say thats all you can do while you spend another 10 play days here on sojourn and post about how atrocious it is to burn a kitten. i might call it "atrocious" to waste your time playing this game when you could be out there donating your time to feeding the homeless or working part time jobs so you could help just one more person. before you get all upset about kittens, maybe you should do what you can for others.

[This message has been edited by kiryan (edited 07-23-2002).]

celara · Postby **celara** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 1:07 pm

Blundg:There are a million things happen in the world each day. Like little kids die of hunger. And here you are worry about a kitten being BBQ?

Yah we/I do you sick bastard, god what are you heartless? If you are callous to this, I would doubt you would have much compassion for a child dying of hunger. Just because there might be things you consider to be 'worse' doesnt make this any less an atrocity. They were not doing this to eat it like they were starving to death, they were doing it for 'fun', out of some sick perversion. SICK FUCKING PEOPLE GOD WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS PLANET!?!?

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Just as soon as I belong/Then its time I disappear

Zoldren · Postby **Zoldren** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 1:11 pm

i know people who will pick up kittens off the street... who have 9-10 cats.. but wont give to charity ... wont help their comunity....who dont care about other people... they are the people making the laws :P

Sarvis · Postby **Sarvis** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 2:35 pm

Ragorn: Heh... some ranger you make.

Topic:

If I'd seen this I'd have grabbed the biggest stick or two I could find and layed the smack down upon the "partiers."

Yeah yeah, starving children and all that shit. There are a LOT of problems in the world, but just because there are starving children doesn't mean that deranged assholes grilling baby animals isn't also a problem.

You guys appear to think that humans are somehow important, or something. We're really just another species that got "lucky" in evolution. Nothing makes us better than any other animal, except our advanced ways of killing everything off that we want.

"On the planet Earth, man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much - the wheel, New York, wars and so on - while all along the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent that man - for precisely the same reasons."

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Every problem in the universe can be solved by finding the right long-haired prettyboy and beating the crap out of him.

Guest · Postby **Guest** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 2:57 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Kifle:
I eat beef/pork. Didn't you know that when they kill a cow for its beef they slit its throat at watch it choke to death on its own blood? But, I am pretty sure they might also bludgen them to death with a huge club, but i am not sure. Then we all make hamburgers and steaks, woohoo!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It depends on where you are. If you are in India or Pakistan and they are killing it in the "traditional" (halal) manner, then they do slit its throat, amoung other things (I believe, going off of 2nd hand information).

A good friend of mine used to work at a slaughterhouse. At US slaughterhouses, they use an air gun to the head. Kills them instantly. I can get more graphic, but sufficed to say, the cow has no idea what's going on.

TMI, I know. just making sure you have your facts straight.

Kuurg · Postby **Kuurg** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 6:04 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Ambar:
he was doing it for amusement .. didn't you guys read it at all?? he probably rapes old women and enjoys it too

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That guy's an actor, he's probably a communist sympathizer! McCarthy could've used some good people like you.

in all seriousness, stuff like this happens all the time. Look for it and you'll find it.

I wouldn't recommend jail time for this fellow, just lock him in a room with a few animal lovers armed with nerf bats - I'll bet they could make him scream.

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·•Kuurg•·

Zagaz · Postby **Zagaz** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 6:44 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Sarvis:


"On the planet Earth, man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much - the wheel, New York, wars and so on - while all along the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent that man - for precisely the same reasons."
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You forgot digital watches...where would civilization be without those wonderful devices?

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Those who desire to give up Freedom in order to gain Security, will not have, nor do they deserve, either one.

Kifle · Postby **Kifle** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 7:14 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Kiaransalee:
 It depends on where you are. If you are in India or Pakistan and they are killing it in the "traditional" (halal) manner, then they do slit its throat, amoung other things (I believe, going off of 2nd hand information).

A good friend of mine used to work at a slaughterhouse. At US slaughterhouses, they use an air gun to the head. Kills them instantly. I can get more graphic, but sufficed to say, the cow has no idea what's going on.

TMI, I know. just making sure you have your facts straight.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

They also slit the throat here in the US in a lot of slaughterhouses. It makes the meat more tender. There are also places that, until recently, clubed the poor bastards in the head.

I have my facts straight and dont pretend to know things i dont.

Just remember, It costs more to put this man who burned a kitten away in prison for a year than it would to feed that starving child for a year...yes, that man is sick, but as far as our government punishing him harsher than somebody that assaults my son? I dont think so...

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"Kill them all, God will know his own." -Domingo de Guzman, A.K.A Saint Dominic

Turxx · Postby **Turxx** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 7:15 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Kiaransalee:
 It depends on where you are. If you are in India or Pakistan and they are killing it in the "traditional" (halal) manner, then they do slit its throat, amoung other things (I believe, going off of 2nd hand information).

A good friend of mine used to work at a slaughterhouse. At US slaughterhouses, they use an air gun to the head. Kills them instantly. I can get more graphic, but sufficed to say, the cow has no idea what's going on.

TMI, I know. just making sure you have your facts straight.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

i believe when they slit the throat to kill them they also hang them upside down by their hind legs to allow all the blood to drain from the animal as it dies, it is to do with their religion and not eating blood, two of my brothers were butchers in a small butcher shop close to where im from, they also shot the animals in the head where they worked
and as for burning cats and dogs i believe the bigger cruelty is not putting an animal to sleep after injuries like that, tho there is no doubt if i were to ever witness someone buring live animals id prolly hurt them

Kuurg · Postby **Kuurg** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 7:22 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Turxx:

and as for burning cats and dogs i believe the bigger cruelty is not putting an animal to sleep after injuries like that<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So you think that poor ol' mike should've been put down?

http://www.miketheheadlesschicken.org/

big money to be had in freaks....big, BIG money.

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·•Kuurg•·

Ambar · Postby **Ambar** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 8:45 pm

where in this post has anyone said that animals are more important than humans??

the point is cruelty ...

you people who see nothing wrong with this have ISSUES

i dont recall this being a topic about humans but cruelty to animals.. am i wrong ... do you guys just need something to agrue about .. as usual???

IMHO this person deserves punishment, maybe working in an animal hospital closely supervised ... maybe shoveling shit for weeks on end??

in no way should he deserve a higher punishment than a person who harms PEOPLE ...i NEVER said that!! people who harm other people .. especially children and handicapped ... should be shot in a firing squad made of the families of those they hurt ... for rapists?? have them put in a cage full of viscious beasts, secured by their penis ... armed with a butcher knife .. wanna get out?? cut it off YOURSELF ...

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Ambar -= Beloved Matron =- Crimson Coalition

Elisten · Postby **Elisten** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 11:05 pm

Heh, note to self: So THIS is the reason many people stay away from the BBS.

Seriously? I did not post this topic with the intentions of starting a huge debate. I was just wanting to vent on one thing (admist many) that I have a problem with.

This was not the place, quite obviously. My apologies.

Cheerio!

Eli

[This message has been edited by Elisten (edited 07-23-2002).]

kiryan · Postby **kiryan** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 12:05 am

who's to say humans arent more important?

wanna bet that if i yanked the half dead kitten out of the BBQ and mashed its head in with the heel of my boot some person would try to put me in jail for animal cruelty too? Should it make a difference if i bragged, laughed, or made jokes about doing it?

when we are incarcerating folks for killing kittens they own, albeit in sick and twisted ways, i think we've gone way to far.

Ashiwi · Postby **Ashiwi** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 12:14 am

I have serious issues with people who think it's okay to cause pain and suffering for sport. I eat meat, I believe in hunting as long as you use what you kill. Torture for the sake of a thrill is sick and twisted, and if putting them in jail means I don't have that sick bastard next to my home around my children, then I'm all the better for it.

Drakkoth · Postby **Drakkoth** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 1:08 am

This is a depressing thread. The subject matter was bad enough, but then when people sympathize with the guilty party, I find myself getting irritated.

Anyone who doesn't think cruelty for cruelty's sake is wrong, and a crime, and should be a punishable offense is someone I'd rather see stuck in a barbeque, dying as he gets poked with a stick for amusement, than a kitten. A couple of you are in this thread and you know who you are.

Zungar · Postby **Zungar** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 1:11 am

Heres a solution for everyone.

Bar-b-q the kittens, and feed them to the starving children, then arrest the guy with the chef's hat. Problem solved.

Zungar "Meow Meow" Eye Gone

Sarvis · Postby **Sarvis** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 2:24 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Kifle:
 They also slit the throat here in the US in a lot of slaughterhouses. It makes the meat more tender. There are also places that, until recently, clubed the poor bastards in the head.

I have my facts straight and dont pretend to know things i dont.

Just remember, It costs more to put this man who burned a kitten away in prison for a year than it would to feed that starving child for a year...yes, that man is sick, but as far as our government punishing him harsher than somebody that assaults my son? I dont think so...

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah. I'm not a huge fan of our prison system. Something more like in Escape From L.A. would be nice. Just drop them off and forget about them... heh.

Kiryan: If they can do anything they want to anything they own, then does that mean he could grill his baby too?

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Every problem in the universe can be solved by finding the right long-haired prettyboy and beating the crap out of him.

kiryan · Postby **kiryan** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 5:01 am

baby = human being = different. ridiculous comparison.

and nice one drak, so its ok to dehumanize and talk about roasting a human being with different view points but its not ok to roast/torture a cat? justifying killing someone cuz they're animals right? only animals would engage in such behavior just like those jews. they not of the aryan race thats why we can kill them by the tens of thousands, do medical experiments on them and worse.

im scared of living next to you and your children! your just as sick as the guy burning kittens.

Kifle · Postby **Kifle** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 6:15 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Drakkoth:
This is a depressing thread. The subject matter was bad enough, but then when people sympathize with the guilty party, I find myself getting irritated.

Anyone who doesn't think cruelty for cruelty's sake is wrong, and a crime, and should be a punishable offense is someone I'd rather see stuck in a barbeque, dying as he gets poked with a stick for amusement, than a kitten. A couple of you are in this thread and you know who you are.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I am not sure if you are implying me in your thread, but I didnt sympathize with the crazy guy.

My point is that by imprisoning this guy, you are wasting my tax dollars. Put the guy on house arrest, make him do X amount of community service helping a vet clinic or something of the such, and make it ilegal for him to own or live with pets for the rest of his life? But imprisoning him is a waste of my cash and space for real criminals...that is all.

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"Kill them all, God will know his own." -Domingo de Guzman, A.K.A Saint Dominic

Ambar · Postby **Ambar** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 9:36 am

Panic! I am agreeing with Caz

time to see a shrink

*grin*

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Ambar -= Beloved Matron =- Crimson Coalition

Sarvis · Postby **Sarvis** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 1:26 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by kiryan:
baby = human being = different. ridiculous comparison.

and nice one drak, so its ok to dehumanize and talk about roasting a human being with different view points but its not ok to roast/torture a cat? justifying killing someone cuz they're animals right? only animals would engage in such behavior just like those jews. they not of the aryan race thats why we can kill them by the tens of thousands, do medical experiments on them and worse.

im scared of living next to you and your children! your just as sick as the guy burning kittens.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Different? Why?

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Every problem in the universe can be solved by finding the right long-haired prettyboy and beating the crap out of him.

Kuurg · Postby **Kuurg** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 3:11 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Drakkoth:
A couple of you are in this thread and you know who you are.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

yeah! so go stand in the corner and think about what you've done. Dissenting opinions will not be tolerated. We're god-fearing, animal-loving, hard-working members of our respective countries and we'll not stomach any of this claptrap.

Sounds like Drakkoth spent too much time at teacher's knee.

Conversations like this ineluctably result in all parties being in either one camp or the other as it's particularly difficult to remain neutral when discussing abuse. The vehemence with which some people can attack those with dissimilar views and the sins they saddle them with merely for disagreeing is staggering.

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·•Kuurg•·

Ashiwi · Postby **Ashiwi** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 3:21 pm

For everybody who thinks there's nothing wrong with that kind of behavior...

Would you allow somebody who got a thrill out of torturing and maiming creatures who were defenseless watch your children?

Drakkoth · Postby **Drakkoth** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 4:35 pm

Laugh. We have some quality people here.

And no, Kifle, I wasn't referring to you. Although I pay my fair share of taxes, and I'm not complaining about locking people like this up. I was mostly directing that at the people who just flat out think this is acceptable behavior, like Kiryan, who think it's simply an alternative viewpoint to condone the senseless suffering of any living thing.

If it was some poor family, and they caught a cat, chopped its head off, skinned it, and were barbequing it to feed little bits of cat meat to their kids, well whatever, fine.

But this was a case of torture for entertainment. Sure, you can enjoy it. You can say it's your alternative viewpoint to enjoy causing pain to living creatures and get upset with me for admonishing that. I do have to question the decision to actively argue the case in a public forum, but hey, party on.

Kuurg · Postby **Kuurg** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 4:52 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Ashiwi:


Would you allow somebody who got a thrill out of torturing and maiming creatures who were defenseless watch your children?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Elisten should be roasted on a spit for starting this thread.

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·•Kuurg•·

Corth · Postby **Corth** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 5:54 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Ashiwi:
For everybody who thinks there's nothing wrong with that kind of behavior...

Would you allow somebody who got a thrill out of torturing and maiming creatures who were defenseless watch your children?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I didn't see anybody say there is nothing wrong with this behavior. I saw people say that it shouldn't be punished by jail time. They're not debating the crime, they're debating the punishment.

Corth

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Goddamned slippery mage.

Ashiwi · Postby **Ashiwi** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 6:26 pm

Sigh. You're right Corth. I just can't help but find this behavior extremely disturbing, and it wrenches at my heart when I think that there are people who could stand around and watch something like this for fun, or even allow it to continue.

I've never been very fond of the human race, nor of the pain we cause to each other and the world around us. Perhaps I overreacted, but events like this make me want to stand up and scream at the top of my lungs that as a species humans don't deserve the earth we walk on. I fully believe that people who get pleasure out of acts like that are sick and twisted and missing some vital piece of their pshyche that keeps them from lashing out at the world and hurting everybody around them, and as such have a much greater potential for harming their friends and family. Do I think he should be punished for what he did? Oh yes, and harshly punished... he obviously has no other mechanisms to stop him from perpetrating such acts.

Kifle · Postby **Kifle** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 9:13 pm

Actually, gettin pleasure from others' pain is a fact of human existance. He obviously can't control his urges or isn't satiated by televison, so he needs psychiatric help. I would add that to my other list of punishments...only the mental help would be charged to him rather than the state. yeah, that would be a good punihment...

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"Kill them all, God will know his own." -Domingo de Guzman, A.K.A Saint Dominic

kiryan · Postby **kiryan** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 10:19 pm

drak i dont support it, but i dont think i need to be up in someone elses business over it, and i definitely dont think he needs to be going to jail or be roasted in a bbq. hes probably not a very responsible/respectable person, but he could be.

Grungar · Postby **Grungar** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 10:30 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Kifle:
Actually, gettin pleasure from others' pain is a fact of human existance.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's exactly why people laugh when someone falls down. These effects have been exploited in physical comedy for years. Physical comedy comes just above profanity on the Ladder O' Comedy. Also, it's not just physical pain that gets laughs. Embarrassing the hell out of someone is also good for a few chuckles here and there. I wonder what exactly it is in our psyche that makes us laugh at another's pain? We are sick, sick critters. That's why I wanted to be a dog when I grew up (I was 2 years old at the time). Plus I figured that if I became a dog, I'd grow a tail. And let's face it- tails are pretty damn cool.

- Grungar "Shiny happy people" Forgefire

Drakkoth · Postby **Drakkoth** » Wed Jul 24, 2002 10:54 pm

Lol. You think he might be responsible/respectable?? Wow. I truly have nothing left to say, so I guess we're going to just have to agree to disagree on this one. Salute.

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