Reloading zones / static world / reboots

[kiryan]

I know this has been talked about before, but I don't see why we dont ressurect the conversation. Also, lets not talk about technical problems (code, mud architecture, memory, code / mud speed) as technical problems can be overcome in many ways, but a bad idea can only be fixed with good ideas.

I know that someone (Lloth or Mystra) was discussing a static world a long time ago. A static world is basically a world where even after reboots everything looks the same. For example, player dropped equipment (yes even rations) are still where you dropped them after a reboot. A mob you just killed has still just been killed rather than magically reincarnated. I'm initially not advocating a static world, but the ability to reload zones. This ability could lend itself to a the realization of a static world some day.

Some starting points for discussion. notice i didnt label anything pros and cons since that can vary depending on your world view. please be considerate of other peoples perspectives. Basically, less reboots means more different zones get done. Some people (especially builder gods) think that people need more variety while some people only want to do zones they know or with the same risk/reward as Jot.

zone reloading:
1. wouldn't have to reboot the mud to reload zones
2. partially unties the frequency of zoning (and flow of equipment into the game) from reboots / crash reboots. (we'd have to implement zones not loading after reboots to totally untie the two)
3. adds versatility to the gods control of the game

considerations:
1. what is the appropriate rate of eq flowing into the game, how does eq inflow affect the value of eq and the player experience.
2. how is the timing for zones repopulating going to affect players.
3. how is zone repopping going to affect what zones are done
4. new issues in zone ownership and camping zones/mobs (lets not repeat the mistakes of evercamp)


Alternatives to reloading zones.
1. do nothing
2. have regular reboots

[This message has been edited by kiryan (edited 09-05-2001).]

[This message has been edited by kiryan (edited 09-05-2001).]

[Dirjornso]

I like that idea

[Kiloppile]

This the kiryan from Veeshan?

[kiryan]

On should we write Zone reloading code:
I can't see any negatives to being able to reload zones. It gives the gods an ability to fine tune an in progress boot. They could reload zones without having a direct impact on mortals. example, in a recent case the mud was purportedly rebooted to repopulate zones while a group was in jot. Group got spanked and this had significant negative effects in that some players/gods lost time and relationships were damaged by conditions under the control of a person. Another prime example could be some person is working on a quest or exploring and would be interrupted or set back because of a reboot. Should the whole mud or a even a few people have to wait for that person to finish his quest or exploring? Would it be fair in the reverse? Mud rebooted for someone to do a quest while everyone is off zoning?

[kiryan]

On Alternatives to reloading zones:
1. do nothing
2. have regular reboots

I think choosing one of these solutions (especially choosing in a mutually exclusive way) is a bad thing. Do nothing isn't proactive and leaves the game to be affected by uncontrolled methods such as "crash bugs," coders eliminating (or introducing) bugs. Also, since reboots directly affects the inflow of eq, we would not be controlling this variable. Scheduling reboots can partially control the eq inflow, but creates hyper activity just after reboots. This is probably also the time when the most people get into fights. But, on the pro, at least the players can plan and schedule so that they are personally not overly affected in a negative manner.

On the other hand, reloading zones allows the gods to directly affect player enjoyment by loading zones the players want to adventure in (and eq inflow, but only in a player positive way) without directly affecting other people.

I'd be more in favor of a random zone timer as to eliminate the necessity of god intervention and better control the eq inflow rate (hell, you could even setup a knob to tune it on a world or zone level).

[This message has been edited by kiryan (edited 09-05-2001).]

[This message has been edited by kiryan (edited 09-05-2001).]

[kiryan]

considerations:
2. how is the timing for zones repopulating going to affect players.
4. new issues in zone ownership and camping zones/mobs (lets not repeat the mistakes of evercamp)

Probably the initial major concerns is zone/mob camping / ownership (i hate zone camping, ask any Everquest player about camping...). If zones are manually reloaded, we must also consider the politics that will surely ensue... x god reloaded y zone for z person. Reload y for me. Hey y zone was reloaded for my group, you guys stole our zone. Hey I've been waiting here 5 hours for this zone to repop so I claim it.

Your still going to have to address the camping/ownership issue with automatic randomly timed repops, however you can probably eliminate the politics by establishing a policy eliminating any assumed rights. Use standard mud policy first group assembled and adequate to do the zone irrespective of who was there first (for 5 minutes or 5 hours).

Also you leaders note you can eliminate a lot of problems by being considerate of other people... invite them into your group, leave the zone, ect... Society doesn't have to be based on rules, but humans are either too stupid, too greedy, or too inconsiderate to realize that. Think about some of the best leaders we've had. They usually didn't need gods to intervene and solve their disputes.


[This message has been edited by kiryan (edited 09-05-2001).]

[kiryan]

considerations:
1. what is the appropriate rate of eq flowing into the game, how does eq inflow affect the value of eq and the player experience.

Hmmm, I don't even know where to begin on this subject. Lots of people like the after wipe experience of starting from scratch. Lots of people like the look what i have that you don't have. Lots of people like to make a zillion characters and equip them well. Eq inflow rate has an affect on each of these types, and the biggest problem we have is each gamer's type is somewhat mutually exclusive of the others. I don't think you can force each player to enjoy a certain type of game play.

On controlling eq inflow/outflow. There is not a good way to implement voluntary removal of equipment in the game except through questing (and questing lends itself to escalation). By voluntary I mean as opposed to game controlled removal like eq detoriation over time, desctruction as a result of fire/acid, being charged to rent, and non player theft.

I dont think the game balance issue of escalation in the high end game comes into play here unless you decide its necessary to remove eq from the game through questing (why would a player turn in a valuable piece of eq in a quest for something not valuable?). Assuming eq is balanced, well just have to rely on the gods to keep it that way, does it really matter if you have 1 twilight or 100 twilights? you can only use one at a time.

On the low end, eq proliferation will result in twinks and the general trivilization of low level encounters. I'm going to have to say that if your worried about low level twinking/escalation, you make that choice personally and don't attack others if they decide to power level their alts or friends). This may make for some really stupid high level players that never learned how to play the low end game, but everyone knows the pre 40 and post 40 games are entirely different. You still got to teach them how to play the high end game.

[kiryan]

considerations:
3. how is zone repopping going to affect what zones are done

Sojourn has a ton of great zones, and even in the old days you could do some challenging zones after 20 hours. I will look on any statements that there is nothing to do after 20 or 30 or 40 hours of up time with extreme disdain. There may be nothing you want to do or feel comfortable trying, but there is always something to do on sojourn.

Having said that, most of us want to do zones with the best risk/reward. If tiamat dropped jot eq, it would rarely or never be done. if pods started dropping tiamat eq, pods would be done every boot. Players are going to do the zones with the best risk vs reward first, then the zones where they need a speciality piece of eq, and then go from there.

If zones repopulate often (via reboot or reload) players will probably wait for the next boot or zone reload rather than trying a new zone. If players don't know when the next zone repop is and/or may have to go extended periods of time without doing the favorite zones, they may be more inclined to try out new zones, quests, skills, ect...

[kiryan]

ya this is the kiryan from veeshan.

i played Doji the paladin (who you wouldnt know because paladins couldnt group with evils and dragonbone ruled), avial the sorc (who you wouldnt know because he was caged for 9 months *hugs sok* and released shortly before pwipe), Sisserr the snake enchanter (who you wouldnt know because he was only 38 or so when soj went down the most recent time) and a variety of chars in their 20s and 30s including human necro, troll warrior, squid, barb shaman, gnome conjurer).

Heh, lets see if i have more luck this time around.