new ranger idea

Archive of the Sojourn3 Ideas Forum.
amolol
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new ranger idea

Postby amolol » Tue Nov 26, 2002 9:01 am

im a big fan of rangers as you all know... and i had a few ideas that might make the more aplicable to the realm of sojourn ideas follow as thus

1) move cure critic to 6th circle/move bark to 7th
this is for a few reasons moastly because i would like to see ist consistant (2nd circle cure light 4th cure serious) second because it would make ranger soloing alot esier (rnagers typicly solo from bout 30-40) and it would make us more helpfull in groups

2)give rangers a summon mount skill so that we could actually put some our mounted combat skills towork rather than having it just take up room on our skill lists

3)if not summon mount then give us a pet or somthing at like lvl 25ish...soloing is hard enough

4)i think that the ranger spell slots should be evaualted to be more eficient note (my ranger is lvl 33) i can only mem 2 6th circle spells even though i can mem 2 7th circle spells...ive played other casters and i havent seen this before mebbe there is a reason for this if so plz correct me.

im shure some if not all of this has been broght upo in previous conversations im not suggesting this to over power rogues or move some other class out of its place... im suggesting this to make rangers funner to play and a little more aplicable to the mud instead of having a bunch or rangers just sitting around playing strip poker at 3w waiting for somone to die so they can make fun of them....

say full house off with the helmet teflor...

teflor says 'bummer'

beern enters from the east

say omg beern thats like the 5th time in half an hour dont you think its time to quit?

you 'say omg beern thats like the 5th time in half an hour dont you think its time to quit?'
amolol
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Postby amolol » Tue Nov 26, 2002 9:04 am

c 'flame shield' self

casting flame shield ********************************************
Ashiwi
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Postby Ashiwi » Tue Nov 26, 2002 2:35 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by amolol:
<B>3)if not summon mount then give us a pet or somthing at like lvl 25ish...soloing is hard enough
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh yes, me too please! I want a pet, a great big, narsty pet which will do my bidding just like those casters have!

Oh, wait... that's what I've got Lorgan for.
Zen
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Postby Zen » Tue Nov 26, 2002 3:04 pm

...

-Lorgan

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The Lord of the Iron Wastes holds his hammer high in the air, shouting a torment... 'Weak fools!'
Sylvos
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Postby Sylvos » Tue Nov 26, 2002 4:08 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by amolol:
<B>im a big fan of rangers as you all know... and i had a few ideas that might make the more aplicable to the realm of sojourn ideas follow as thus

1) move cure critic to 6th circle/move bark to 7th
this is for a few reasons moastly because i would like to see ist consistant (2nd circle cure light 4th cure serious) second because it would make ranger soloing alot esier (rnagers typicly solo from bout 30-40) and it would make us more helpfull in groups
</B>

While yes, it would be more consistent moving barkskin to a later circle will, in the long term, harm ranger solo and tanking work through the levels. Think about what is more valuable - being able to heal 30pts with a spell or getting that vital 20+ ac that stacks with armor potions. You can rest to heal... can't rest for armor class.

<B>
2)give rangers a summon mount skill so that we could actually put some our mounted combat skills towork rather than having it just take up room on our skill lists
</B>

Sadly, ranger mounted combat skill will cap at 20, and notches slower than your xp increases in a Mori group. In addition, with the low skill cap you can never use a bow, or pick up a fumbled weapon without getting dismounted so using this skill really doesn't help. Tame was supposed to provide us with the means to obtain mounts... sadly it was basically taken away due to abuse of said tamed mounts. Image

<B>
3)if not summon mount then give us a pet or somthing at like lvl 25ish...soloing is hard enough
</B>

Rangers are one of the better solo'ing classes, as long as you are patient, fight in wilderness and use tactics. Aside from a woodland companion, which has been requested and shot down multiple times, the Ranger class is not a pet class. As Ashiwi said, the best pet for a hitter is a big warrior to hide behind and shoot out from between their legs or something.

<B>
4)i think that the ranger spell slots should be evaualted to be more eficient note (my ranger is lvl 33) i can only mem 2 6th circle spells even though i can mem 2 7th circle spells...ive played other casters and i havent seen this before mebbe there is a reason for this if so plz correct me.
</B>

Rangers are partial spell-casters, and as such receive a much slower progression of spells. At level 50, I get 6 1st, 5 2nd, 5 3rd, 5 4th, 4 5th, 4 6th, 3 7th, 3 8th, 3 9th and 2 10th. In contrast, a level 47 full spellcaster has something like 11 1st, 10 2nd, etc etc. We're not meant to have a lot of spells to work with, and on the whole they do balance out eventually. Hang in there Image

<B>
im shure some if not all of this has been broght upo in previous conversations im not suggesting this to over power rogues or move some other class out of its place... im suggesting this to make rangers funner to play and a little more aplicable to the mud instead of having a bunch or rangers just sitting around playing strip poker at 3w waiting for somone to die so they can make fun of them....
</B>

Sadly, the issue isn't making rangers more applicable to the mud. The downside is the imbalance between melee and spell damage, which has been discussed in numerous threads on this board. Your ideas aren't bad ideas at all, and I hope that I've come across more explanatory than condescending... I've been told I sound like I"m talking down at people sometimes. Sorry if it happened again Image

I hope that some day melee can get worked back into the mechanics of more than a handful of fights again. Until that day, I'll keep exploring the mud, poking about quests and puzzling over why one of the best traveling classes sit at the FS board instead of traveling Image

-Sylvos
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
amolol
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Postby amolol » Tue Nov 26, 2002 6:43 pm

i do appreciate the other side of the argument...few things idd like to add now that i have som input...why not just take tame mmount off the list... it doesnt realy work anyway....qith regaurds to the barkskin issue its not hard to get the extra 20 ac (bark/armor potions or other ac gear)moast rangers have decent ac by the time they hit 20 in regards to the pet i didnt think it would go over towell but it was a thought as for the healing spells im still gonna push that issue because in my veiw it would be more eficiant to have it that way and it really wouldnt pout any other class out of a job i do understand that rangers are only partial casters and partial fighters but people dont play them for both......i would like to have more feed back and i will continue to comment on such issues despite what people say...as i noticed in a previous string most people that down talk ranger upgrades and changes are rogues...i dont jknow what it is mebbe rogues do this to preserve there usefullness...rangers can and will never replace rogues its just not possible what rangers have in luck spells and weapon andvantages rogues make up in pure skill....rogue= +max_skill
old depok
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Postby old depok » Wed Nov 27, 2002 1:34 pm

As Sylvos points out the issue is not how do you make Rangers better/more useful? The issue is how do you make ALL physical damage classes more useful?

Rogues are in almost the same boat as Rangers. Only thing keeping them from sitting at 3 w is hide/sneak and pick lock/remove trap. Even the hide/sneak function that rogues play is being replaced buy other classes (illusionist, druid) who can use similar skills.

We now have only one rogue guilded and she is working on leveling an enchanter. What it shows is that the fun of playing a rogue and the usefulness of the class has really fallen off the charts.

I am not surprised that given all of the above you are advocating for making Rangers more of a casting class. :>)

Depok
Ashiwi
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Postby Ashiwi » Wed Nov 27, 2002 3:12 pm

Wait, wait, wait! I'm working on a chanter, but not because my rogue has ceased to be fun. My rogue is my first love and I'd rather play her than anything, I'm only working on the chanter because I'm really sick of trying to put together a group and never having one available. It's nice to be able to use elementalists for wards instead of globes, but available scales would be nice, and if that means ::groan:: leveling a chanter so my guild can have one when the others are off-line, then so be it.

I really can't stand playing my little chanter anymore... and to think I enjoyed it once.

Ashiwi - rogue to the death ... again, and again, and again.
Dalar
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Postby Dalar » Wed Nov 27, 2002 4:18 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Ashiwi:
<B>Wait, wait, wait! I'm working on a chanter, but not because my rogue has ceased to be fun. My rogue is my first love and I'd rather play her than anything, I'm only working on the chanter because I'm really sick of trying to put together a group and never having one available. It's nice to be able to use elementalists for wards instead of globes, but available scales would be nice, and if that means ::groan:: leveling a chanter so my guild can have one when the others are off-line, then so be it.

I really can't stand playing my little chanter anymore... and to think I enjoyed it once.

Ashiwi - rogue to the death ... again, and again, and again.</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

you just haven't found the right exp groups *wink*

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Nokie group-says 'what a rip-off, I spend months incapacitating navy seamen and doing 28,000 bandages and now we get tons of practice here in bronze citadel'
old depok
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Postby old depok » Wed Nov 27, 2002 7:24 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Ashiwi:
<B>Wait, wait, wait! I'm working on a chanter, but not because my rogue has ceased to be fun. My rogue is my first love and I'd rather play her than anything, I'm only working on the chanter because I'm really sick of trying to put together a group and never having one available. It's nice to be able to use elementalists for wards instead of globes, but available scales would be nice, and if that means ::groan:: leveling a chanter so my guild can have one when the others are off-line, then so be it.

I really can't stand playing my little chanter anymore... and to think I enjoyed it once.

Ashiwi - rogue to the death ... again, and again, and again.</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Bah you ruined my nice arguement with the TRUTH! Grumble.
amolol
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Postby amolol » Mon Dec 09, 2002 6:02 pm

rogues get skills that increase there mele damage like backstab for instance witch is a nice skill rangers will never out damage a rogue in mele are only advantage is the bow and thats goin out the window with rogue archery... all im saying is rangers could be alot more usefull if these changes were implemented rogues could use some help in damage but there isnt a whole lot you can do for them... its not that im against rogues or anything its just that as sits rangers and bards are the weakest classes on the mud..if i played a bard i be arguing that to.
Sylvos
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Postby Sylvos » Mon Dec 09, 2002 6:21 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by amolol:
rogues get skills that increase there mele damage like backstab for instance witch is a nice skill rangers will never out damage a rogue in mele are only advantage is the bow and thats goin out the window with rogue archery... all im saying is rangers could be alot more usefull if these changes were implemented rogues could use some help in damage but there isnt a whole lot you can do for them... its not that im against rogues or anything its just that as sits rangers and bards are the weakest classes on the mud..if i played a bard i be arguing that to.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Rogues cannot use archery. The fact that they could was a bug that has been fixed. None of what you suggested will improve the functionality of the ranger class aside from some solo ability. It will not alter the fact that in most of the zones, a nature specialized melee class is obsolete, and can readily be replaced by another class/character.

Archery would be much more viable if arrows behaved as intended and were able to do some damage through missile shield. Archery allows the ranger to do damage without having to worry about mod defensive skills, which are a large factor in why melee is obsolete. When that singular bug is dealt with, then I'd say it's time to take a look at ranger damage and usefullness. Until that time however, adding anything else would be silly.

When a wagon breaks an axle, you don't add another axle and leave the broken one there. You fix the busted one.

Sylvos
Chandigar2
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Postby Chandigar2 » Mon Dec 09, 2002 8:30 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by old depok:
<B>Rogues are in almost the same boat as Rangers. Only thing keeping them from sitting at 3 w is hide/sneak and pick lock/remove trap. Even the hide/sneak function that rogues play is being replaced buy other classes (illusionist, druid) who can use similar skills.
Depok</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Argh, ok, not to hijack the thread on rangers here, but it irks me that everyone is thinking that illusionists are taking over the hide/sneak thing. Only *2* illusionists can sneak, and thats because of Tia items. The rest of us CAN'T.

I just want this to be clear before illusionists get downgraded because 2 of us have a piece of nice eq.

Well, you can argue that hide is now downgraded because you can't cast it in combat anymore, proving my point. :P
Keran
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Postby Keran » Mon Dec 09, 2002 8:41 pm

Sylvos and Ashiwi,

You guys can shoot out from between my legs anytime.

Toarn

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You shout 'You are no match for elemental Toarn!'
Toarn is dead! R.I.P.
Erevan responds to your petition with 'I don't think they heard you.'
Kifle
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Postby Kifle » Tue Dec 10, 2002 7:47 am

That sounds wrong in so many ways.

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Fotex group-says 'Behold! penis!'

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Nitupopple group-says 'esrel get glorishan off'
combatmedic
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Postby combatmedic » Tue Dec 10, 2002 8:23 am

Kifle,

You can poke from between Keran's legs anytime! Image

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"If it ain't broke, fix it until it is"

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Aram the novice paly.

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