FFXI

Archived discussion from Toril-2.
Dalar
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FFXI

Postby Dalar » Thu Oct 30, 2003 8:56 pm

Anyone else playing?
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.
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Postby Treladian » Thu Oct 30, 2003 9:25 pm

http://www.penny-arcade.com/view.php3?date=2003-10-29

Square also has a horrendous track record with character/class balance. Aside from possibly FF1, I can't think of any FF game I've played that didn't have characters that felt useless or jobs/job combos that could blow everything else out of the water.
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Postby Dalar » Thu Oct 30, 2003 9:37 pm

I agree with the character balance crap. I'll have to see in FFonline. The comic is flawed because you can reroll until you hit the right server.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby Dalar » Thu Oct 30, 2003 11:15 pm

Jesus, after 5 discs to install playonline and FFXI and the expansion, then 10 minutes to register, then the program checking if all 7023 files are correct, i have to download 1293 files which will take me another hour. this game better be worth it
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Thu Oct 30, 2003 11:31 pm

It's not. I was part of the beta.
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Postby rylan » Thu Oct 30, 2003 11:56 pm

When it looked like they were going for the online multiplayer pay as you go crap I gave up on the FF series. Unfortunately Square has chopped parts of the game for the US release in the past several FF (in particular FF7), and I have no doubt the same thing happend for this. I still think FF2 was the coolest one.
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Postby Dalar » Fri Oct 31, 2003 12:29 am

FF3 American > FF2 American
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby rylan » Fri Oct 31, 2003 2:04 am

ff3 was cool also, but there was something about the ff2 that I found better. ff3 was more of a challange though :)
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Postby Sarvis » Fri Oct 31, 2003 2:19 am

FF3/6J was by far the best. FFX comes pretty damn close though. ;)

I think only FFXI is going to be online Rylan, FFXII is going to be a regular FF game.

Trel:

They made pretty much every character useful in FFX. Kimhari was the tricky one though, since you could easily screw him up if you didn't know what you were doing with the grid.

I probably won't be playing FFXI. I'm curious about it, but I'm just not willing to pay a monthly fee to play games. If I want the MMORPG experience I'll play here... heh.
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Fri Oct 31, 2003 6:10 am

Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children.

They're remaking ff7 for the ps2. I hope to god they put in all the cut out parts. and they're also going to include a dvd movie with it, that's a sequel to ff7, and from what i've seen of the movie it looks just plain uber.
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Postby Sarvis » Fri Oct 31, 2003 10:01 am

Really!?! I heard about the movie, and it did look awesome... didn't know they were remaking the game though.

Where can I get more specifics?
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Fri Oct 31, 2003 10:11 am

Hrm. I could have sworn I had read about it. But I can't find the info on it now. I could be completely wrong, but I swear I heard they were redoing it.
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Postby Sarvis » Fri Oct 31, 2003 12:12 pm

Apparently my roomate had already heard about this also. So it's not you just imagining it. I guess they are remaking 7, 8 and 9 onto DVD's for the PS2... which is awesome!
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Postby Dalar » Fri Oct 31, 2003 3:33 pm

got a link to the movie? too lazy to find it
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby Ihazim » Fri Oct 31, 2003 3:46 pm

http://www.squareamp.com/index.php

i found ff7 - 2 news somewhere on this site, they have page dedicated to it somewhere. But now it seems hard to find! Anyhow, what i read was that its ff7-2 the dvd movie. something about because of the backwards compatability with ps1 and ps2 gave square less incentive to remake the title.
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Postby othelil » Fri Oct 31, 2003 4:06 pm

Dalar wrote:The comic is flawed because you can reroll until you hit the right server.


I'm not playing FFXI and don't know much about it, but I still think the comic is right on because of what my sister told me. A friend bought the game for her so she could play with him and he spent ~3 hours trying to land on the server his friend was on and she's spent over 2 hours trying to land on that server also.

It may be possible, but no one should have to spend hours rerolling characters just to get on the servers their friends are on. That was just stupid on Square's part. There's got to be a way to let people pick their server's without blucking things up. Maybe the item shouldn't cost anything, so all you have to do is have a friend on that server?
Despite the high cost of living it remains popular.
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Postby Dalar » Fri Oct 31, 2003 8:02 pm

well it depends which server your friends are on. If they're on fairy or midgardromyr it's fucking tough. i touched the other 25 servers in 2 hours of rolling. I'm on seraph now which is one of the newer servers if anyone wants a world pass
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby Gormal » Sun Nov 02, 2003 6:35 pm

Best FF was 2 (American). I think that the worst was IX followed by X, (sorry I just didn't like X). X2 looks too lame to buy.

I'm personally praying that CC or XII can pull the series out of its slump. (FFTA is okay but nowhere near as good as the original.)
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Sun Nov 02, 2003 7:43 pm

Agreed. X was utter tripe. Hated the ending, and the majority of the game. Just bought FFTA actually it seems, hrm, weird. I played the original FFT, thought it was great. I'll probably pickup X2, simply because im a junkie and do that.

I actually liked FFIX. Only thing I didn't like is it had no staying power. It didn't really leave any memory of the ending and what not like most of the others. Zero replay value for me, I didn't want to play it over again to do stuff I missed. I thought Vivi was cool. But anywho. CC is gonna be totally different, not sure if you can really compare it to the others, as for 12, i've been waiting for 12 since I heard about them working on X. Hope its good.
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Postby Gerad » Mon Nov 03, 2003 5:17 am

The best Final Fantasy game was BY FAR 3 (american).
In fact I would go so far as to rate that as my favorite RPG of all time.
Who doesnt love tunneling castles and moogles?!?!

But as far as 11 goes, I am currently "homeless" i.e. I dont have a game that I am currently pouring hours into, and Im not interested in that.

I AGREE with P.A., I have like 4 or 5 RL friends and my WHOLE planetside outfit (rebel nation soldiers) thats going to play that game, but if I cant play with them, why even bother?

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Postby Sarvis » Mon Nov 03, 2003 8:18 am

Gormal wrote:Best FF was 2 (American). I think that the worst was IX followed by X, (sorry I just didn't like X). X2 looks too lame to buy.

I'm personally praying that CC or XII can pull the series out of its slump. (FFTA is okay but nowhere near as good as the original.)


No, the worst was 8.

For some reason 9 was either loved or hated by everyone who played it, nothing in between that I've ever seen. That's usually the mark of quality.

I'll probably grab X2, since I'm a huge addict of the series... but they ripped out some of the best parts of X like the sphere grid.
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Postby Gormal » Mon Nov 03, 2003 4:40 pm

VIII had a great storyline. I enjoyed it a lot.
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Postby Sarvis » Mon Nov 03, 2003 7:30 pm

Sure it did, if you like cheesy soap operas... ;)
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Postby Sarvis » Mon Nov 03, 2003 7:31 pm

Sure it did, if you like cheesy soap operas... ;)
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Postby Sarvis » Mon Nov 03, 2003 7:40 pm

Sure it did, if you like cheesy soap operas... ;)
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Postby Alomlim » Mon Nov 03, 2003 8:22 pm

OMG quit reminiscing already :) I picked this game up this weekend, and it's good fun so far... i'm only about 6 levels into it, but I'm having fun, and there's craploads of quests, missions, stuff to do.

I do miss speedwalks.
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Postby Alomlim » Mon Nov 03, 2003 8:22 pm

OMG quit reminiscing already :) I picked this game up this weekend, and it's good fun so far... i'm only about 6 levels into it, but I'm having fun, and there's craploads of quests, missions, stuff to do.

I do miss speedwalks.
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Postby Gormal » Mon Nov 03, 2003 10:32 pm

Who's reminiscing? I'm currently playing at least 6 different FFs on one level or another.
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Postby Dalar » Tue Nov 04, 2003 9:31 pm

Alomlim wrote:OMG quit reminiscing already :) I picked this game up this weekend, and it's good fun so far... i'm only about 6 levels into it, but I'm having fun, and there's craploads of quests, missions, stuff to do.

I do miss speedwalks.


what server you on?
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby Ragorn » Wed Nov 05, 2003 12:02 pm

Copy and pasting the review I wrote on Sigil's forum.

I really like the PlayOnline server interface. Yes, it takes 10 minutes to log in. Yes, it takes 10 minutes to log out. But the interface is excellent if Square/Enix plans on producing more POL-based games. The only thing I didn't like is the arbitrary assignment of user names. Mine is WBBO0360. I could choose an email address, but the user name was server-selected, and I didn't like that.

Right now, the POL server is basically a gateway in and out of FFXI and Tetra Master, but I can see in the future where it might become a staple application I stay logged into, like AIM.

In an attempt to stay positive, let me list the highlights of FFXI first:

- Stunning visuals. The graphics are simply top-notch. The world is beautifully rendered, water effects are simple and elegant, and visual spell representations are done flawlessly. There's simply nothing to hate in the visual presentation of the game. I don't even have to turn all of the shadows and vector effects off to maintain a decent frame rate, the way I had to in AO and Planetside.

- Simple character generation. Very painless, very quick. Absolutely nothing you can do that will hopelessly cripple your character later on. Pick a race, pick a class, pick an appearance, play the game. The class structure is a very effective combination of previous FF themes. The job-based system showcases the very intuitive system from FFVj and FF:Tactics, while the basic classes spark the nostalgia of being the basic six classes available in FF1.

- Inclusion of the expansion with the game. No need to run out and buy the $30 expansion pack, the first Japanese expansion comes in the box, along with Tetra Master. TM is a neat side perk.

- Virtually no lag. Yes, you heard it here, I've only ever lagged once and it was my own ISP's fault. The server could be six feet or six thousand miles away, I have no idea and no reason to wonder.

- No bugs. Haven't gotten stuck anywhere yet. Haven't died unfairly, haven't lost money or equipment to bugs. Seems very stable.

- Simplistic interface. FFXI is designed to be played with a PS2 controller, so the menu navigation is necessarily simple.

- Powerful macro system. Set up macros to use emotes, activate abilities, follow other players, and more. Setting macros is quick and painless.

- No kill stealing. Once a mob is hit, it's claimed until dead or the player calls for help. Never have to worry about your mob being KSed or ninjalooted. Items are looted automatically from corpses.

- Lots of quests. Many of the quests (not missions) are very standard "farm mobs and bring me the drops" quests, but at least they're present. The quest/mission tracking system is very easy, and can remind you of things you're supposed to be doing.

Final Fantasy XI plays like a Final Fantasy game, not a MMOG. I can easily see how a fan of the series who has never paid a monthly fee in his life can jump right into FFXI and feel right at home. The learning curve isn't so steep that a consoler will feel lost from the start, and the game is complex enough that longtime MMOGgers can get engaged without being bored. But now, unfortunately, the problems inherent in the game:

- Server selection and world passes. I can't play with my friends without tricking the system? Stupid. Yes, you can try to reroll until you hit the right server, but it takes forever and seriously hampers your excitement to play. And if your friends are on an above-average load server, it won't be included in the random rotation for new characters. If you want to get onto a popular server, you need a world pass and that's that. If you don't have any friends already playing, it won't matter for you.

- VERY difficult to fight at low levels. As a Mithra Warrior, I was already being beaten to the ground by even-level mobs by level 5. When the game says "this will be an even fight," it really means it... you really do have a 50% chance of dying. Unfortunately, there are no town guards that assist players with difficult mobs. If you tick off the wrong mob, you're just dead, as it will chase you all over the massive world until it kills you. Yes, you can zone away, but on the world map, zones are few and far between.

Crawlers, one of the newbie mob types, can poison you. Poison ticks your hit points down and can bring you to 0. Several times, I've ended a fight with 35/101 hit points and died to poison. You can't rest to regain hp while poisoned, nor can you log out. You just die from it unless you can make it to a shop or a white wizard is nearby to heal you. If you get poisoned, you die. If an aggro or assisting mob spawns near where you're fighting, you die. If you start a fight without /conning each and every mob, you might die, as mobs of the same type can vary in level drastically. Finally, and possibly most spitefully, you can only increase your weapon skills when fighting mobs your level or higher. I haven't notched my sword skill in three days, since I can't survive a fight with a mob my own level.

- Death is unmerciful. You lose experience, plain and simple. Yes, you can lose a level from death. No exp vaults, no exp recovery, nothing like that. You just lose it. And you lose a healthy chunk of it. Oof. (Toril players are used to this sort of thing, however)

- Baffling controls. As someone else said, the reference card that comes with the game indicates keys to activate various commands. It doesn't tell you that these are ctrl-keys. Most keys are not configurable. Even movement is frustrating until you figure out to put the game into "compact keyboard" mode, which allows you to move with WASD instead of opening the chat window.

- One character per account. Yes, one. Unless, of course, you pay for more. I don't even know what the rate is, I couldn't find a simple chart or explanation. But you get one character per Content ID, and Content IDs are billed seperately.

- Alt-tab disabled. I like to read the web while I heal or wait for things to happen. Alt-tabbing isn't actually disabled, it simply crashes the game and boots you out to the PlayOnline interface. Don't hit your windows key, folks.

- All equipment is level restricted. Super-lame, since I have about a thousand Gil and all of the weapons and armor available for purchase are over my level. This only adds to the difficulty of combat, since you can't scrimp and save for better equipment to help you kill mobs. You only gain power by gaining levels.

- Insanely expensive items. Want to stock up on antidote to keep from dying of poison? They're 325 Gil each. Compare that to the 14 Gil you get from selling a common item drop, and you can quickly see why poison is a big deal. Buying expendable medical items is not an option at low levels.

- Low mob spawn rate. Be prepared to wander around for several minutes before finding a mob of the appropriate level to kill that isn't already being attacked. I hear this gets easier as you level up, but the newbie zones are understandably swamped right now.

- No reward for missions (not quests). I completed the first mission... visited some mobs in town, ran out to a tower (without directions), talked to a mob, watched some cut scenes, came back... and got no experience, no gil, and no items for it. Only "rank points," the purpose of which is not readily apparently to the level 5 player. I tried the second mission, but after dying 3 or 4 times to groups of aggro, assisting mobs, I called it quits until I could find a group.

Here is my FFXI experience as a whole: Log in, leave town. Begin the search for a mob I can kill. Find a mob several levels below me, kill it for 25/1700 experience and no Gil. Maybe get an item drop I can sell for 10. Search for another mob. Find one my level, walk past it. Find one a level lower than me, fight it, win at 20 hit points, spend 2 minutes resting. Repeat for half an hour or so, and accumulate a few hundred exp. Forget to /check a mob of the same type I've been killing all day, fight it, find out it's my level, die. Lose all experience I've gained in the last half an hour. Walk out again. Find a mob a level lower than me. Fight it, get poisoned, win at 20 hit points, die anyway. Walk out again. Fight for an hour. Start attacking a mob, another mob spawns nearby and assists, die again, lose all progress. Accept mission, run across map for 10 minutes, enter dungeon. Two aggro mobs in the hallway, one sees me, other assists. Die trying to frantically run to entrance to dungeon. Spend 3 hours playing, get frustrated, log out with less experience than I started with.

If you're not a fan of MMORPGs already, FFXI isn't the one for you to start on.
- Ragorn
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Postby Daz » Wed Nov 05, 2003 1:35 pm

as a daoc lover and everquest hater - im tempted to give it a shot
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Postby Dalar » Wed Nov 05, 2003 7:11 pm

Ragorn wrote:Final Fantasy XI plays like a Final Fantasy game, not a MMOG. I can easily see how a fan of the series who has never paid a monthly fee in his life can jump right into FFXI and feel right at home. The learning curve isn't so steep that a consoler will feel lost from the start, and the game is complex enough that longtime MMOGgers can get engaged without being bored. But now, unfortunately, the problems inherent in the game:

- Server selection and world passes. I can't play with my friends without tricking the system? Stupid. Yes, you can try to reroll until you hit the right server, but it takes forever and seriously hampers your excitement to play. And if your friends are on an above-average load server, it won't be included in the random rotation for new characters. If you want to get onto a popular server, you need a world pass and that's that. If you don't have any friends already playing, it won't matter for you.

- VERY difficult to fight at low levels. As a Mithra Warrior, I was already being beaten to the ground by even-level mobs by level 5. When the game says "this will be an even fight," it really means it... you really do have a 50% chance of dying. Unfortunately, there are no town guards that assist players with difficult mobs. If you tick off the wrong mob, you're just dead, as it will chase you all over the massive world until it kills you. Yes, you can zone away, but on the world map, zones are few and far between.

Crawlers, one of the newbie mob types, can poison you. Poison ticks your hit points down and can bring you to 0. Several times, I've ended a fight with 35/101 hit points and died to poison. You can't rest to regain hp while poisoned, nor can you log out. You just die from it unless you can make it to a shop or a white wizard is nearby to heal you. If you get poisoned, you die. If an aggro or assisting mob spawns near where you're fighting, you die. If you start a fight without /conning each and every mob, you might die, as mobs of the same type can vary in level drastically. Finally, and possibly most spitefully, you can only increase your weapon skills when fighting mobs your level or higher. I haven't notched my sword skill in three days, since I can't survive a fight with a mob my own level.

- Death is unmerciful. You lose experience, plain and simple. Yes, you can lose a level from death. No exp vaults, no exp recovery, nothing like that. You just lose it. And you lose a healthy chunk of it. Oof. (Toril players are used to this sort of thing, however)

- Baffling controls. As someone else said, the reference card that comes with the game indicates keys to activate various commands. It doesn't tell you that these are ctrl-keys. Most keys are not configurable. Even movement is frustrating until you figure out to put the game into "compact keyboard" mode, which allows you to move with WASD instead of opening the chat window.

- One character per account. Yes, one. Unless, of course, you pay for more. I don't even know what the rate is, I couldn't find a simple chart or explanation. But you get one character per Content ID, and Content IDs are billed seperately.

- Alt-tab disabled. I like to read the web while I heal or wait for things to happen. Alt-tabbing isn't actually disabled, it simply crashes the game and boots you out to the PlayOnline interface. Don't hit your windows key, folks.

- All equipment is level restricted. Super-lame, since I have about a thousand Gil and all of the weapons and armor available for purchase are over my level. This only adds to the difficulty of combat, since you can't scrimp and save for better equipment to help you kill mobs. You only gain power by gaining levels.

- Insanely expensive items. Want to stock up on antidote to keep from dying of poison? They're 325 Gil each. Compare that to the 14 Gil you get from selling a common item drop, and you can quickly see why poison is a big deal. Buying expendable medical items is not an option at low levels.

- Low mob spawn rate. Be prepared to wander around for several minutes before finding a mob of the appropriate level to kill that isn't already being attacked. I hear this gets easier as you level up, but the newbie zones are understandably swamped right now.

- No reward for missions (not quests). I completed the first mission... visited some mobs in town, ran out to a tower (without directions), talked to a mob, watched some cut scenes, came back... and got no experience, no gil, and no items for it. Only "rank points," the purpose of which is not readily apparently to the level 5 player. I tried the second mission, but after dying 3 or 4 times to groups of aggro, assisting mobs, I called it quits until I could find a group.

Here is my FFXI experience as a whole: Log in, leave town. Begin the search for a mob I can kill. Find a mob several levels below me, kill it for 25/1700 experience and no Gil. Maybe get an item drop I can sell for 10. Search for another mob. Find one my level, walk past it. Find one a level lower than me, fight it, win at 20 hit points, spend 2 minutes resting. Repeat for half an hour or so, and accumulate a few hundred exp. Forget to /check a mob of the same type I've been killing all day, fight it, find out it's my level, die. Lose all experience I've gained in the last half an hour. Walk out again. Find a mob a level lower than me. Fight it, get poisoned, win at 20 hit points, die anyway. Walk out again. Fight for an hour. Start attacking a mob, another mob spawns nearby and assists, die again, lose all progress. Accept mission, run across map for 10 minutes, enter dungeon. Two aggro mobs in the hallway, one sees me, other assists. Die trying to frantically run to entrance to dungeon. Spend 3 hours playing, get frustrated, log out with less experience than I started with.

If you're not a fan of MMORPGs already, FFXI isn't the one for you to start on.


-Yes the game takes some time to learn, but my cousin got the hang of it with my help in 30 minutes.

-Look, if your friend is already on a server he can get you a world pass for 5 people for 1 week. Getting a world pass is EASY. Go outside with sigil casted on you (free spell from a gate guard with w.w. in his name) and get some non-earth crystals and auction them. On Seraph I got 12 wind crystals and a horde of quest items and had more thane nough to buy spells, armor, and a world pass for my friends in 2 days. I like the world pass system because it puts a fair number of people on each server.

-I'm in Windurst country. Follow these rules of fighting: Don't fight even matched or higher mobs. If a mob is a decent challenge with high defense in comparison, don't fight that either. The risk vs reward for attempting those monsters isn't worth it. Also, you're probably soloing anyways.

-If you are having problems bringing up your skill, then group with people. As a monk and as a white mage i've been asked by many people to group.

-You lose 10% of your exp to next level when you die. At lvl 1-7 that is 4 kills. I kill like 3 mobs in 3 minutes if i find the right ones.

-The controls are "different". In full keyboard mode you can just use your right hand to steer your character (8 north, 4 west, 6 east, 2 south) with "-" opening the main menu, asterix for locked targetting if you have a target locked or for "healing" (sitting down to heal. different from just /sit), 0 for going through valid targets within the area. 7 is for autorun, 5 is for toggling 1st - 3rd and vice versa view. Hell, I don't even use my mouse.

Also, you can change your keys for the ctrl settings. Go to Config and commands and you will see like 20+ commands with letters next to them. If you have A for Attack, then Ctrl + A is to attack your current target.

-It costs 1 dollar a month per character after the first. There is no point in having more than 5 unless you want a mule. You can change jobs in the residental area of a town. Say you are a lvl 20 monk. You can change to a lvl 1 white mage. If you get bored, you can become a lvl 20 monk again. You can have a main job and a support job too.

-The common drops you speak of are actually quest items for alot more than just 14 gil. This rewards people who actually take the time to quest.

-There is a reward for missions. You can only do some quests after you have a certain rank in that country. You can think of it as faction.

Ragorn, you sound like you solo alot. You complain as if you're a warrior trying to solo in TorilMUD. If you want to solo on FFXI, play a white mage, not a warrior. Also, recovering doesn't take 2 minutes. As a white mage I regen from empty to full in maybe 8 ticks (40 seconds). Seeing as how you posted this in Sigil's forum too, are you just trying to reassure them that their game will dominate or are you trying to brainwash people into not playing this game?
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

Aremat group-says 'tanks i highly suggest investing 20 silver in training weapons from cm to cut down on the losing scales to shield'
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Postby Dalar » Wed Nov 05, 2003 7:14 pm

To anyone who wants to play, I'll help you out with a world pass and teach you the basic commands. I gave an hour tour of the game to my cousin when I was a lvl 4 white mage and he already caught up to me as a black mage. The game is really easy to learn and isn't as hard as people make it out to be. I think the people who complain about the minor aspects of the game didn't take the time to figure out how to get around them or they have no patience.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

Aremat group-says 'tanks i highly suggest investing 20 silver in training weapons from cm to cut down on the losing scales to shield'
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Postby Ragorn » Wed Nov 05, 2003 10:09 pm

Heh I have no interest in assuring anyone anything. The Sigil forums are just a solid community where people are interested in MMOGs, and there's no flaming or baiting. I hate Everquest, and most of the games in the MMORPG market right now are just EverClones. I've burned out on the generic levelling-treadmill game, which is why I don't play Toril either. Since I left Sojourn, I've been actively seeking a MMOG to play. I've spent time with Earth & Beyond, Planetside, Anarchy Online, Everquest, and now FFXI. I'm by no means the expert on the genre, but I've played enough different variations on the same theme that simple eye-candy and repetitive gameplay aren't enough to earn my endorsement anymore.

The entire genre is filling up with identical games. And if I'm going to play a game that doesn't bring anything earth shattering to the market, then it better be the best fucking PvE clone there is. Really, what is there to make me want to play FFXI over Everquest, Anarchy Online, DAoC, Ultima Online, Asheron's Call, Star Wars Galaxies, or any of the other games that all operate basically the same way? So far, nothing besides the Final Fantasy brand, and I'm not loyal enough to the brand to choose the game on that merit alone (or Star Wars, or World of Warcraft, for that matter). The game is still the same game I played back in 1998 when I tried Everquest. You kill a lot of mobs and level yourself up. The crafting system in FFXI is basically the same as in every other MMOG, no innovation there. And there are enough annoyances... the world pass sytem, the relative sparseness of mobs, the brutality of poison... that I'm having a hard time finding a reason to deposit my $12.95 a month into Square's bank account rather than SoE's or Funcom's.

If you want to try a game with innovation, try Earth and Beyond. They had a rocky launch, but the game's a year old now and most of the problems have been resolved. There are three seperate exp bars, three ways to advance your character's level. You can find a great deal of success without killing a single mob, or you can slaughter your way across the galaxy. You can solo if you prefer, but there is a real benefit to grouping. From Hour One, you are bombarded with the game's ever-flowing plot, offered quests for items, skills, or faction, and given ways to explore the plot through NPC interaction. The crafting system is useful, and the main economy of the game is player-driven. New players are given an immersive and useful tutorial, which is mostly unnecessary since the interface is intuitive and very simple. There is immense replay value, since changing classes not only gives you new character abilities, but each of the three races offer vastly different views on the plot, and some of the quests you obtain vary greatly from race to race.

That's why EA gets my $12.95 a month. Can FFXI provide me enough variation from the standard "kill-pop-repeat" paradigm that I hate to draw me away? I don't know, but they have about 20 days left to find a way :)

Don't be such a fanboy Dartan :P
- Ragorn
Shar: Leave the moaning to the people who have real issues to moan about like rangers or newbies.
Corth: Go ask out a chick that doesn't wiggle her poon in people's faces for a living.
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Postby Dalar » Wed Nov 05, 2003 11:48 pm

How did you come to the conclusion about me being an FF fanboy? I played FF 1 2 3 just like most of the people here. I beat 9 and got bored of 10.

If you want to start with the name calling then fine, but I simply proved that your hasty conclusions aren't the only way to view things. You gave incorrect facts about a game that you "reviewed". Please, if we had people writing reviews like you then nobody would be playing any of the games you listed.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

Aremat group-says 'tanks i highly suggest investing 20 silver in training weapons from cm to cut down on the losing scales to shield'
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Postby Ragorn » Thu Nov 06, 2003 2:09 am

You're acting like a fanboy because you don't actually answer any of the question I ask about the game (most notably, why should I pay for it over the other games out there?), you just get all defensive trying to "prove me wrong."

If you really like the game that much, then I hope you have a wonderful time playing it. Levelling = work after you've done it enough times, and I don't feel like FFXI offers enough rewards to justify all of the work it would require to reach high level. From what I've seen, it doesn't add enough new features to the genre to justify putting up with all the minor but frustrating interface and gameplay problems. To someone who doesn't mind world passes and abandoning the use of his mouse, and to someone who hasn't levelled characters on four or five MMOGs already, I'm sure they'll find FFXI to be a wonderful experience.

I'm personally waiting for the next generation, when MMOGs stop being levelling treadmills, the first workable implementation of full PvP. I've fought enough mobs in the last 10 years. I want a company to give me a crack at fighting players for a change.

Planetside sucked, btw :(
- Ragorn
Shar: Leave the moaning to the people who have real issues to moan about like rangers or newbies.
Corth: Go ask out a chick that doesn't wiggle her poon in people's faces for a living.
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Postby Dalar » Thu Nov 06, 2003 8:59 am

Ragorn wrote:You're acting like a fanboy because you don't actually answer any of the question I ask about the game (most notably, why should I pay for it over the other games out there?), you just get all defensive trying to "prove me wrong."

If you really like the game that much, then I hope you have a wonderful time playing it. Levelling = work after you've done it enough times, and I don't feel like FFXI offers enough rewards to justify all of the work it would require to reach high level. From what I've seen, it doesn't add enough new features to the genre to justify putting up with all the minor but frustrating interface and gameplay problems. To someone who doesn't mind world passes and abandoning the use of his mouse, and to someone who hasn't levelled characters on four or five MMOGs already, I'm sure they'll find FFXI to be a wonderful experience.

I'm personally waiting for the next generation, when MMOGs stop being levelling treadmills, the first workable implementation of full PvP. I've fought enough mobs in the last 10 years. I want a company to give me a crack at fighting players for a change.

Planetside sucked, btw :(


1) From your babbling I can't figure out what kind of questions you're asking me about the game. Either that or I really didn't read your babbling carefully because I've seen all those common misconcptions before so I skim through them.
2) Do you even know what a fanboy is?
3) You've seen maybe 1% of the game. Your credibility is the same as what you have on Torilmud. absolutely none.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby Ragorn » Thu Nov 06, 2003 10:48 am

Sorry I insulted your game. I did not realize you would get all foamy mouthed about it. You are right, the Final Fantasy brand is mighty and robust, and all those who complain about world passes and horribly difficult controls are simply ignorant halfwits who cannot appreciate the true beauty and power that is Final Fantasy.

Enjoy the game. Try not to wet yourself over it too frequently.
- Ragorn
Shar: Leave the moaning to the people who have real issues to moan about like rangers or newbies.
Corth: Go ask out a chick that doesn't wiggle her poon in people's faces for a living.
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Postby Ashiwi » Thu Nov 06, 2003 2:08 pm

I never cared for the Final Fantasies. I tried to play them when they first came out and the game was tedious and monotonous. When they put another out I picked it up and gave it a shot, since everybody seemed to be raving about them, and it was just like the one before it, an extremely tedious snoozer with an almost identical storyline and a fighting system that annoyed the hell out of me. I've avoided them since then. Have they gotten any better? Is there anybody who didn't care for the early ones and thinks they're worthwhile now, or is there any one that stands out in comparison to the earlier ones?
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Postby Dalar » Thu Nov 06, 2003 2:32 pm

Ragorn wrote:Sorry I insulted your game. I did not realize you would get all foamy mouthed about it. You are right, the Final Fantasy brand is mighty and robust, and all those who complain about world passes and horribly difficult controls are simply ignorant halfwits who cannot appreciate the true beauty and power that is Final Fantasy.

Enjoy the game. Try not to wet yourself over it too frequently.


This statement just shows that you really don't have any insight into any game and can't defend yourself against any of my comments. I hope whatever you do in real life doesn't match your skill in gaming.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

Aremat group-says 'tanks i highly suggest investing 20 silver in training weapons from cm to cut down on the losing scales to shield'
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Postby Dalar » Thu Nov 06, 2003 2:34 pm

Ashiwi wrote:I never cared for the Final Fantasies. I tried to play them when they first came out and the game was tedious and monotonous. When they put another out I picked it up and gave it a shot, since everybody seemed to be raving about them, and it was just like the one before it, an extremely tedious snoozer with an almost identical storyline and a fighting system that annoyed the hell out of me. I've avoided them since then. Have they gotten any better? Is there anybody who didn't care for the early ones and thinks they're worthwhile now, or is there any one that stands out in comparison to the earlier ones?


Quite the opposite. I loved the early versions but I hated 7 8 9 10. The storylines were too soapish too. The last RPG i really enjoyed was Grandia II for its combat system.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

Aremat group-says 'tanks i highly suggest investing 20 silver in training weapons from cm to cut down on the losing scales to shield'
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Postby Ragorn » Thu Nov 06, 2003 7:33 pm

Dalar wrote:This statement just shows that you really don't have any insight into any game and can't defend yourself against any of my comments. I hope whatever you do in real life doesn't match your skill in gaming.


You have no comments except flames. Like I said, enjoy the game, and please stop trying to bait me, since this board is not for flaming.
- Ragorn
Shar: Leave the moaning to the people who have real issues to moan about like rangers or newbies.
Corth: Go ask out a chick that doesn't wiggle her poon in people's faces for a living.
Dalar
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Postby Dalar » Thu Nov 06, 2003 8:15 pm

Ragorn wrote:
Dalar wrote:This statement just shows that you really don't have any insight into any game and can't defend yourself against any of my comments. I hope whatever you do in real life doesn't match your skill in gaming.


You have no comments except flames. Like I said, enjoy the game, and please stop trying to bait me, since this board is not for flaming.


like unwarrantly calling me a fanboy isn't< give me a break
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

Aremat group-says 'tanks i highly suggest investing 20 silver in training weapons from cm to cut down on the losing scales to shield'
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Postby Zalkenai » Thu Nov 06, 2003 8:20 pm

You are all very funny in your anger and sarcasm. Thanks for the laugh.

Zalkenai
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Postby Alomlim » Sat Nov 08, 2003 9:27 am

I'm currently a lvl 9 GAL warrior on svr Kujata... gotta cajole my local converts into playing on my server, otherwise, I'm off to Phoenix.

This game is way fun; downtime is basically nil, fun time is way high. Loot splits are diced by default (wa-hoo dicing!), and the little cinematic intermissions are great... just the right balance between "let's get on with it" and Final Fantasy gratutious drama. Hell I even like Tetra Master.
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Postby Dalar » Sat Nov 08, 2003 4:26 pm

how's phoenix and kujata on japanese players? don't have an overabundance of them on seraph. i've met alot of english speakrs.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

Aremat group-says 'tanks i highly suggest investing 20 silver in training weapons from cm to cut down on the losing scales to shield'
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Postby Ihazim » Mon Nov 10, 2003 9:37 pm

whats everyones race job combos? i was thinking of doing warrior/monk, ranger/ninja, bard/white mage. from what ive been reading. if you have a set group id be happy to compliment it : )
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Postby Dalar » Tue Nov 11, 2003 12:07 am

i've been fooling around w/ monk and white mage. not sure what i want to do, but monk/warrior and summoner/blackmage and summoner/white mage and bard/whitemage are all cool combos i want to try
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

Aremat group-says 'tanks i highly suggest investing 20 silver in training weapons from cm to cut down on the losing scales to shield'
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Postby Alomlim » Tue Nov 11, 2003 6:21 am

I was outta town last week, sniff. But, I'm going for a damage sponge, which I guess means Paladin/Warrior... doing the Warrior part of that now :)

Kujata seems mostly english speaking to me, but then again, I see plenty of characters that aren't on my keyboard rolling by too.
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Postby Gerad » Tue Nov 11, 2003 8:37 am

I play on shiva, My character name is Kales and I am a low-level red mage :)

oh yeah, and I am a 'hume'.
<I>When a man lies, he murders some part of the world

These are the pale deaths, which men miscall their lives

All this I cannot bear to witness any longer

Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?</I>

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