Enchanted Khanjari Dagger

Feedback, bugs, and general gameplay related discussion.
Sylvos
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Postby Sylvos » Tue Dec 09, 2003 5:05 pm

You guys are so quick to dismiss the hit/dam bonus as not really worth much, but protest at the thought of having it removed?

confused
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Postby Kaede » Tue Dec 09, 2003 5:08 pm

I'm sure it did do up to 200 at some point. Perhaps it was a bug, but I was solo'ing in DS for several days from level 49 to 50 using bard glaive. I recall at the time speaking with Vhagar the battlechanter who was also in DS where I demonstrated to him that it was indeed restoring most of my hit points on kills. Course this was quite a while ago, the glaive I was using was the second to be quested and I haven't tested it out in a while. Right now it is indeed recovering around 60 hp/mana.
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Postby Nilan » Tue Dec 09, 2003 5:22 pm

The hit dam bonus helps rogues, just as i assume other weapons help other classes. The two handed weapons are nice for warriors and gives them nice procs to help their class. The windsongs are nice for rangers and gives them the quiesinart appeal of multi attacks and stuff.

I dont see why a weapon that helps rogues out is suddenly so over powered as compared to other weapons that help out other classes.

Just my two cents,

Nilan :)
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Postby old depok » Tue Dec 09, 2003 5:57 pm

Because the people who do not play rogues or who do and do not have the dagger see that cool proc and think damn I can't/don't have that I need to complain.

I play a rogue and I do not have the dagger. Do I want to quest it? Sure. Do I feel that my rogue is not a complete class without this weapon? No. How about you elven rangers out there. Is your kit complete without a windsong? Pali's without avenger?

Kanjari is a good dagger. BC dagger probably is better.

Melee sucks right now anyway. Why do we care if rogues get a little more love in that area?
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Postby Nokie » Tue Dec 09, 2003 6:04 pm

You know, SUV's should be banned because it gives people an 'unfair advantage' over those without SUV's.
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Postby Sylvos » Tue Dec 09, 2003 6:14 pm

Well to be fair, the original purpose of this thread seemed to be twofold.

1) A legitimate question regarding the implementation of the proc on this dagger. There were several daggers already in the game that received the proc without undergoing the, apparently, very very difficult quest to have that proc bestowed on current ones. These people received their proc daggers, essentially free of headache aside from the waiting period.

2) Yet another attack on the staff that seem to be cropping up again.

From the sounds of protest seen about the quest difficulty, and my own inexperience with the dagger, I can't argue that it's overpowered or not. Sure it does a helluva lot, but as Depok said it's not a class defining weapon. (Cause the class defining skills for rogues are largely !eq based which makes them the best damn melee class, but that's a different issue). Instead of endlessly beating at the 'overpowered' idea that this thread turned into, look at the original question asked.

Why were existing versions of this dagger given the proc, while anybody else who wants one has to go through hell and back, and then back again to get it?

Shevy already answered it, but that doesn't seem to matter. Go back to complaining about the proc.
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Postby Kaede » Tue Dec 09, 2003 7:01 pm

Regarding the original intent of the post...

I don't think anyone could really say there was a conspiracy theory. When the original quest to enchant the khanjari was actually put in, everyone pretty much heard a rumor that there would be a proc added to the enchanted khanjari. Nilan went around RP'ing and saying that he was doing a god-run quest that would result in the khanjari's proc being added. A god also posted that this was the case. Gargauth then added the float flag to the enchanted khanjari and told everyone who owned one and suggested that a proc was in the works. A long while later Shev finally implemented the proc supposedly separately from the RP quest.

So there was ample opportunity for interested parties to get enchanted khanjaris (over a year, at least). No one knew what the proc was going to be or whether it would be good or not. I guess one god hoarded a whole bunch of them in preparation and now Dizzin is suspicious?

The original quest to enchant the khanjari was easy. The current quest is pretty difficult and justifies the proc.

So a whole lot of people can enjoy the luxury of the enchanted khanjari while people who did not have the opportunity or foresight or desire to get them earlier are now screwed. So we should remove all khanjari procs so everyone who has one now can suffer rightfully as well, and use the fact that enchanted khanjari used to be easy to get as a reason just to satisfy the anguish of those who are unable to complete the current quest?

Seems to me there are several similar cases for things that were easy to get in the beginning but are harder now (which is what Nokie was first talking about). Ress quest... some people had an easier version in the beginning, the rest of the people had to do the full, harder version. Of course I know ress quest is a little harder, just pointing out a similar example.

A lot of eq also has been made more difficult to get than originally, ie. made rare, fight/zone difficulty increased, etc. In these cases, the people who did those first have always gotten the benefit of keeping their rewards without having to redo the harder version. Khanjari just happens to be the most impressive of these items with the most dramatic change in the quest.

As for the "khanjari is overpowered" subposts, Nokie and Nilan would be the best people to give judgement on it since they are users of the BC daggers and the enchanted khanjaris and know most the difference between the two.
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Postby Ashiwi » Tue Dec 09, 2003 7:07 pm

You know, I'd swear even Dizzin was telling me the other day how the BC dagger left the khanjari in the dirt... taunting me, actually, since I don't have a BC dagger.
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Postby thanuk » Tue Dec 09, 2003 7:31 pm

Nilan wrote:The hit dam bonus helps rogues, just as i assume other weapons help other classes. The two handed weapons are nice for warriors and gives them nice procs to help their class.



LOL! Nilan, you're a good guy and all, but I think you forgot to ID some things after the eq changes:

enchanted khanjari dagger: 4D4 +4+3 wt1 magic, float Proc(Khanjari Rage) <-- This is a 1handed weapon

enchanted dread gythka of the thri-kreen: 4D5 +4+4 wt18 magic, float, noburn,
twohands Proc(Venom Attack) Crit-Proc(Poison Shell, Slow Toxin)

Yeah, Khanjari and gythka are about the same.

Just did jot invasion, twilight went unbid in the first round. Wonder if anyone woulda bid Khanjari?

Anyway. Khanjari is a nasty weapon. Make it warrior usable! But you wont, so my 2 cents: It's pretty fuggin powerful weapon. Unbalancing almost. If you wanna leave it in, leave it in. But all the ones that got quested before the new quest came in should not be enchanted. the difficulty of the new quest MIGHT warrant these stats, but the old one certainly did not.
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Postby Waelos » Tue Dec 09, 2003 7:38 pm

Sylvos makes some good points. (In both replies, but I'll deal with the first one hehe).

If the procs aren't that powerful, why not remove 'em? Or tweak them to +5 +5, 50 hp vit?

And Nilan you seem to be forgetting that the dagger, on top of those abilities listed above, also gives you multiple attacks. The 'mighty' windsong gives you 4 more in its most rare attack form and has worse dice than the dagger. And I'm afraid that the windsong quest was about 10X harder than the old Khanjari quest.

Ashiwi - just because a weapon doesn't 'let you do more than your class allows' first of all isn't saying much because you area already a rogue with the ability to solo dragons. There isn't much that we COULD give you that would make you any more powerful if you're a decent player. I think you of all people know that best. Secondly, a weapon doesn't have to give you non class abilities to be over powered. Rogues own the melee and utility department hands down _without_ the dagger. Adding a weapon to their arsenal of that power is even more overkill.

Nokie - Everyone has the capability of buying an SUV and being at the same advantage as those currently with SUV's. Not everyone can wield an enchanted Khanjari dagger for the low, low price of 100 plat!

Sarell - So far everyone I've talked to would choose wielding the dagger instead of valhalla. Maybe it would sway you to know that valhalla doesn't heal anyone except a ranger when it is in the off hand, or a troll warrior. To anyone else its proc is a bec proc. Also, I think its pretty silly to say that tiamat is 10X easier than the khanjari quest. First of all, we all didn't march up there and hand tia 100 p and get her key and loot the vault 20-30 times.

And just another question or two before I go:

Why would it be a 'slippery slope' to go back and reset daggers to their unenchanted state, give everyone their tokens and 100 p and send people on their way? I've been farily involved in questing for a bit of my time here and I can't think of any other examples that would mirror changing this situation. What other quests have been changed to be made harder where the item was made better and might need to be 'looked at' in the same manner this dagger needs to be looked at? I can't think of a single example in the quest realm. I might be missing something, so please lemme know if I am =)

My whole point is the dagger is extremely potent when compared to 99% of every other weapon in the game. Other weapons need to be upgraded to compensate, the dagger needs to be dg'd to compensate, or the two need to meet in the middle somehow.

And there is no denying it isn't fair that all the daggers in the game were so easy to get. Then again, there is alot that isn't fair in game and in life. So, its really a question of how far is too far I suppose. I'd say down the existing daggers to 50 hp vit 3d4 +3 +3, +5 +5 on procs without the extra attacks. Have all new daggers be 3d4 +5 +4, the full procs. Give everyone with the current dagger the option to 1) keep theirs with the new stats or 2) give it up and get an old unenchanted, their 100 p and the quest token. Then, bring the rest of the weapons in the game that are as hard or harder to get back up to speed =)

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Postby Sesexe » Tue Dec 09, 2003 8:11 pm

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Postby Ihazim » Tue Dec 09, 2003 8:19 pm

There's a reason why the khanjari dagger is a rogue weapon and not a warrior class/sub class weapon! Making a chief arguement using that as an example is weak at most :p. Comparing it to the former premier weapon for warriors is aslo pretty weak :p. There's a reason gythka was dg'ed. Just because it was the premier item, doesnt mean it should have been a premier item after a calculating stat adjustment.

apples and oranges here people, c'mon :p
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Postby Sylvos » Tue Dec 09, 2003 8:25 pm

So tell me, what should a dagger be stat wise when what it takes is 100? plat.

I'm no areas god, but I'll bet the eq system doesn't call for something like khanjari dagger for the difficulty required in getting them. :P
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Postby Ensis » Tue Dec 09, 2003 8:57 pm

Ihazim wrote:There's a reason why the khanjari dagger is a rogue weapon and not a warrior class/sub class weapon! Making a chief arguement using that as an example is weak at most :p. Comparing it to the former premier weapon for warriors is aslo pretty weak :p. There's a reason gythka was dg'ed. Just because it was the premier item, doesnt mean it should have been a premier item after a calculating stat adjustment.

apples and oranges here people, c'mon :p


If Khanjari is going to be rogue only, give the warriors a good warrior only weapon. Twilight and Gythka both got screwed, and even still could be wielded by Anti's. Windsong should be put on par with khanjari if it is supposed to be the premier ranger weapon, unholy might get a second look, holy avenger sounds pretty dialed in, throw in a weapon for dire raiders and call it good.

People aren't bitching because they don't have a khanjari, it's because they have no hope of getting anything that powerful or even comparable for their class. It doesn't have to do the same damage, it doesn't have to have the same abilities, but something to fill the niche. It's an epic weapon, a damn cool one, and yea, people are going to be jealous that they don't have something as epic and/or cool. Especially warriors, since their only comparable choices got dg'd.
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Postby Hyldryn » Tue Dec 09, 2003 9:52 pm

It looks to me people are bitching about how easy it was to get early on. Not how its so great.
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Postby Yayaril » Wed Dec 10, 2003 12:23 pm

Nokie wrote:You know, SUV's should be banned because it gives people an 'unfair advantage' over those without SUV's.


8)

Yeah, they eat up more gas!!
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Postby Kifle » Wed Dec 10, 2003 1:54 pm

I like wey's ideas on changing existing daggers to wussed out versions but still enchanted. Like it or not, the dagger is a bit over powered. It procs rather often. If you tack that on with evasion, zones just aren't that scary for a rogue. What I don't understand is why this dagger was not downgraded after the changes. All other quest EQ was nerfed to less than zone eq, but this dagger was not touched at all. Maybe the new quest IS just that hard, as I hear it is now like an erlan type thing. I also agree with thanuk that a 2h quested weapon (gythka) should be just a hair above a dagger in damage dice and bonuses. It's just silly. Daggers give way too much hit/dam. Either up sword bonuses or lower daggers. Rogues dual wield, so if you can get your hands on two khanjaris, that's 8d8 8/6 compared to a 4d5 4/4? That's just silly.

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Postby old depok » Wed Dec 10, 2003 3:04 pm

Keep in mind though that a warriors Thaco is much lower than a rogues. As a result they need less hit dice to hit things. This lets them get higher damage dice because they don't need to have a 31 in hit to actually hit things.

I can get pibel to 50 damage but he has a 18 hit. Not gonna hit much with that.

The damage dice is a good argument though I would rather see the dice increased for warriors than decreased for rogues until there is some adjustment to melee in general.

The vit proc being able to stack on a normal vit might be too much. Maybe lower the hps that it give on the vit.

Other than that I think this is fine. Keep in mind if you DG this item much the epic quest you have to do now will make it not worth the effort. It is already daunting enough that it gives you pause. I would currently rather spend the time doing BC and try for those daggers than rent in ZK and try to beat everyone to the rare load mob with the dagger and then have to get all the items that are needed to upgrade these damn things.
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Postby Stamm » Wed Dec 10, 2003 3:20 pm

12/02/03 [Shevarash] Woopty Doo.
- Rogues/Bards/Battlechanters base hitroll adjusted to be similar to that of
the other hitter classes. This translates into needing slightly less
+hit gear to hit effectively.
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Postby Sesexe » Wed Dec 10, 2003 4:28 pm

thanuk wrote:enchanted khanjari dagger: 4D4 +4+3 wt1 magic, float Proc(Khanjari Rage) <-- This is a 1handed weapon

enchanted dread gythka of the thri-kreen: 4D5 +4+4 wt18 magic, float, noburn,
twohands Proc(Venom Attack) Crit-Proc(Poison Shell, Slow Toxin)

Yeah, Khanjari and gythka are about the same.


Proc or no proc, why does a 1h weapon = a 2h weapon raw stat wise?

Why does a questable item that was twynkable get a godly upgrade just because the current quest is more difficult, yet the fact that the mud was saturated with the item not taken into consideration?

Why did items that weren't twynkable and required you to do the whole zone, and no longer load anymore, get nerfed to be equal to their current versions?

Why does it look like you can take zone points from one zone and add them to another if you didn't use them?
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Postby old depok » Wed Dec 10, 2003 5:03 pm

Stamm wrote:12/02/03 [Shevarash] Woopty Doo.
- Rogues/Bards/Battlechanters base hitroll adjusted to be similar to that of
the other hitter classes. This translates into needing slightly less
+hit gear to hit effectively.


Nice. I guess I need to actually READ the news.
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Postby rylan » Wed Dec 10, 2003 5:20 pm

Its improved, but I don't think as good as warriors still, unless you call a warrior a hitter. :P My guess would be closer to ranger thac0 tables.
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Postby Yayaril » Wed Dec 10, 2003 5:56 pm

8)

The only thing making Khanjari dagger not worth wielding is the stupid purple ansi. Upgrade it to blue and greys and it'd be the best rogue weapon.
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Postby Dalar » Wed Dec 10, 2003 6:59 pm

STOP HIJACKING THE THREAD. DIZZIN ASKED WHY IT WAS EASY TO GET THE DAGGER, THEN THE PROC GOT UPGRADED, THEN THE QUEST GOT INSANELY HARD. UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT THE NEW QUEST IS AND ITS MINOR QUESTS, GO AWAY
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Postby Yayaril » Wed Dec 10, 2003 9:32 pm

8)

Gee Dalar, I hope that's a side-effect of the unfreezing process.
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Postby Shevarash » Thu Dec 11, 2003 3:04 am

This thread is silly.

Why were the old khanjaris upgraded without having to do the new quest? Here's the background - the dagger was promised to have a proc for over a year, publically. When I started writing the proc, and looked at the quest, it become apparent that the quest, while involving a couple rareloads, was nowhere near difficult enough to warrant a decent proc, if any at all. Therefore I decided the fairest thing to do was to upgrade the quest and grandfather in the old ones. To do otherwise would have been flat-out lying to the players since a proc had been publically promised to those that had acquired it for so long. An important factor in this was also the fact that enchanted khanjaris were relatively rare. The item was hardly 'saturated'.

No, it wasn't an ideal situation, nor was it commonplace. I did what I thought was the most fair given the circumstances, and I stand by the decision.

That said, the fact that anyone is even complaining about this to begin with boggles me. The fact that a few people got the khanjari without having to do the current quest doesn't hurt anyone. Seriously, can't you think of something better to complain about?

As to whether it's overpowered or not...frankly, it's a very complicated proc, and it's power is influenced by a number of factors that I'm not going to discuss. Even if you have a pair, chances are you don't know exactly how it works for everyone. In any case, your feedback is welcome, but I don't see any reason to change it at this time.

Finally, I'd like to say that coding Khanjari was a whole lot of fun, and I hope you guys enjoy having a weapon that's a little more complex and hopefully interesting than the average proc. There WILL be more 'epic' weapons like this one - this was just a good place to start.
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Postby Maedor » Thu Dec 11, 2003 10:57 am

What % of the daggers have actually been earned..legitly by questing them? 2% maybe? that is why people take issue with the dagger...The vast majority of these incredible daggers were obtained for about as much effort as a gcd :P

In all fairness, that shouldn't be allowed to happen...but when has this game/life been fair? :P

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Postby Pheten » Thu Dec 11, 2003 12:18 pm

Christ can this thread die now please? I'm sure you guys can find better stuff to complain about. Granted some threads on here have been long winded but there is not much more to say here. Move along now thx.

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Postby Sarell » Thu Dec 11, 2003 1:24 pm

I gotta say wey I think youer logic is kinda wierd on this one...

"If the procs aren't that powerful, why not remove 'em?"

um... why? that jjust makes no sense, why not leave them because they look cool are fun and people put a lot of hard work into thinking them up and writing them?

"The 'mighty' windsong gives you 4 more in its most rare attack form and has worse dice than the dagger."

no it doesn't. I've seen 16 hits. I think twyl posted a log on our bbs? Someplace I have a log of Kasula on ship getting a similar number, possibly 15. Upgrade windsong anyhow?

"Also, I think its pretty silly to say that tiamat is 10X easier than the khanjari quest. First of all, we all didn't march up there and hand tia 100 p and get her key and loot the vault 20-30 times. "

We did 8 hours and got around 6 of the very best items in the game however? I'm with verarb, i'll trade my khanjari for any tia gear still.

"Why would it be a 'slippery slope' to go back and reset daggers to their unenchanted state, give everyone their tokens and 100 p and send people on their way?"

Because like shev said they arn't hurting anyone, and at this stage many people payed VERY highly to get a dagger after the proc was introduced.

"And there is no denying it isn't fair that all the daggers in the game were so easy to get. "

just did :P

I do agre however that other weapons need to be looked at. I'd personally suggeest double every weapons hit and dam in the game, they are the 'weapons' for crying out loud. You can get fairly high level swords with less bonus to hit / dam than earrings and necklaces.... Looking forward to more rad weapons in game like shev said tho!
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Postby Sylvos » Thu Dec 11, 2003 2:08 pm

Disregard, don't wanna get into a debate over windsong proc here :P
Last edited by Sylvos on Thu Dec 11, 2003 2:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Gura » Thu Dec 11, 2003 2:21 pm

Shevarash wrote:Finally, I'd like to say that coding Khanjari was a whole lot of fun, and I hope you guys enjoy having a weapon that's a little more complex and hopefully interesting than the average proc. There WILL be more 'epic' weapons like this one - this was just a good place to start.


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Postby Todrael » Thu Dec 11, 2003 3:39 pm

Massive upgrades unbalance the mud as much as massive downgrades, despite "not hurting anyone." Not everyone is out to sate their gluttonous desire for more power. People care about nebulous "balance" more than you might think, Shev.
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Postby Waelos » Thu Dec 11, 2003 5:48 pm

C'mon Sarell. . . I KNOW you're smarter than this. I've seen it. tons!

"um... why? that jjust makes no sense, why not leave them because they look cool are fun and people put a lot of hard work into thinking them up and writing them? "

Why was Gythka, DK, Avenger, Twilight, etc. ad nauseum downgraded retroactively (ALL in game are nerfed, not just the new ones)? Why were they not left the way they were because THEY looked cool, were fun and I'm sure people put alot of work into them. It is/was about balance.

"no it doesn't. I've seen 16 hits. I think twyl posted a log on our bbs? Someplace I have a log of Kasula on ship getting a similar number, possibly 15. Upgrade windsong anyhow?"

You have seen 16 hits on a triple or double proc back when the proc had not been downgraded. It was thought that windsong was too strong for the quest that you had to do to get it, so it was made to proc less in general and even less for half elves. You are looking at old logs from BEFORE the downgrade. Again this was done for balance. I was one of the people who supported the DG. Don't I feel retarded now?

"We did 8 hours and got around 6 of the very best items in the game however? I'm with verarb, i'll trade my khanjari for any tia gear still. "

And how long did it take to get 100% of the Khanjari's in the game now? 15 minutes? sneak/hide/give 100p give dagger/ dance? Just because something 'only' took 8 hours (and it was 10, iirc) doesn't make it 10X easier than dumping 100 p on a quasi rare. Give me a _break_! No matter how you measure 'difficulty' I can't see how you can sanely state that Tia was ANY easier than dagger, let alone 10X. As for the trade I have some tiamat eq I will trade you for your dagger. You did state ANY gear (no, its not a treasure). Talk to me in game, I'd be MORE than happy to make it.

"Because like shev said they arn't hurting anyone, and at this stage many people payed VERY highly to get a dagger after the proc was introduced."

Hey I wasn't hurting anyone when I had my hide cloak. Why was that removed completely? Why not just take the hide feature off of all the new cloaks and leave the old ones alone? It was cool, fun, and a really neat idea. I paid alot for it and I know other people who paid alot too. Yet they were summarily dismissed. Oh well, f me? F them? Guess so.

"And there is no denying it isn't fair that all the daggers in the game were so easy to get. "

You can deny that water is wet and that sugar is sweet too, but that doesnt make you right. Anyone can stick their fingers in their ears and say 'NYAHNYAH I can't hear you'.

Again, I really like you Sarell, so I don't want to get into this too heatedly, but c'mon. I can't help but think that you're not really looking at this with an open mind. . . or maybe you just don't have all the facts straight. I hope I've helped a little bit =)


Lost
Teyaha
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Postby Teyaha » Thu Dec 11, 2003 6:52 pm

Todrael wrote:Massive upgrades unbalance the mud as much as massive downgrades, despite "not hurting anyone." Not everyone is out to sate their gluttonous desire for more power. People care about nebulous "balance" more than you might think, Shev.


yes, the people that like to approach this game as a JOB are the ones who complain the most about these things.
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Postby Sarell » Fri Dec 12, 2003 8:22 am

My bad, didn't know windsong was downgraded.

With regards to all the two handed weapons you mentioned I have been a strong campaigner against having them nerfed aswell. All around I think weapons should be far more significant part of a hitting classes gear.

I don't think khanjari can be used to ninja anywhere near as good as the hide cloak could. And still I am not sure that thing shoulda been nerfed. The hitpoint detriment was a good addition imho.

With the tia gear if it is the belt I can't use i'm prolly less interested... maybe .. hehe .. and the sacrificial dagger doesn't count either, it loads among the 'treasure' :P

With the difficulty compared to tia I said that I think the new quest is harder. If tia was in there would be A LOT of tia gear in game. At the same time I do not agree with massively downgrading gear that has been aquired long ago. I also do not think khanjari needs a downgrade to balance anything.
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Postby Dalar » Fri Dec 12, 2003 9:40 am

Teyaha wrote:
Todrael wrote:Massive upgrades unbalance the mud as much as massive downgrades, despite "not hurting anyone." Not everyone is out to sate their gluttonous desire for more power. People care about nebulous "balance" more than you might think, Shev.


yes, the people that like to approach this game as a JOB are the ones who complain the most about these things.

or we're the people who have a sense of balance and understand how the game has evolved.

Anyways, Shevarash, Gargauth was the one telling everyone we needed to quest the enchanted dagger to activate the proc, and we were told the quest was in game. That was the only lie i heard. The quest to 'activate the enchanted khanjari' was, in a sense, added to the game, but you grandfathered them anyways.

In a sense, you guys didn't complete your eq downgrades if they are grandfathered. My batskulls were easy to get but got downgraded. My protective eyelets were easy to get but got downgraded. My khanjari was easy to get but it got upgraded and made MUCH harder to get. We've been lied to by the gods in the past many many times and we're all grown-up. Please rectify this mistake by making all the previously quested enchanted khanjaris a key quest item item in an "awakened" khanjari dagger Not only will it make people zone more to finish the quest (it basically requires doing zones people never do anymore too), it'll make the people who still play happy. Why? My hunch is the people who got the daggers and don't play are the only ones who are trying to save their daggers. Look, I have a dagger and a rogue so don't even play the "you don't even have a rogue!" card. Also, bards can't use enchanted khanjaris so don't go there either.

If you're going to ignore my plea, then can you grandfather things because of other god lies? I hope Erlan's rewards are changed back to their Toril stats. We were all told all about the glory of the new Erlan quest for almost 3 years only to see an invasion and 6 weak items entering the economy.

Also, Weylarii, mention "the bow". There's another awesome god lie, but then again it's from Miax.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby thanuk » Fri Dec 12, 2003 3:17 pm

Sarell wrote: All around I think weapons should be far more significant part of a hitting classes gear.

I also do not think khanjari needs a downgrade to balance anything.


*touch Sarell*

Agree mightily. I don't think the Khanjari needs to be downgraded really, but i think that everyone should have to do the hard quest to have an enchanted one. But well, Shev wanted to grandfather them, and it's shev's house, so more power to him on that. Looking forward to seeing more epic weapon quests though.
Mysrel tells you 'have my babies'

You tell Mysrel 'u want me to be ur baby daddy?'

Mysrel tells you 'daddy? No, I think you have the terminology wrong'

You tell Mysrel 'comeon now we both know i would be the top'

Mysrel tells you 'can be where ever you want to be, yer still getting ****** like a drunken cheerleader'
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Postby Ihazim » Fri Dec 12, 2003 3:19 pm

<primary weapon> Thanuk's mullet of death (humming)
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Postby Waelos » Fri Dec 12, 2003 3:29 pm

*laugh* good point D.

I spent countless, I mean countless hours on a wild goose chase to find and quest the "Mystical elven bow of Sumbrar". A quest that I was told was in the game and available on several occasions. I was even shown the bow and told how cool the proc was. Nothing ever materialized and now the object isn't even anywhere in the game. So, Santa. . .I'm waiting!

After talking to people who are doing the current quest. I have to say that the CURRENT quest warrants the procs. What is more of a shame is what a TOTAL mockery the previous quest makes it. It isn't like there are only 3 or 4 of the enchanted ones in game. There are around 20.

I stick by my original idea of downgrading the OLD quested ones or giving the owners the choice to do the new quest I feel is fair.

So, do not downgrade the new daggers =) Quest is sufficiently hard in my humble opinion =)

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Postby Nilan » Fri Dec 12, 2003 4:52 pm

Wealos

I and some others worked really hard to get that khanjari to proc and awaken. I went to avernus fought all the demons there cause the dagger desired first the blood of demons then every dragon on the game.

So dont tell me it was easy.

It wasnt.

Nilan

This is a goofy thread.
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Postby Dizzin » Fri Dec 12, 2003 6:32 pm

Nilan wrote:Wealos

I and some others worked really hard to get that khanjari to proc and awaken. I went to avernus fought all the demons there cause the dagger desired first the blood of demons then every dragon on the game.

So dont tell me it was easy.

It wasnt.

Nilan

This is a goofy thread.


Nilan, your foolish godquesting had jack-all to do with the khanjari proc. Shev has said that several times. And you got the dagger when you went to BC, so dont say you just went there for the damn godquest. It had nothing, at ALL, to do with the khanjari proc.
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Postby thanuk » Fri Dec 12, 2003 6:36 pm

Dizzin wrote:
Nilan, your foolish godquesting had jack-all to do with the khanjari proc. Shev has said that several times. And you got the dagger when you went to BC, so dont say you just went there for the damn godquest. It had nothing, at ALL, to do with the khanjari proc.


Holy crap dude, thats a serious pwnage right there.

*Comf nilan*
Mysrel tells you 'have my babies'

You tell Mysrel 'u want me to be ur baby daddy?'

Mysrel tells you 'daddy? No, I think you have the terminology wrong'

You tell Mysrel 'comeon now we both know i would be the top'

Mysrel tells you 'can be where ever you want to be, yer still getting ****** like a drunken cheerleader'
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Postby Nilan » Sat Dec 13, 2003 1:15 am

ROFL DIZZIN

You slay me. At the time me and others were under the impression that it was. And yes we were working on awakening them all as we were instructed by Staff members. The fact that later it was decided to for-go the quest thing certainly does not diminish the time and effort that certain players who aquired that dagger early on put in to trying to do the quest as we were told.

And as for getting the dagger when I went to BC, you should get your facts straight. I had both of my daggers well before the bc run. and after they were aquired i had followed hints and clues regarding its awakening. i made at least two runs to avernus (yes we went to help with a ress quest, but each time was to kill a large number of demons) once apparently that was satisfied I then followed clues which indicated the killing of multiple coloured dragons, which i along with those willing to help me hunted and killed. this took a very very long time.

Some people, including myself worked as hard as others do to get their quests solved.

Nilan
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Postby Dizzin » Sat Dec 13, 2003 3:37 am

Nilan, I simply meant that you got the BC dagger when you went to BC on that godquest. So you can hardly say that you went there just to "awaken" the khanjari. Frankly, the whole was it/wasn't it a godquest to create a proc seems to me an example of staff not communicating with each other on Sojourn3. Either that or you just misunderstood what it was you were questing. Regardless, I personally find any type of godquesting to be an abomination when compared to REAL questing in this game. But that's just me.

Either way, you did NOT do the new longass quest for your daggers. Neither did I and neither did the vast majority of people out there who have theirs. Shev has said he decided to grandfather them in because he felt that was fair to people who had been promised a proc. I frankly disagree for I dont think just bagging an easy-to-get dagger for a couple years justifies getting an epic weapon for free. But I suppose it's Shev's mud, and he can do as he pleases.
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Postby Nilan » Sat Dec 13, 2003 4:09 am

The BC time was a rplay quest to locate the vessel Dizzin. It had nothing to do with the awakening thing that me and i think nokie and a nother goodie mighta been working on.

the fact is that we did spend alot of time trying to work on it. and yes it was hard. efforts were spent .


The fact that you find rplay and questing rplay to be an abomination is your opinion. Others find it satisfying and challenging as any quest you might do to gain gear and stuff.


Nilan
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Postby Gromikazer » Sat Dec 13, 2003 5:50 am

It occured to me, that there just needs to be more "epic" like weapons for other classes, so that warriors don't feel left out. I think for future reference, I think a majority of the players would prefer that eq isn't automatically updated, especially if there is going to be a large quest associated with it.
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Postby Wobb » Fri Dec 19, 2003 7:10 am

wtf is the world coming to?

i'll trade my khanjari for your tiamat scepter...

***king idiots

FOR GODS SAKE STOP MESSING WITH EQ

Wobb

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