Areas and Offensive Spells Engaging in Melee

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Sarell
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Areas and Offensive Spells Engaging in Melee

Postby Sarell » Wed Aug 11, 2004 10:12 am

I think it would be just dandy and fix a lot of problems if when a mob started casting an offensive spell, or aread (breath/spell/buffet/etc) our character were not so stupid as to rush into melee combat with them and try to beat them to death with our spellbook.

Problems it would solve include -
Messing up the usefulness of archery whatsoever (thinking about this got me onto the idea).
Wasting time disengaging.
Mages getting smitten to a riposte after a mob areas.

Problems to work out include-
You would need to make it stay the same for mobs. Having mobs not engage you when you aread them would be very silly indeed, they are not as clever as us, and a group of mobs smiting the too quick off the mark voker is always funny.

Another possible solution would be to implement a third state of combat. Where you are engaged with a mob so you have to flee or retreat or disengage, however you are not being a stupid wizard trying to hit it with your hands or a ranger trying to whip it with your bow.

Alternately a possible quick fix would be to make rangers able to archery in combat? This doable?
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rylan
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Postby rylan » Wed Aug 11, 2004 12:24 pm

If this was a toggle option it would be great... something like 'toggle autoengage'
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Re: Areas and Offensive Spells Engaging in Melee

Postby Silsaterur » Wed Aug 11, 2004 12:56 pm

Sarell wrote:Problems it would solve include -
Messing up the usefulness of archery whatsoever (thinking about this got me onto the idea).
Mages getting smitten to a riposte after a mob areas.


You mean archery would be useful for more than just exp and luring? *GASP* Imagine a ranger relying on his archery to combat a wizards spells, trusting in his evasion and good saves to see him through the fight. I think it would give rangers a way to deal with those nasty caster mobs. (missile shield permitting) As it stands, only warriors/paladins/anti's and other casters seem to really be able to take down caster mobs with little or no impending danger. (I haven't had a rogue at a decent enough level to try however, so they might be in there too) This leaves rangers out of the loop... again... poor little buggers.

Sarell wrote:Problems to work out include-
You would need to make it stay the same for mobs. Having mobs not engage you when you aread them would be very silly indeed, they are not as clever as us.


You don't neccessarily need to make them engage, in a caster vs. caster duel, the mob could simply trade spells with the offending spellcaster and... you guessed it, SPELLDUELS! All of the other classes pretty much have to engage the caster to kill them, so all you really need to do is make the mob start casting offencive spells on it's opponent. I often find it silly that my elemetalist recieves more of a beatdown from an opposing wizard than he can deliver with his most potent spells. Thank dugmaren for stoneskin.

Sarell wrote:a group of mobs smiting the too quick off the mark voker is always funny.


Yes, yes it is...


Sarell wrote:Alternately a possible quick fix would be to make rangers able to archery in combat? This doable?


What if, at a certain level, rangers became proficient enough with a bow to make use of his archery while engaged in melee combat? It could be along the same precident as paladins getting proficient enough to use a 2h weapon while mounted and it wouldn't be terribly hard to code. Plus rangers would lose thier ability to parry because they don't have a melee weapon equiped.

These things would go a long way to increasing the playability of rangers... especially at higher levels where they are oft retired to "the fountain guard"
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Postby Osod » Thu Aug 12, 2004 2:02 am

alright, coupla things.

caster vs. caster? Half the mobs that area would pzwn a caster's butt in melee, so caster vs caster seems highly unlikely.

Rangers bottom rung against casting mobs? Rangers can bash if you don't recall. If they get engaged by an area, quick response may be bash if someone else isn't already on it.
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Postby Delmair Aamoren » Thu Aug 12, 2004 2:04 am

A ranger bash? they actually get that skill?

Seriously now, i don't think i know a ranger that wears a shield, or can
switch to one fast enough to stop at least one spell from going off.
Couple exceptions being some longtime rangers, you know who you are.
*cough*notamolol*cough*
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Postby Silsaterur » Thu Aug 12, 2004 3:31 am

Osod wrote:caster vs. caster? Half the mobs that area would pzwn a caster's butt in melee, so caster vs caster seems highly unlikely.

Rangers bottom rung against casting mobs? Rangers can bash if you don't recall. If they get engaged by an area, quick response may be bash if someone else isn't already on it.


First, you totally missed my point, if neither the player or the mob engage and simply trade offencive spells caster vs caster could be a reality, but while caster mobs engage casters, they will continue to whip the players a**es. (Some exceptions of course)

Second, a ranger bashing would likely wind up with the ranger watching the incomming spell from prone.
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Re: Areas and Offensive Spells Engaging in Melee

Postby Nekelet » Thu Aug 12, 2004 4:28 am

Sarell wrote:I think it would be just dandy and fix a lot of problems if when a mob started casting an offensive spell, or aread (breath/spell/buffet/etc) our character were not so stupid as to rush into melee combat with them and try to beat them to death with our spellbook.

I just love this idea, not only for PC's but for pets as well. Besides me attempting to whap that shammy giant upside his head with my orb of might, it just drives me batsh*t when my ghosts decide to globe themselves or boneshatter a shadow, instead of globing the the poor rogues and tanks like I told them to.

I mentioned this way back when. Actually my post was kinda vague, so maybe I should say I hinted at it. I called the toggle 'Tog NonCombatant.' Made sense to me at the time.
Topic is here. (starting at my post)
http://www.torilmud.dyndns.org:8080/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=11286&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=62
or the full thread.
http://www.torilmud.dyndns.org:8080/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=11286
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Postby amolol » Fri Aug 13, 2004 12:57 am

Delmair Aamoren wrote:A ranger bash? they actually get that skill?

Seriously now, i don't think i know a ranger that wears a shield, or can
switch to one fast enough to stop at least one spell from going off.
Couple exceptions being some longtime rangers, you know who you are.
*cough*notamolol*cough*


hey delmair grow some balls and quit the petty childish attacks.

first of all i always carry a shield on my and yes i do have an alias set up to drop my offhand ans switch to my shield... the problem with this is you can equip a shield while being in combat... not even you and your high and mighty anti can do that. so it takes around 3 rounds or so to get it all said and done. thats way to long flee = roughly 1-1.5 rounds of lag once out of the room... that is if you are successful the first time. half a round or so for the alias to switch everything. hoping the mob doesnt track and disturb this you can get back in on round 3 to eat another area.

if your lucky the mob fails quick cast. or if it is a single target if your lucky that stupid game bug doesnt kick in and you get nuked even though you were out of the room.
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Postby Ambar » Fri Aug 13, 2004 8:46 am

hey delmair grow some balls and quit the petty childish attacks.


so i have no balls (being female) ... so i am automatically childish? pot ... kettle ... black :P


first of all i always carry a shield on my and yes i do have an alias set up to drop my offhand ans switch to my shield... the problem with this is you can equip a shield while being in combat... not even you and your high and mighty anti can do that.


dismount/unwield deathknell .. wield sword wear shield .. easy :P
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Postby Treladian » Fri Aug 13, 2004 9:53 pm

Ambar wrote:dismount/unwield deathknell .. wield sword wear shield .. easy :P


Reading between his typos, I believe Amolol was commenting on wearing a shield in the middle combat, which is definately something you cannot do. You get to hope that the next spell the mob lobs at the group doesn't beat out the disengage lag so that your commands acutally go through . . .
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Postby Ambar » Fri Aug 13, 2004 11:45 pm

yeah yer prolly right .. was early as hellt he first time i read it :P
Sarell
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Postby Sarell » Sat Aug 14, 2004 8:58 am

Stop bickering plz, ruining mah thread of good ideas! :P
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Postby Nurpy Fuzzyfeet » Sat Aug 14, 2004 4:20 pm

Sarell wrote:Stop bickering plz, ruining mah thread of good ideas! :P


So shouldn't it like be in the ideas forum? :P

In any case, I think proposing any ideas or anything that requires coding right now is foolish at best. Just gonna get stuck in the immortal couch cushions. We need more coders. :cry:
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Postby Lilithelle » Sun Aug 29, 2004 1:43 pm

I think the only proper solution to this is the suggestion of a special state of combat where your not attempting to hit a mob. I do agree, personally I don't want to try to hit most mobs with my beloved seelie staff. If we allow mages to not become engaged in combat at all by areas it would make zones easier and safer for mages, they just need to walk out of the room when they see a spell about to go off. Being engaged they'd have to risk fleeing which is dangerous in zones, or use retreat and get lagged and thus waste time. But zones right now are easy enough as is and if mages could just leave the room at will when spells were incoming that might be a bit much. And make rangers not try to whack mobs with their bows when engaged but not tanking! and let them still fire it.
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