Dynamic Loads and Gear Points

Feedback, bugs, and general gameplay related discussion.
Sarell
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Dynamic Loads and Gear Points

Postby Sarell » Fri Sep 17, 2004 11:53 pm

Exhibit A: Izans

Do items get credit for being 'rare' even if something else loads in their place if they don't load? Doesn't seem to work out as you ALWAYS get something uber. I quite like this zone, I just hate seeing old zones going by the wayside as they were not made to cater for specific gear points.

What is with putting in another !bit DI item after all the fuss downgrading amulet of sight? In spite of points, Avernus = harder than nazI by a bazillion gajillion.
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Postby Verarb » Sat Sep 18, 2004 12:57 am

hahahah
man! my bottom is starting to hurt.
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Postby Dugmaren » Sat Sep 18, 2004 1:28 am

It's a little more complicated then that - read 2 loads, one happens 90% of the time, the other only shows up 10% of the time. However I think you're on to something, looking into it.

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Postby kiryan » Sat Sep 18, 2004 3:21 am

is DI on a mage only item less expensive than DI o a nobits item?

also, the objective system seems to give no credit for more challenging scenarios... for instance breaking into 2nd grid in IC2 is very difficult given the blind entry, the searching mobs, and the roaring. The eq doesnt seem to reflect any bonus points for being actually difficult.
and tonights winner in the Toril EQ lottery is demi belt and skull earring!
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Postby Dalar » Sat Sep 18, 2004 3:29 am

Another zone trend is that the significantly easier zones, like Izan, give much better equipment than hard zones, like BC and IC2.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.
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Postby Delmair Aamoren » Sat Sep 18, 2004 4:14 am

kiryan wrote:is DI on a mage only item less expensive than DI o a nobits item?


But of course.
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Postby Sarell » Sun Sep 19, 2004 10:14 am

Dug - "read 2 loads, one happens 90% of the time, the other only shows up 10% of the time"

Hrmmmm... that makes sense, i'd like to see a mob always load a sword, but every now and then it loads a really good sword, but this isn't what is happening in the game. Nazi, Spob for sure, then seelie to a degree always load great top end items. Not just now and then. Sometimes you get an UBER item, but you always get something that is great. Now spob and seelie are hard, and think we have talked about them enough. Nazi is medium hard. Now it isn't loading the supreme items every time, but it is yielding great gear for the effort. It feels like running the traditional TF gauntlets on a tiny bit larger scale where you dont have to worrry about incoming/memming out or water fights.

Now I must make absolutely clear I think flying fortress is a great zone. I REALLY enjoy doing it. It isn't gimicky, it isn't all luck, you have to be kinda on your toes and do some big fights without just throwing corpses at it over a million hours. I like the stuff it is yielding aswell, some of it is very niche, some is workable all over, some I just personally don't get but people seem to bid it. However some of the older 'hard' zones just arn't getting any love.

With regards to the 90% VS 10% load, take a look at demi. You get to the chest, it's always is full of utter crap even if you get the super rare ring, WOW it is now 0 hp 50 mana, originally was 40hp, upgraded to 50hp, then nuked to nothing.. at the same time you add nazi which has a 65HP with AC ring. Now it doesn't load every time. But something good will.

When we finished nazi today (mightily), imis said something about it being !CC or not as hard as CC. I'd have to agree totally. Yet you go 1/3rd into CC, pick up your little warrior sword, nothing else is worth doing. Would making the entire area after Q !tele give diamondine more points? Maybe that should be done, when the zone writers made CC I bet they didn't think an illusionist was going to attack a ghoul make it word have it summon them in and fold in their army. It just isn't catered to a strict quantitative points system of gear distribution. The ghouls and dragons are the worst thing in there, but they are not very high level. Level doesn't mean much to big groups now anyhow however.

I think the end of every large zone should have something worth doing that isn't a quest item. Or maybe throw a 10% load 'glimmering diamondine earring' on dred that is 15hp, and some bit better made dragonhide leggings, a swifter set of grey greens, a prot lightning lighting earring, a hotter flaming shield, some exceptionally ancient tanari hide gloves (only can be seen on examination of item perhaps), etc. OOOOooohhhh i really like that idea....Might make people revisit some zones with the hope of getting one, not hacking away everyday most probably, but hey, let's try this today. I tried to get some peeps to go to avernus recently just to do it, met with laughter and another trip to ttf/nazi.

Lots of love. Sarell. Touch.


PS.. um kiryan, IC2 gear is pretty darn good, like, the best there is in some instances.
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Postby Dalar » Sun Sep 19, 2004 7:02 pm

The only IC2 items worth getting are the maxint items and maybe the maxwis items. All of strife's stuff is pretty much a toned down version of what's already in game. Oh yea the axe is ok too but its proc sucks.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby Sarell » Sat Oct 09, 2004 1:30 am

as we see more gear come out of izan's, i just feel compelled to bump..

just found out that the !bits DI item also has awesome hitpoints, weren't we trying to lower cast HP?
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Postby Tasan » Mon Oct 11, 2004 6:15 am

I think the eq system is based on quality of descriptions now. The less points you use on quality descs, the more you can pump into eq. Hence the awesomeness of Nazi.
</sarcasm>

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Postby Tanji Smanji » Mon Oct 11, 2004 12:08 pm

Dunno, the human eye amulet got romped also. Seems like quest/old items have a harsher system than new zones.
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Postby Ashiwi » Mon Oct 11, 2004 2:12 pm

Considering the nastiness of Avernus and the amazing lack of worthwhile things to do there, I don't see the point of putting any more DI items in zones after what happened with the Amulet of Sight. I appreciate the new system, but it fails to take the common sense factor into account, and there are times when the staff need to step in and make calls on items. I know that would probably end up with calls of 'favoritism' but documenting reasons for scoring zones in different ways within the zone docs might help that somewhat.

Only the last fight where the item is being held actually counts for item points? Well hell, set those out in the open in different points in the mud and let us get busy on them! That four hours spent beforehand just getting to the fight doesn't count for anything, noooooooo, that's just there for amusement. ::twitch:: I'm sorry, but is there some reason the time and effort involved just to get to a fight isn't taken into account in zone difficulty? Shouldn't the zone overall receive a point adjustment based on work involved just to get TO the fights? Lurability could count as negative overall zone points, teleportable areas could count negatively, having to trudge through hours of nastiness could count positively. Izan's seems awfully easy, because the patrols are lurable, and all the groups are in controllable numbers. Since I haven't been in a spanked Izan's group in a main fight yet, I have yet to see if those groups track out, and if they don't, then the fights are totally puss compared to the zones nobody goes to because the item/effort ratio is so off kilter.

Oh, and if an item is given greater points for being rareload, the items that load in place of them had better totally suck, instead of increasing the points of every item that loads just by increasing the amount of items that can possibly rareload in one spot. I might have completely misunderstood how the zone works, seeing as how I've only gone twice and it seemed like total cake the second time I went, but that didn't make it seem any less like cake.

Please consider adding an overall zone adjustment to zone pointage dependant on how much hell the zone subjects the group to. Setting up fights the players can control is a hell of a lot different than setting up situations which require real tactics other than 'lure and kill' or 'mem out'. Avernus is in hardcore need of an overall zone boost, because you HAVE to get through all that hell in order to get to the big fights, so it should count for something.
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Postby Dalar » Mon Oct 11, 2004 7:55 pm

WHY DOES BRONZE CITADEL STILL SUCK
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:00 pm

Dalar wrote:WHY DOES BRONZE CITADEL STILL SUCK


Uh, cause Kia made it?
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Postby kiryan » Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:08 am

please give BC and IC2 items some love, a lot of love

please stop letting zones have 15+ great items (spob, nazi, musphelim)?
and tonights winner in the Toril EQ lottery is demi belt and skull earring!
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Postby Sarell » Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:12 am

God that was funny arilin... I wish dart still had his tagline for it tho!

Anyhow, notch up 18HP infra eyewear aswell as the DI eyewear... WTF :P

Can we put 300 .3% loads on grandpod? Maybe avernus, doombringer, fade..... You do have to get past the fizgigs afterall. The zone has been in less than a month? I'm already seeing characters wearing 7 items from the zone! Not that rare/hard I guess....

Anyhow, I still think popping a few items at the end of zones like CC/SF that are a bit better now and then would rock and stop people from only going to Izans... A glittering diamondine earring, 8HP 3dam, 6% load. etc etc etc...? Whatcha think of this idea?
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Postby oteb » Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 am

infra
di
fly
fireshield (wtf?!)

<- waiting for someone to pop sneak item in izan.
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Postby Gura » Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:13 pm

i really dont think there was ever a problem until zones started having 20 different pieces of eq that could load. limit it down to 6 or 7 and i think you'll see this trend of unbalance die. no system is flawless and please dont get insulted dug because im sure you worked hard on it...but applying a system just means people find a loophole in it to throw in that spanky item so their zone gets done the most.
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