Dragon Feedback
How about a compromise of letting the para paralyze just part of the dragon? For instance, have it paralyze the tail, thus preventing tail sweeps for a while, or perhaps a leg, which might stop claw procs? Major para doesn't have to be a 'one size fits all' kind of spell for something as large as a dragon!
I'm all for that and then some. Best example I can think of besides prism para is fell frost. Just make dragon's AC worse, and slow the rates of ALL procs for 1/2 the duration of a regular para. He's slowed in all aspects. Seems a good compromise. I hate doing dragons now. I never was eager in the past but they can really spank, which is good. I think! :P
making dragons !para?
u know i'm not really sure that this is being looked at in the right light? ..right now.. with your 15 man hit squad fronting up to named dragon number 4 etc... if a person manages to land a para, then suddenly victory is a possibility, not garanteed. possible. No one is able to solo dragons with para etc, or abuse this system with rogue and mentalist, etc. (believe me i've tried). You may recall this whole 'having a great deal of luck etc' that people have been talking about in order to win a wyrm fight? The dragon run we did the other day involved what, 3 named dragons? we had multiple mentalists and vokers in the vain hope that we could land a para...and what happened? saks wiped the floor with us..multiple times.. Your proposition atm is that even the slightest possibility of the fight becoming a bit easier be removed altogether also? At present i thought we were waiting on some feedback from the admins etc on the current system becauase of HOW HARD it is... or how it effects spell quests, zonage etc, and u want to just take it that extra step beyond ridiculousness? maybe we could just pay 10k to each dragon for it's scale?
tai.
tai.
Re: making dragons !para?
alvathair wrote:u know i'm not really sure that this is being looked at in the right light? ..right now.. with your 15 man hit squad fronting up to named dragon number 4 etc... if a person manages to land a para, then suddenly victory is a possibility, not garanteed. possible. No one is able to solo dragons with para etc, or abuse this system with rogue and mentalist, etc. (believe me i've tried). You may recall this whole 'having a great deal of luck etc' that people have been talking about in order to win a wyrm fight? The dragon run we did the other day involved what, 3 named dragons? we had multiple mentalists and vokers in the vain hope that we could land a para...and what happened? saks wiped the floor with us..multiple times.. Your proposition atm is that even the slightest possibility of the fight becoming a bit easier be removed altogether also? At present i thought we were waiting on some feedback from the admins etc on the current system becauase of HOW HARD it is... or how it effects spell quests, zonage etc, and u want to just take it that extra step beyond ridiculousness? maybe we could just pay 10k to each dragon for it's scale?
tai.
I don't think people are saying that being able to para a dragon is making them too easy. I think they're saying that making dragons para-able is not the answer to the issue of dragons being ridiculously difficult now with all of their procs.
Yeah, what Birile said. I personally think dragons should be insanely hard, but if you're talking about easing up on the difficulty of them, para doesn't really seem to be the answer for me. I'd love to see different spells affect dragons in different ways, slowing it down and giving a group an edge, but having one spell totally paralyze an ancient dragon that's supposed to be highly resistant to most magic just seems out of whack.
I've never cottoned to the silly god-like abilities of Salvatore's heroes in FR. Dragons shouldn't be unbeatable, but we shouldn't have to rely on one miracle spell that reduces them from thunder lizard to slightly gassy gecko.
I've never cottoned to the silly god-like abilities of Salvatore's heroes in FR. Dragons shouldn't be unbeatable, but we shouldn't have to rely on one miracle spell that reduces them from thunder lizard to slightly gassy gecko.
Gormal tells you 'im a dwarven onion'
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'
Inama ASSOC:: 'though it may suit your fantasies to think so, i don't need oil for anything.'
Haley: Filthy lucre? I wash that lucre every day until it SHINES!
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'
Inama ASSOC:: 'though it may suit your fantasies to think so, i don't need oil for anything.'
Haley: Filthy lucre? I wash that lucre every day until it SHINES!
http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=182
http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=183
http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=183
"Being God isn't easy. If you do too much, people get dependent on you; and if you do nothing, they lose hope. You have to use a light touch [...]. When you do things right, people won't be sure you have done anything at all"
--Futurama
--Futurama
As Haley is my hero, and I am the rogue arguing for beefier deaths, I am unsure how to take that...
Gormal tells you 'im a dwarven onion'
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'
Inama ASSOC:: 'though it may suit your fantasies to think so, i don't need oil for anything.'
Haley: Filthy lucre? I wash that lucre every day until it SHINES!
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'
Inama ASSOC:: 'though it may suit your fantasies to think so, i don't need oil for anything.'
Haley: Filthy lucre? I wash that lucre every day until it SHINES!
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Silverast Rubicyn
- Sojourner
- Posts: 376
- Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2001 6:01 am
- Location: Long Branch, NJ
The last 4 times Ive lead swamps we did it like this.
Para first dragon, stab it. Para second dragon stab it. Para third dragon stab it. Sometimes they would come un para, so we would para them again. It was very stale, and tia can't possibly come in with any semblacne of fun with dragons like that.
Para first dragon, stab it. Para second dragon stab it. Para third dragon stab it. Sometimes they would come un para, so we would para them again. It was very stale, and tia can't possibly come in with any semblacne of fun with dragons like that.
Arishae group-says 'mah sunray brings all the boys to the yard'
Shadow Scream
Shadow Scream
Sarell wrote:The last 4 times Ive lead swamps we did it like this.
Para first dragon, stab it. Para second dragon stab it. Para third dragon stab it. Sometimes they would come un para, so we would para them again. It was very stale, and tia can't possibly come in with any semblacne of fun with dragons like that.
...
exciting
...
Is this being looked into, Imms? :)
Birile wrote:Is this being looked into, Imms? :)
Forget it--it's already been looked into. I hope the players' thoughts have been taken into consideration. What I meant to ask is, "Is something being done about a problem that's been sufficiently discussed and proven?"
(not using my rapier wit, I'm being sincere)
You know, what might be fun would be if the para spell didn't actually paralyze dragons, but just slowed them down a bit. Maybe their tail sweeps might have a better chance of being saved against because they're slower, or they might not have the muscular control to do that jump-in-the-air-land-on-squishy-thingie thingie, or if its wing attacks were halved because one wing might be out of commission for a short time.
Or even if the para were landed at a really great time, you could cause the dragon to hiccup in the middle of breathing, causing it a bit of internal damage and really tweaking it off.
Or what might be really fun is if certain caster spells worked in conjunction with other class abilities... like if landing a para on a dragon slowed it down and made it more susceptible to melee attacks.
Or even if the para were landed at a really great time, you could cause the dragon to hiccup in the middle of breathing, causing it a bit of internal damage and really tweaking it off.
Or what might be really fun is if certain caster spells worked in conjunction with other class abilities... like if landing a para on a dragon slowed it down and made it more susceptible to melee attacks.
Gormal tells you 'im a dwarven onion'
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'
Inama ASSOC:: 'though it may suit your fantasies to think so, i don't need oil for anything.'
Haley: Filthy lucre? I wash that lucre every day until it SHINES!
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'
Inama ASSOC:: 'though it may suit your fantasies to think so, i don't need oil for anything.'
Haley: Filthy lucre? I wash that lucre every day until it SHINES!
I have to disagree simply for the reason that it's absolutely STUPID to make one skill--the ability to paralyze--so necessary in order to do a fight that should take talent. It's been reduced to just another form of twinkage. There should never be a trick to fighting a dragon, there should be skill.
I'm not suggesting para be the end-all spell... I'm suggesting that more spells have effects which inspire varying strategies, instead of a single method that seems to be the ONLY way of doing things.
For example... what if an abundance of cold-based spells stacked on top of each other helped to render a fire-based dragon slowed and unable to fly due to sluggishness? What if a large volley of fire-based spells made a cold-based dragon unable to breath due to the super-heated air in the area scorching its lungs? What if entangle lowered a dragon's AC for a short period of time, holding them in place for increased melee damage? What if pris didn't have its intended effects on a dragon, but on a successful roll it acted as partial blind/confusion, increasing wing buffets and decreasing chances of other procs?
But different types of spells should have different effects, thus requiring different strategies depending on the dragon type.
For example... what if an abundance of cold-based spells stacked on top of each other helped to render a fire-based dragon slowed and unable to fly due to sluggishness? What if a large volley of fire-based spells made a cold-based dragon unable to breath due to the super-heated air in the area scorching its lungs? What if entangle lowered a dragon's AC for a short period of time, holding them in place for increased melee damage? What if pris didn't have its intended effects on a dragon, but on a successful roll it acted as partial blind/confusion, increasing wing buffets and decreasing chances of other procs?
But different types of spells should have different effects, thus requiring different strategies depending on the dragon type.
Gormal tells you 'im a dwarven onion'
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'
Inama ASSOC:: 'though it may suit your fantasies to think so, i don't need oil for anything.'
Haley: Filthy lucre? I wash that lucre every day until it SHINES!
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'
Inama ASSOC:: 'though it may suit your fantasies to think so, i don't need oil for anything.'
Haley: Filthy lucre? I wash that lucre every day until it SHINES!
Question--
Has anyone tried singing song of protection against the new dragons? Before the change, this song was supposed to help keep people from fleeing when dragons roared in battle. Doesn't help with the insane procs, but maybe keeping people from fleeing would make things a little easier. Of course singing this over song of healing might seem kinda insane, but who knows?
*shrug*
Has anyone tried singing song of protection against the new dragons? Before the change, this song was supposed to help keep people from fleeing when dragons roared in battle. Doesn't help with the insane procs, but maybe keeping people from fleeing would make things a little easier. Of course singing this over song of healing might seem kinda insane, but who knows?
*shrug*
Birile wrote:Question--
Has anyone tried singing song of protection against the new dragons? Before the change, this song was supposed to help keep people from fleeing when dragons roared in battle. Doesn't help with the insane procs, but maybe keeping people from fleeing would make things a little easier. Of course singing this over song of healing might seem kinda insane, but who knows?
*shrug*
I have to agree that while invokers shrug more than I do at a smart guy convention, I still flee out repeatedly. Makes vokers even less worthwhile yet. It's very frustrating. Maybe a 'Song of WhoCaresWhatWeFight' is in order!
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kiryan
- Sojourner
- Posts: 7275
- Joined: Sat Apr 14, 2001 5:01 am
- Location: Los Angeles, CA and Flagstaff, AZ
- Contact:
repeating my earlier post.
young dragons - 5 man
mature - 8-12 man
adult dragons - 12-15 man
ancient dragons - 15 man
named dragons - a superior 15 man
The problem is so many of the dragons in game are ancient or named. Shev helped this alot by creating the "ancient wyrm" race to hold the the top tier of dragons. I think there should probably be some more changes to a few dragons, especially spell quest dragons, but its not really necessary (just sucks for new players with no friends).
Still, I think a lot of us just need to get used to the idea that there are encounters that you can not just get a pickup group of random 15 50s to do. Your going to need proper groups with the right classes in the right amounts. There are going to be encounters that you need the top 15 players in the game to do without relying on tremendous luck and several spanks.
I like everything about new dragons except this para thing and how there are soo many dragons all over toril zones and especially in well traveled routes.
young dragons - 5 man
mature - 8-12 man
adult dragons - 12-15 man
ancient dragons - 15 man
named dragons - a superior 15 man
The problem is so many of the dragons in game are ancient or named. Shev helped this alot by creating the "ancient wyrm" race to hold the the top tier of dragons. I think there should probably be some more changes to a few dragons, especially spell quest dragons, but its not really necessary (just sucks for new players with no friends).
Still, I think a lot of us just need to get used to the idea that there are encounters that you can not just get a pickup group of random 15 50s to do. Your going to need proper groups with the right classes in the right amounts. There are going to be encounters that you need the top 15 players in the game to do without relying on tremendous luck and several spanks.
I like everything about new dragons except this para thing and how there are soo many dragons all over toril zones and especially in well traveled routes.
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