Sunray VS Prism

Feedback, bugs, and general gameplay related discussion.
Sarell
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Sunray VS Prism

Postby Sarell » Mon Apr 11, 2005 4:51 am

I think sunray should blind as many regular targets as prism does. It is quite depressing to sunray in a room of 10 or more mobs and hit 1 or none on a regular basis. Specially since sunray doesn't work in the daytime.

The other thing still oustanding with sunray is, that it is, the only area where you need to target a mob I think. This came about in the following way. Sunray was a problem because you could target room, and blind things without agroing them. So they made it you had to target something. Then you could target a pet / small ungrouped mob and do the same effect. Then they made it so that sunray agroed everything, not just the target. The problem here is, you still have to target something, so if it dies, you waste an area that you really wanted to cast anyhow. You can't even target self with it. Since it agros all now which was a good fix, perhaps make it not need to be targetted anymore.
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Postby Thilindel » Mon Apr 11, 2005 1:29 pm

except drow/duergar, I don't even bother with sunray. It just sucks too much now.
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Postby kiryan » Mon Apr 11, 2005 8:57 pm

sunray is a situational spell and seems to work really unbelievably well on undead and that alone makes it a powerful spell. it does seem quite useless for the most part in many fights, but druids either don't have anything better to do, or are refusing to alter their behavior even though the spell was downgraded several times over the years.

pris is a bit more general in use, and also quite a bit more general in the varied outcomes. You don't cast pris to blind. Not saying theres nothing wrong with the spell (since as best i can tell you don't get a save spell check on the blind), but like sunray on regular mobs, its hardly dependable.
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Postby Verarb » Mon Apr 11, 2005 9:01 pm

Yah i agree with kiryan. Druids needa alter their role/behavior.

Come chill out at 1w with me, we'll rp like the bards used to do over here.
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Postby Sarell » Tue Apr 12, 2005 12:12 pm

kiryan wrote: You don't cast pris to blind.


Exactly and yet it still blinds more mobs than sunray, and all sunray does is blind :9

I don't think sunray needs to be uber awesome, it just needs a little love so it is worth casting against a regular room of mobs. Make it PWB effect! NOG SELF :P
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Postby Dranix/Straxin » Tue Apr 12, 2005 4:09 pm

I vote we do the Budweiser frogs again.

Rilih, Deshana, and I got bored one day.

So V we just need one more :)
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Postby kiryan » Tue Apr 12, 2005 6:27 pm

The spell does work very effectively against undead... you might be lucky that it works at all on regular mobs.

I mean I can't really comment as the intent of the spell, but I'd guess that the spell is an anti-undead spell, not a general use spell.

it makes perfect sense if your willing to look at it from a different point of view.
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Postby fotex » Tue Apr 12, 2005 10:55 pm

You're also comparing a 5th circle spell against a 7th circle spell.
Prismatic spray also has negative effects, such as possibly dispelling a silence spell.

Though, I have also wondered if the save for prism blind is the same as other saves against blinding - it seems like it isn't.

You might also try sunray + sun shadow in daylight rooms, think it might work, but I haven't tried recently.
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Postby Sarell » Thu Apr 14, 2005 5:20 am

I'm trying not to directly compare it to prism because prism has so many other good effects, is a single spell of another class, and works fundamentally differently achieving a host of other results. Prism doesn't agro things it doesn't hit with a damage ray *boggle*. I am trying to look at the dilemma in which you have a spell which is only used to blind things, has a host of drawbacks, and yet doesn't work aswell to blind as a spell - prism - of which blinding is only one small effect. Kiryan is correct in saying that if it isn't meant to be used on regular mobs then it shouldn't hit so well. However since it only works not in the day I figure it has been designed with the thought in mind that it is this big huge bright flash / ray of light that is intended to blind people, especially since that is all it does.
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Postby Sarell » Thu Apr 14, 2005 10:05 am

You complete your spell...
You send a rainbow of prismatic spray from you hands.
You send a green shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
You send a azure shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
The skeletal warrior seems to be blinded!
You send a red shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
Your spell is partially absorbed by the skeletal warrior.
You send a azure shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
The skeletal warrior seems to be blinded!
You send a blue shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
You send a azure shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
The skeletal warrior seems to be blinded!



enjoy... prism pwns undead too! *duck*
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Postby shalath » Thu Apr 14, 2005 10:39 am

< 383h/549H 121v/122V >
< T: Eki TC: few wounds E: skeleton EC: small wounds P: std >
Amathiel completes her spell...
Amathiel utters the words, 'sfugwahuq gsfal'
Amathiel sends a rainbow of prismatic spray from her hands!
Amathiel sends a green shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
Amathiel sends a azure shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
The skeletal warrior seems to be blinded!
Amathiel sends a red shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
Amathiel sends a azure shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
The skeletal warrior seems to be blinded!
Amathiel sends a blue shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
Amathiel sends a azure shaft of light streaking towards the skeletal warrior!
The skeletal warrior seems to be blinded!
< 384h/549H 121v/122V >

Prism > Sunray, rockin :-)
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Postby auslyx » Thu Apr 14, 2005 4:52 pm

shalath wrote: Imphras are like the Japanese. No original ideas, but they can take a working product and perfect it and mass produce.


I'm Japanese. And i find this comment way out of line. It's racist, and full of shit. How the hell did the BBS deteriorate to a racial bashing ground?
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Postby Pril » Thu Apr 14, 2005 5:13 pm

auslyx wrote:
shalath wrote: Imphras are like the Japanese. No original ideas, but they can take a working product and perfect it and mass produce.


I'm Japanese. And i find this comment way out of line. It's racist, and full of shit. How the hell did the BBS deteriorate to a racial bashing ground?


I have to agree with Auslyx.

a) it's highly inappropriate man

b) it's not even an original comment since it's what Klandan claiming for a long time except Klandan never made any racial comparisons to the Japanese he just claimed that: "SoI has no original ideas, but they can take a working product and perfect it" not that i agree with Klandan's thinking nor is that a direct quote but that's the jist of what he's been saying. So Thalash get an original idea please don't try to perfect others original ideas. And there's no need to be racist.

Pril
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Postby rylan » Thu Apr 14, 2005 6:01 pm

Explain the purpose of attacking people in your sig?
Its bad enough there are flame wars on here in normal posts, but attaching a generalization to a race of people along with bashing players that is present in anything you post is way over the top.
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Postby Dalar » Thu Apr 14, 2005 7:05 pm

auslyx wrote:
shalath wrote: Imphras are like the Japanese. No original ideas, but they can take a working product and perfect it and mass produce.


I'm Japanese. And i find this comment way out of line. It's racist, and full of shit. How the hell did the BBS deteriorate to a racial bashing ground?


Wait, don't they?
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.
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Postby Maedor » Thu Apr 14, 2005 7:08 pm

Way to blow a lighthearted comment way out of proportion. All American's are overweight, lazy, whiney, oversensitive morons who have taken being politically correct waaaay too far. There..do I get to be flamed for being racist now too?

I have nothing whatsoever against Japanese people, and I know Thalash doesn't either. Life is too short to get your panties in a knot over a comment that was intended to be funny made on a game's BBS.

Loosen up peoples!
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Postby kiryan » Thu Apr 14, 2005 7:48 pm

auslyx wrote:
shalath wrote: Imphras are like the Japanese. No original ideas, but they can take a working product and perfect it and mass produce.


I'm Japanese. And i find this comment way out of line. It's racist, and full of shit. How the hell did the BBS deteriorate to a racial bashing ground?


how much is offense worth when your offended by something that is accurate.

Are you even real japanese?

does anyone else smell a twinky?
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Postby Eilistraee » Thu Apr 14, 2005 8:00 pm

Time to end this line of discussion. A player took offense to a statement, as is his/her right to do so. Regardless of your opinions on the validity of said statement, there is nothing further to discuss about either the comment, or the reaction to it.

Drop it please.
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Postby Dalar » Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:08 pm

I like big butts and I cannot lie.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby Vigis » Thu Apr 14, 2005 10:18 pm

Dalar wrote:I like big butts and I cannot lie.


Dalar just hurt my feelings! I have a small butt :(


Then again, it is probably better that he doesn't like my butt....
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Postby Maedor » Thu Apr 14, 2005 10:35 pm

I'm sure Klosh loves your butt...he loves butts of all flavors
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Postby Maedor » Thu Apr 14, 2005 10:39 pm

I'm sure Klosh loves your butt...he loves butts of all flavors
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Postby shalath » Fri Apr 15, 2005 11:29 am

It's a real life stereotype. All the comments about us British folk, or you American folk, or any other particular group of people, tend also to be based on stereotypes. The RL world is full of stereotypes. This was using a comparison to a RL stereotype to make a point in game, and to make folk laugh. I thought it was particularly apt, for most members of said guild (with some noteable exceptions, a few of whom have actually agreed with me privately ;-) and the analogy works well with the RL stereotype.

Auslyx: If you really feel insulted, you can always get your own back by insulting those damn paki bastards (I'm half indian, "paki" is a common UK derogatory term for people of indian/pakistani origin), swearing at those supid Polaks (I'm half Polish too, and "Polak" is a not very nice way of talking about one of Polish origin), and making jokes about the stuck up Brits (I was born and bred a Londoner). If you like. It wasn't meant that way, but feel free to take it that way and retort as required. *shrugs*

I know all about racism, try being a half-indian living in a post communist country (where for a long time the only non-whites were seen on state controlled television) and you soon find out what real racism is. In the early years after the fall of communism, I had total strangers walk up to me on the street to touch my face to see if my skin is painted on. Later in life, I had total strangers walk up to me on the street to knock me out with their fists, in full view of a local policeman who did nothing, because "foreigners" were to blame for the massive post communist unemployment. I know what racism means.

So if you think this was racist, retort as you will. I did not mean to offend you. Hontou-ni moushiwake-gozaimasen.

Rylan/Pril: come on guys, I've been expecting a sensible retort of some kind for a while now, but this isn't sensible - it's cheap and nothing more than jumping on a bandwagon. Someone else had an issue with the RL part of my sig, which actually is potentially a valid concern. I can see how he could have been upset, and I did not intend to offend him in any way. But you guys simply demean his argument by standing up and shouting about it because you have no defense to the in game part of my comment. The majority of your guild took this in the spirit it was meant - it got a lot of laughs. I'd be all for reasonable retorts, but I do expect better than this. (Well ok I don't know Rylan that well and I didn't really expect any better from pwildo, but... :-)

-thalash
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Postby fotex » Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:26 pm

Shalath, I'm offended by the comment, and would appreciate it if you would remove it from your sig.

Thanks.
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Postby Llaaldara » Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:38 pm

fotex wrote:Shalath, I'm offended by the comment, and would appreciate it if you would remove it from your sig.

Thanks.


I'm offended by you being so easily offended, and would appreciate it if you woudn't be so easily offended.
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Postby Llaaldara » Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:46 pm

Also, I'm offended by thread derailment with talks about racism and being offended, because it offends me by insulting my sensibilities and causing me undue stress. I demand compensation for my damages. So once I'm done suing myself, I'm coming after the rest of you.
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Postby Pril » Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:08 pm

Thalash don't make me smack you, i noticed that you avoided the second part of my post about how your sig is not original but is just a "perfection" of Klandan's original idea. So unless you decide to make an actual "original" statement please don't complain about others "lack of original ideas" k?

Pril
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Postby shalath » Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:11 pm

Actually Pril I agree with Klandan's very accurate observation. I'm simply restating them in a different, easier to understand and more accessible format. Us westerners do that, no? :-)
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Postby Pril » Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:21 pm

Thalash in that case let me rephrase what you seem to be saying:

"Shadows of Imphras simply does stuff in a different way that makes it easier to understand and in a more accessible format." Us original people like to take what we see people doing the hard way and make it easier in a unique original way. Then once it's easy to do and understand and teach, why change it?

:p

Pril
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ahem

Postby Verarb » Sat Apr 16, 2005 6:50 am

*Cough*DruidsSuck.
Kill two birds with one stone.

Make druids load with random artis.
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Postby Sarell » Sat Apr 16, 2005 6:59 am

Now THAT is a good idea Vman! Thalash, SoI are innovators after all *taunt*!

See you next boot with my holy treant of debauchery!
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Postby Jhorr » Sun Apr 17, 2005 7:01 pm

The majority of Imphras have no original ideas, but they can take a working product and perfect it and mass produce.


A provocative idea, but logically incorrect. The majority of the guild don't lead much and therefore they don't mass produce much at all.
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Postby kiryan » Tue Apr 19, 2005 1:41 am

i mass produce

*grunt*

*flush*

post_count++
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Postby daggaz » Mon May 23, 2005 10:45 am

You don't cast prism to blind??!

boggle

I just cast it to blind, para, feeb, debuff, and damage. But gotta admit, when walking into a big room and casting prism on entry before i start glancing the tank....um yeah, blind is actually the main thing im hoping for. And generally, it works.
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Postby Birile » Mon May 23, 2005 3:10 pm

1) Making sunray target to be cast is stupid, and I believe an Imm mentioned awhile back that he would look into it. I would say it was Shev but I don't want to misquote.

2) Sunray doesn't "just" blind, it also causes damage to undead. I'm sure it's not uber damage, but it's something.

3)Comparing a circle 5 spell to a circle 7 spell in an attempt to get sunray upgraded is silly.

4) Some people think sunray > glitterdust (two spells that are much better suited to be compared against one another), so at least you can take comfort in that. Personally, I think they're both great, and each has different drawbacks, but that's just me.

Cheers!
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Postby Dranix/Straxin » Mon May 23, 2005 6:38 pm

Too tired to read the rest of the post, but has it been mentioned that sunray only works at night? Yet another druid spell that has to meet a certain criteria to be able to be used.

Might as well just give us a magic 8-ball so we can ask: Magic 8-Ball, will we be able to use our spells today? *Dranix shakes the 8-ball violently and waits patiently for his response* He looks down into the little window and shakes his head while laughing to himself. "Outlook Not So Good" He shakes it again "My Sources Say No"

Laughing hysterically he shatters the orb against the nearest tree.
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Postby Ragorn » Tue May 24, 2005 9:41 am

So wait, sunray can only be used at night now, and it doesn't blind anything? And this is a druid spell? Remove it from druids, double the cast time, make it single target, make it 10th circle, and give it to Rangers. Then remove create water to compensate.

God bless the Japanese, because Tekken 5 didn't come out for your stupid American Eks-Box!
- Ragorn
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Postby Ragorn » Tue May 24, 2005 9:43 am

Lag makes the baby jesus double post.
Last edited by Ragorn on Wed May 25, 2005 10:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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But...

Postby Ssolsinorr » Tue May 24, 2005 2:16 pm

But the original final fantasy head honcho is now working for stupid american xbox and designed 2 new games to entice the Japanese market.

Plus heard something about final fantasy XI going to be on xbox as well?

Anyhow I have all the systems and managed a vid game store, I like xbox overall but the PS2 has some exclusives that make it worth owning same as Gamecube hehe.

Happy Gaming!

Sol
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Postby moritheil » Thu May 26, 2005 6:48 pm

Birile wrote:1) Making sunray target to be cast is stupid, and I believe an Imm mentioned awhile back that he would look into it. I would say it was Shev but I don't want to misquote.

2) Sunray doesn't "just" blind, it also causes damage to undead. I'm sure it's not uber damage, but it's something.

3)Comparing a circle 5 spell to a circle 7 spell in an attempt to get sunray upgraded is silly.

4) Some people think sunray > glitterdust (two spells that are much better suited to be compared against one another), so at least you can take comfort in that. Personally, I think they're both great, and each has different drawbacks, but that's just me.

Cheers!


1. That's the way it's always been. What would you propose?

2. Unless they changed it, it does maybe 50 or so damage, and usually only to the undead mob targeted. That's something, true, but the question here is "is Sunray useful for zoning?" and I don't think someone would want to use a 5th circle slot to do 50 damage in a zone. (Let's not forget, a lot of undead have MR too . . . ) Heck, I'm all for removing the damage if you just set sunray back to blinding as much as it used to before Kia tooled with it.

3. No argument there. Pris should indeed be more powerful, and it is, with chances for significant damage and para as well as the chance to blind.

4. Glitterdust isn't guaranteed to fail half the time of day, but that's an entirely different discussion, isn't it?
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Postby moritheil » Thu May 26, 2005 7:17 pm

kiryan wrote:sunray is a situational spell and seems to work really unbelievably well on undead and that alone makes it a powerful spell. it does seem quite useless for the most part in many fights, but druids either don't have anything better to do, or are refusing to alter their behavior even though the spell was downgraded several times over the years.


What would you suggest druids use their 5th circle for? I mem one dispel magic to counter paras, one vigorize crit for when the rogue is dragging stuff, and the rest are sunrays.

Here's the problem:

YES, druids have other spells, like doom and hail. However, druids are almost never brought for damage. As such, you can imagine the scenarios:

1. Druid is brought to well, rock to mud, and sunray. The group therefore wants the druid to keep sunraying even though the blind chance on each cast is relatively low (the druid is the dedicated blinder).

2. Druid is brought for damage (rare scenario, but I've been in it.) The druid exhausts their dooms and 9th level area spell slots and the enemies (usually) still aren't dead, so they need more areas to finish the fight off. What are they left with? Quake and sunray. I haven't seen a druid mem cyclones in years, unless doing brass/FP, as it's not really big damage vs. mobs. Either way, you can stick cyclones in and you'll still run out before the fight is over, IF you are damage. It's either that or single targets. All of those options are relatively useless compared to their higher nukes. This is a "ran out of spells" problem, and not inherently really related to sunray.

3. Druid is brought to do whatever, and damage is covered.

"Well, gee, I could cast doom, but by the time I'm done casting, the invokers have taken the enemies to PH/Awful, and I've spent the entire fight casting a really long spell and looking like a ponce. Then, when the leader moves right after, I can be the one who accidentally agroes the wandering mobs that we don't need to fight because doom is now active.

"I could cast hail, but we're indoors, and I can't remember the last time I actually slowed something worth slowing with it. I could also cast flame blade, but that only affects one target and is a relatively useless thing to do when we have invokers. That will just cause people like Dalar and Kiryan to mock me for casting damage spells.

"I could cast quake, but we aren't fighting giants, and the group will be pissed off if I quake our ghealers/stoners to the ground.

"I could be suffocating people, and I am trying, but some wiseguy assigned me four vits, so I only get one or two suffocates, and frankly, ice tongue has me beat by miles. To say nothing of sandblast, because it's a much higher circle spell.

"I could try to heal the blinded people, except, whoops, we have ghealers, so I'm not really needed there.

"That leaves me with . . . sunray. Maybe I can hope that I blind things and look useful."
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Postby fotex » Thu May 26, 2005 9:49 pm

moritheil wrote:What would you suggest druids use their 5th circle for? I mem one dispel magic to counter paras, one vigorize crit for when the rogue is dragging stuff, and the rest are sunrays.


It's a 5th circle spell. You should feel lucky that it is even useful. Most classes rarely touch that circle unless they have to. I challenge you to name a spell at that circle that is as useful in a fight.


moritheil wrote:YES, druids have other spells, like doom and hail. However, druids are almost never brought for damage.


Well, in the pantheon of area damage, I think the ranking is probably something like this:
invokers
liches
druids
elementalists
shamans
necromancers
illusionists
enchanters
clerics

Given the utility that druids have (and the lack of utility that invokers and liches to some extent), I think this position is fitting.

For target damage, I think the ranking is probably something like this:
invokers
liches
illusionists
necromancers
elementalists
druids
shamans
enchanters
clerics

But target damage is more important to soloing than zoning.

moritheil wrote:2. Druid is brought for damage (rare scenario, but I've been in it.) The druid exhausts their dooms and 9th level area spell slots and the enemies (usually) still aren't dead, so they need more areas to finish the fight off. What are they left with? Quake and sunray.


So repray your dooms then. It's a common tactic that all classes employ in long fights.

moritheil wrote:"I could cast hail, but we're indoors, and I can't remember the last time I actually slowed something worth slowing with it. I could also cast flame blade, but that only affects one target and is a relatively useless thing to do when we have invokers. That will just cause people like Dalar and Kiryan to mock me for casting damage spells.


If your group is rushing through a zone, just watch what you cast, so that your mems don't slow down the group.

Seriously, it just looks like you're bored of playing druid. I recommend you roll a new character and experience the game from a new viewpoint.
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Postby kiryan » Thu May 26, 2005 10:37 pm

Reasons to bring a druid to zone:
rock to mud
suffocate
sunray
damage
moonwell
bark

I mean really what are we complaining about here, druids enjoy frequent group invites from what I see and sunray is unbelievably effective against undead. While its true that sunray used to be a class defining spell for druids, I think it has been undermined over time and probably rightfully so yet the deseriability of the class has not changed much because of additions like rock to mud, suffocate, and fire seeds.

So f*king what if sunray doesn't blind as often as it used to, as often as prismatic spray or as often as glitterdust? Its still a staple spell even with all the downgrades over the years.... that should indicate how broken it was in the past.
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Postby sotana » Thu May 26, 2005 11:03 pm

For those who are not familiar with druid sunray and are unclear as to exactly what it does and when it works, yes sunray will not work outdoors, during the day, with !undead mobs. It does, however, work indoors at any time of day and on undead at any time of day indoors or outdoors. (And when I say it 'works' I don't mean it blinds everything in range but just that it has a chance to)

What it means is that druids, much like many other classes, are more useful in some zones than others. Take a druid to Meilich and watch some group member's 'MOB BLINDED' triggers go batty. It's fun for the whole family, I promise!

I agree with Birile that glitterdust vs. sunray is a better comparison and have seen zones where glitterdust blinds madly while sunray blinds rarely (even indoors) but have seen the reverse in other zones.

Same with suffocate. I've noticed zones where suffocate seems to land faster/better than ice tongue and also zones where I can't land a suffocate to save my life.

For me, it just means I need to know my zones so I don't mindlessly cast spells that aren't all that useful in that zone. But I have never been to a zone where I didn't feel like I had nothing much uniquely useful to contribute beyond my initial well to get the group to the zone. And yes, I would LOVE to see my sunray land more often just cuz the mass blinding of mobs is strangely addictive but I don't really feel druids are underpowered because of it...we're just...'special' :-P Different classes have different drawbacks/strengths. Druids don't have the insane multi-purpose damage of invokers but fortunately, between barkskin, heal, vit, etc, we also don't have the fragility of vokers, etc etc etc.

I realize this discussion was started as a comment on sunray vs. prism and I have ranted on quite a bit beyond that :-P The druid class is a great class with a lot of abilities that allow you to do some very unique things and is quite well balanced in my opinion (altho yes, I do think it sucks to cast doom at ant farm and have half of the ants out of range and half of the remainder only incapped by my uber-damage spell :-P but this kind of problem with area spells is not unique to druids).

P.S. Hey Foxxy, from my experience I would put druids above elems for target damage. Generally speaking, once you run out of earthbloods, your target spells are not all that damaging (hrm...altho earth stones can do some decent damage depending on the mob and the room you're in). Druids can use spiked stones/fire seeds, flame blade. Oh and sticks to snakes can also do decent damage if you're in a nature room. I'd be interested to hear the thoughts of other folks with druids and elems on this topic tho.
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Postby Sarell » Fri May 27, 2005 9:49 am

fotex wrote:It's a 5th circle spell. You should feel lucky that it is even useful. Most classes rarely touch that circle unless they have to. I challenge you to name a spell at that circle that is as useful in a fight.


Cleric Vit
Chanter Stone
Heal

They're not bad...

Anyhow, first step, can we at least make sunray so you don't have to target the mob, since how that does nothing but be incredibly annoying and halt your casting of an area spell when a single mob dies.
Arishae group-says 'mah sunray brings all the boys to the yard'
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Postby Birile » Fri May 27, 2005 2:36 pm

I agree that sunray shouldn't need to be targetted, but that's the only "upgrade" I would give it.

I also agree 150% with Sotana's post (I may be biased :wink: ), and also think druids rank higher than elementalists in terms of targetted damage, for the reasons she gave. I also think illusionists deserve a higher ranking in the area damage department by FAR, but that's another topic. :D
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Postby kiryan » Fri May 27, 2005 6:22 pm

i was thinking that disruption burst was retarded because it needed to be targetted. then i noticed that my target was dieing a lot faster than the other mobs. if its targeted, its likely its targetted for some sort of positive benefit.
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Postby Sarell » Fri May 27, 2005 9:38 pm

It was changed to targetted because blind never used to agro mobs. So you could blind stuff without getting agro. Then it got made so that it agros everything. But still remained requiring a target. Making the other change redundant, but still having its annoyances.
Arishae group-says 'mah sunray brings all the boys to the yard'
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Postby daggaz » Wed Aug 10, 2005 9:27 pm

Apparently this thread was hijacked by some people who actually care about the difference between prism and sunray, rather than just casting the more appropriate spell at the appropriate time.

To get it back on track...
The quote was racist, which is against the rules (imagine if he said all black people were genetically more suitable for life as a slave), and not even accurate.

The japanese have invented THOUSANDS of new things. They are famous for it. Not just improving old things.

Tho that part is accurate too...they are good at improving old things. For example, take the square watermelon. Grown in a clear plastic box from the time the flower is first fertalized in a hydroponic greenhouse, the watermelon develops and ultimately fills the confines of its container, resulting in a delectable fruit which is also extremely space efficient, giving rise to far more order in stockpiles of said fruit, as well as more extra space for japanese beer cans (which are still cylindrical, oddly enough) in your typical microscopic tokyo refrigerator.
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Postby Lenefir » Thu Aug 11, 2005 1:58 pm

Originally posted on the Shades of Twilight's Guild BBS a (long) while ago, but perhaps someone interested in numbers might find it useful... or something...

From what I remember, the selection of mobs varied from hobgoblins on Evermeet, single mobs for (quest) items and so on to (somewhat) bigger zones like SF, Jot, Muspel, Spob and Izan's.

---

For what it's worth:

From (only) 18137 logged prismatic spray shafts:

2322 or 12.8% red (most damage)
2321 or 12.8% orange (medium damage)
2230 or 12.3% yellow (least damage)
2244 or 12.4% blue (major paralysis)
2264 or 12.5% indigo (feeblemind)
2308 or 12.7% green (poison)
2226 or 12.3% violet (dispel magic)
2222 or 12.2% azure (blindness)

So fairy evenly distributed.

A total of 974 (5.4%) rays got shrugged by magic resistance.

Of the 2244 blue (paralysis) rays, 152 got shrugged, but 169 (169/2244 = 7.5%, or 169/(2244-152) = 8.1%) successfully landed a paralysis.
Of the 2222 azure (blindness) rays, 117 got shrugged, but 1443 (1443/2222 = 64.9%, or 1443/(2222-117) = 68.6%) successfully landed a blindness.
So on average (1443+169)/18137 = 8.9% of all the prism rays will blind or para a mob or player, but if you are already hit by a blinding ray, the statistics says you more often than not will get blinded.

Of the 2264 indigo (feeblemind) rays, 22 got shrugged, but 317 (317/2264 = 14.0%, or 317/(2264-22) = 14.1%) successfully landed a feeblemind. (How often that was on a casting mob is a little hard to tell from the logs though.)

HOWEVER

Of the 2226 violet (dispel magic) rays, 122 got shrugged, but 551 (551/2226 = 24.8%, or 551/(2226-122) = 26.2%) successfully dispelled the magic on a mob or player.
So, if hit by the violet ray, the mob or player will get dispelled from what already affected them 1 of 4 times, or on the greater scope 551/18137 = 3.0%. (How often this was a good thing, a bad thing, or didn't matter is a little hard to tell from the logs though.)

SO IN SUMMARY

8.9% (9.4% ignoring MR) of the prism rays will blind or para a mob or player, and 1.7% (1.8% ignoring MR) of the times will the mob be feebleminded, however 3.0% (3.2% ignoring MR) of the times this or any other spells the mob (notably silence) or player (notably scales, globe, vitality) have will get dispelled.

*ponder*
"Being God isn't easy. If you do too much, people get dependent on you; and if you do nothing, they lose hope. You have to use a light touch [...]. When you do things right, people won't be sure you have done anything at all"
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