6 weeks later, tiamat still not in game.

Feedback, bugs, and general gameplay related discussion.
kiryan
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6 weeks later, tiamat still not in game.

Postby kiryan » Wed Apr 27, 2005 9:56 pm

Tiamat is still out. six weeks have passed since the last time I posted a thread on this.

I ask again that someone spend 2 or 3 hours and put the old tiamat back in / make it accessible until you get around to fixing the new one.

Its utterly ridiculous that after 4 years it is still out of the game and still coming soon. At this point, I don't really care if its 99% done, put the old one back in until you have the new one ready. I'm not even asking you to make it doable at this point, just put it back in the game and let us see if its possible with the current dragon code (not like we don't already do that with every new high end zone).

You guys should've never removed her in the first place unless you had the new tiamat ready to go. Tiamat has been a complete project management failure. Now do your best to rectify that by creating a parallel project with realistic goals.

After 4 years, can you blame me for being an ass?
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Postby Gura » Wed Apr 27, 2005 10:14 pm

+1.
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Postby Gyrx » Thu Apr 28, 2005 12:16 am

i'd most likely come back for tiamat
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Postby Jaeth » Thu Apr 28, 2005 1:48 pm

I'd have to agree with Kiryan. I'm not that concerned about whether the old Tiamat is put back, but rather by the lack of status updates by immortals.

This is in no way meant as an insult. Everyone understands the immortals do stuff in their spare time, and don't get paid for doing it, and real life issues are more important.

People wouldn't be that upset or peeved if we were given regular updates on how things are progressing. Even, for example, if an immortal said zone/change X is planned for Y date, and it doesn't happen for whatever reason, people would be more understanding if they were made aware of the situation, rather than left in the darkness.

A 4 year project, with the last update 6 weeks ago, with no indication of what's happening is, quite frankly, not showing much respect for the players who have been loyal to the mud over the many upheavals.

Similarly, whilst the Homeland integration could have been the opportunity to re-ignite player's interest, I think the lack of progress (1.5 months? since integration, <10 zones, none of which are high-end), doesn't look too favourably. Even the fabled Menzo didn't cause much of a stir - I'm not too sure the daylight bug in Menzo/UD is even fixed yet.

Please don't take this as a whine post. Everyone appreciates the hard work the immortals put into the mud, but we're just asking for regular (1/week?) updates.

A stagnant mud won't appeal to many people.

Thanks.

PS - Can an immortal please comment :)
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Postby Vigis » Thu Apr 28, 2005 2:08 pm

Jaeth wrote:People wouldn't be that upset or peeved if we were given regular updates on how things are progressing. Even, for example, if an immortal said zone/change X is planned for Y date, and it doesn't happen for whatever reason, people would be more understanding if they were made aware of the situation, rather than left in the darkness.


Hate to say it, but yes they would, and no they wouldn't.
Nerox tells you 'Good deal, the other tanks I have don't wanna do it, and since your my special suicidal tank i figure you don't mind one bit!'

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Postby Eilistraee » Thu Apr 28, 2005 2:22 pm

To the best of my knowledge, the known issues with Menzo daylight have been corrected. If you or anybody encounter any others, please let us know.

Adapting areas from one codebase to a different one isn't a simple task, and we've run into numerous hurdles that had been completely unexpected. A lot of my coding time has gone into adapting some of our code to help pave the way, but there are still a lot of hurdles.

As for Tiamat, afraid I can't offer any enlightenment on that front. Nor can I offer status updates on any other projects that are in the works, as it is up to the Forgers to determine how much information to distill out. And the Admin Forger, the sphere that deals most directly with player concerns, has already expained her situation.
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Postby Vaprak » Thu Apr 28, 2005 3:09 pm

I was gone for quite some time during the month of April with RL fun.

I'm back now, catching up on my housework, and will be continuing with my myriad areas projects very shortly, at which time you should see more Homeland zones start to filter in again at a much faster pace.

Also coming in shortly will be major updates to a long-neglected part of the world.

Here's Tom with the weather.
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Postby Ashiwi » Thu Apr 28, 2005 3:35 pm

Vigis wrote:
Jaeth wrote:People wouldn't be that upset or peeved if we were given regular updates on how things are progressing. Even, for example, if an immortal said zone/change X is planned for Y date, and it doesn't happen for whatever reason, people would be more understanding if they were made aware of the situation, rather than left in the darkness.


Hate to say it, but yes they would, and no they wouldn't.


What Vigis said. I've seen it way too many times to believe otherwise. The more information the staff gives the players, the more the players bitch, moan and complain. The more feedback the staff gives, the more demands the players make. It's really a !win battle.
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Postby kiryan » Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:43 pm

who da f*ck cares why anymore? stop sidetracking. this isn't a thread about updates. 4 years... at a point reasons we lose that sympathy/empathy that makes them more than excuses. at this point, i really dont care if someone died.

Tiamat needs to come back in the next 3 weeks.

Or are we so dysfunctional of an organization that we can't re-imp an old zone in a fair amount of time?

and i appreciate the work done b y most of the staff, but this is seriously f*d up. how many of you want this on your resume, promised a project for 4 years and never implemented.

tiamat has been a complete failure. fix it.
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Postby Eilistraee » Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:58 pm

No, she does not.

This mud will not cease to exist if Tiamat does not return within the next three weeks.

I'm sorry if it leaves your mudding experience devoid of satisfaction, but tiamat will be re-implemented when she is ready. No amount of posts, complaints or demands will change that.

Thanks.
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Postby kiryan » Thu Apr 28, 2005 7:05 pm

yes, the administration has demonstrated throughout the years that they will do whatever they think is best. they certianly shouldn't bow to demands by a player, but when enough people want something you give it to them. I think we have a great staff with minor exception, and a great staff should recognize that when you've failed to deliver on a promise for 4 years you make an adjustment. we are working on it is not an adjustment, when its ready is not a change in approach or attitude, "soon" is the same thing we've been hearing for 4 years. STOP TALKING ABOUT IT AND DO SOMETHING.

4 years ago there was an expectation that tiamat would be back in within a month maybe 2. FOUR YEARS AGO. I mean really it doesnt matter what anyone says because I'll just say FOUR YEARS and you pretty can't say anything.

we have sat back praying hoping that someone will do something for 4 freaking years. im tired of waiting. many of us are tired of waiting. we want tiamat. we need tiamat. give us what we need what we like what we want. no one can deny that tiamat is a complete project management failure, stop protecting the ideal the integrity of the game and do something about this mismanagement of tiamat.

i'm hoping to generate enough noise that the administration will find it a good decision to reimplement old tiamat immediately rather than whenever new tiamat is ready.

so if your pissed off that tiamat is still out, please post your support.
Last edited by kiryan on Thu Apr 28, 2005 7:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Ashiwi » Thu Apr 28, 2005 7:15 pm

Resume:

Spent several years in Toril Inc. fixing everybody else's problems. Was involved in a four year goal, but the boss kept driving away the team that was working on it. Got yelled at more than a Wal-Mart employee on a Saturday sale afternoon. Continued coding and working on my own projects, full list will cover the next six pages, but with staff turnover and general malaise due to low morale, four year goal never completed. Never received paycheck for work performed on any project. Only thing written on paystub were complaints. Lost family, lost house, lost car, dog left, am in Alcoholic's Anonymous now, and think I'm doing okay. Actually, will probably never want to work in this field again. Please take job and shove it, as I am staying home to cry over lost years.
Gormal tells you 'im a dwarven onion'
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'

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Postby kiryan » Thu Apr 28, 2005 7:21 pm

your not helping ashiwi. stay on topic. the topic is what are we going to do about getting tiamat back in the game, not why tiamat isn't in the game and my sad self inflicted life at torilmud.

feel free to start a thread about how the volunteers are abused and how we should worship and martyr them.
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Postby Lahgen » Thu Apr 28, 2005 7:54 pm

It's not an "either-or" situation, Kiryan. To me, it's a "quit whining about Tiamat already" situation. :p Admittedly, I've never seen Tiamat in action, so perhaps she really is worth all the whining, who knows.
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Rather than seeing "subpar race/class," see "challenge."
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Postby Ashiwi » Thu Apr 28, 2005 9:09 pm

kiryan wrote:feel free to start a thread about how the volunteers are abused and how we should worship and martyr them.


While there are several staff members I would love to have the opportunity to martyr personally, that might be a bit drastic for this situation.

Wasn't Dug the one supposed to be working on Tia before he... ummmm... left?

Lahgen, I can understand Kiryan's position on Tia, because Kiryan has basically gone as far as he can in Toril and he's bumping his head on the ceiling, all the time knowing there's more room up there somewhere. Kiryan needs a new challenge, and instead of wandering off to find it somewhere else he's seeking it here within the game. That's actually a good thing for us as players, as it's one less lost player for the moment. Kiryan and I may disagree on tactics used, but the point can still not be denied.

Since we have no pwipe, many of the long-term players are either hitting that same ceiling, or have already hit it. Some of them are hanging around, hoping for more, some have already left. It's a two-way street... players want more content and bitch, staff is getting tired of bitching and are starting to disappear. As far as I can tell, the job of finishing Tia has been shuffled around more than once, and whomever is in charge of it now probably realizes all they have to look forward to when it's done is MASSIVE complaints about whatever changes were made. That's not exactly incentive.

Another point to consider, here. Once Tia's been done a dozen or so times, what comes after that? That's one reason I was hoping no changes would be made to Magma to make it easier, because we need ass-kicking zones with worthwhile rewards still.

So, now that that's done... Do you guys up there think you're closer to having Tia finished?

Is there any ETA on any new zones? I know there's tons in the queue, if we include Homeland's zones.

If so, then thank you.
Gormal tells you 'im a dwarven onion'
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'

Inama ASSOC:: 'though it may suit your fantasies to think so, i don't need oil for anything.'

Haley: Filthy lucre? I wash that lucre every day until it SHINES!
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Postby kiryan » Thu Apr 28, 2005 9:15 pm

dude, i read your post 10x and i couldnt understand it. what is this either-or situation. either old tiamat or new tiamat? i dont give a rats ass which one comes in as long as one of them comes in in short order.

if you don't care whether tiamat comes in this year next year or never then find another thread to post in.

this thread is a call to implement tiamat immediately one way or the other pushing for a realistic goal ie putting old tiamat back in.
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Postby Yayaril » Thu Apr 28, 2005 11:42 pm

8)

Hey Kiryan, would it make you feel better if I traded you my tiamat belt? PSYCHE!!
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Postby Cyric » Fri Apr 29, 2005 2:26 pm

Kiryan, here's the final answer from the areas forger:

1) Old Tiamat will never be put back in. Is unbalanced, too easy to do with current player power, and makes no sense. I'm sure you'll find reason to disagree with all of those reasons, but i'm forger, and you're not. Ha!

2) This is a game, and comparing it to a resume is inappropriate. I have a huge 10 page resume that I use all the time, and this game, although it's sucked up as much time as my teaching, research, grant writing, etc, ain't on it.

3) New Tiamat was slated to go in a few months ago, but didn't for reasons beyond our control. If you don't want to hear "it's almost done and will come in soon", then don't ask. For the record, it's almost done, and will come in soon.

4) I work on areas stuff including new Homeland integration most everyday. We've chosen to implement Homeland zones in blocks rather than one at a time. A big block is slated to come in within 3 weeks with another to follow soon thereafter.

You might not want to believe it, but here are the facts:

-All of the immortals have fulltime jobs and/or families
-All of the immortals contribute to the game as much as their schedules allow
-If this all causes that much stress in your life, you need to not be playing. It's a game and should be fun. There are a billion games available...find one that gives you enjoyment and makes your palms sweat if this one doesn't.

Peace out. Oh, and I had a baby last week. Yay me! Maybe he'll be the one to finish Tiamat!
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Postby Vigis » Fri Apr 29, 2005 2:48 pm

Gratz on the baby Cyric! Hoping your wife had it, I know I wouldn't be able to sit down if I popped one out :)

Out of curiousity, what subject do you teach so that I can then start a post and taunt you for not replying?

*Grin*
Nerox tells you 'Good deal, the other tanks I have don't wanna do it, and since your my special suicidal tank i figure you don't mind one bit!'



Alurissi tells you 'aren't you susposed to get sick or something and not beable to make tia so i can go? :P'
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Postby Ashiwi » Fri Apr 29, 2005 2:51 pm

Wow, grats Cyric!!!!

I'm glad to know you got that alcoholism under control and that your wife came back. Ever seen the dog again?
Gormal tells you 'im a dwarven onion'
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'

Inama ASSOC:: 'though it may suit your fantasies to think so, i don't need oil for anything.'

Haley: Filthy lucre? I wash that lucre every day until it SHINES!
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Postby Yayaril » Fri Apr 29, 2005 3:42 pm

8)

Congratulations Cyric, I didn't even know you were pregnant!
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Fri Apr 29, 2005 3:49 pm

So thats how you got Menzo in!
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Postby rylan » Fri Apr 29, 2005 3:58 pm

Lol grats Cyric!
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Postby Gura » Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:36 pm

Cyric's child....can he approve unbalanced zones too? Agreed with tiamat here. More attention should be paid to her and less to importing homeland zones. Why not just bring over homeland's tiamat? It already looks like the same dragon coding anyway.
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Postby kiryan » Fri Apr 29, 2005 9:27 pm

Thanks for your input Cyric. Congrats on the new baby.

I hope you realize that I respect everything you guys do, but I'm still going to run an aggressive campaign of shame and confrontation until tiamat comes in. I'm sure your past being manipulated by such things, but I don't know what else to do. I dont know how it helps, im sure it just pisses the staff off, but waiting somewhat patiently hasn't worked for 4 years. If there is something constructive any of us can do let us know.

in closing, 4 years.
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Postby Ambar » Fri Apr 29, 2005 9:54 pm

why not apply for an areasbuilding position, Kiryan, and help them finish building it?

rofl .. imagine hl's tiamat (maggot pit anyone??) and the bitching that would arise :P:P:P:P

oops .. signature line removed !!
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Postby Vaprak » Fri Apr 29, 2005 10:09 pm

kiryan wrote: If there is something constructive any of us can do let us know.

in closing, 4 years.


Vote for pedro.

[seriousness]
If you want to know what works for me, possitive comments general tend to get me more motivated. Just one nice thing said about something I've done here or there tends to do wonders for my self image and seems to validate in my mind the countless hours I spend on doing things that I hope will make someone happy in some way or another.

Bitching, moaning, complaining, whining, badgering, etc ad nausem generally tend to have the opposite effect, for me at least. I'm pretty sure pretty much every other staff member has pretty much the same thing working for them.

So, like I've said before if you, the general mud populace, want the staff to get things done faster, pour some honey on instead of all the vinegar. Maybe ya'll could try saying something nice every now and then instead of going out of your ways to make everyone feel like sh*t nearly to the point of wanting to quit or go away for long peroids of time. I'd think a lot more stuff would have gotten done by now with a whole lot of projects if a handfull of staff members hadn't gotten so fed up with overall attitudes that they just simply gave up and left.

Me personally, it's just a game, and when it starts to look less like a game and more like work, with the associated looming customer deadlines, project management, consumer relations issues, stress, and the same low pay I've gotta take a step back, take a deep breath and decide whether it's worth it. Then I just shrug my shoulders, have another beer, and go back to doing things the way I was doing them before I let all of the BS work me up. :P

This isn't pointed at anyone in particular, as we're all guilty of being callous and mean-spirited on this BBS in one form or another at one point in time or another, but you asked what you could do to help and I'm giving my suggestion.[/serious]

Yay maggot pit!
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Postby Todrael » Fri Apr 29, 2005 11:37 pm

Tiamat was boring, and too easy, even though I lost 50. Miax had delusions about the zone, and basically let everyone win. I remember a time when Drow were 'coming soon'. I think that lasted 10 years. I remember lots of 'coming soons' that lasted years and years. I thought I was generally patient, but this mud makes it a habit of never delivering things that are wanted, things that are needed.

Note, I said the mud, not the staff. Varying staffers have provided excellent boosts to the game. Unfortunately, these benefits tend to be strictly limited to certain spheres within the game, such as a particular class, or a certain skill. There are now a million inconsistencies, where conditions should be the same, based on the same logic, but they differ wildly.

At any rate, it's not a fun game without the right people and the right challenges. And Torilmud has neither.
-Todrael Azz'miala, Ravager
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Postby Jaeth » Sat Apr 30, 2005 11:22 am

Thanks Eilistraee, Vaprak, and Cyric for the updates.

In my post I never asked to be informed of what's coming in terms of new changes regarding code classes/skills etc. I only asked that for the projects that have been slated to come in and announced, such as HL zones, Tiamat, guildhalls etc, that a regular update be given.

Please try to put a message in the news fortnightly at least, to inform players of progress (even if it's to say no work done..all staff busy with rl).

Thanks for your time.
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Postby Nurpy Fuzzyfeet » Sat Apr 30, 2005 6:32 pm

kiryan wrote:Thanks for your input Cyric. Congrats on the new baby.

I hope you realize that I respect everything you guys do, but I'm still going to run an aggressive campaign of shame and confrontation until tiamat comes in. I'm sure your past being manipulated by such things, but I don't know what else to do. I dont know how it helps, im sure it just pisses the staff off, but waiting somewhat patiently hasn't worked for 4 years. If there is something constructive any of us can do let us know.

in closing, 4 years.


You need a girlfriend. To run a complaint compaign about a free-to-play volunteer ran game shows to me a severe problem of having too much time on your hands.

Wanna do something constructive? Take a break from the mud for a while, save the staff the headache of your 'aggressive campaign'. I don't mean that in an insulting way, but taking breaks from the mud here and there always rejuvenates things for me when I start to feel burnt out.

Patience IS the best alternative.

Nurpy
Aristan group-says 'nurpy=tripod'

Shevarash GCC: 'Tiamat stands here, fighting Nurpy.'
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Postby Lathander » Sat Apr 30, 2005 7:23 pm

kiryan wrote:
Thanks for your input Cyric. Congrats on the new baby.

I hope you realize that I respect everything you guys do, but I'm still going to run an aggressive campaign of shame and confrontation until tiamat comes in. I'm sure your past being manipulated by such things, but I don't know what else to do. I dont know how it helps, im sure it just pisses the staff off, but waiting somewhat patiently hasn't worked for 4 years. If there is something constructive any of us can do let us know.

*LAUGH*
Wow, this could be one of the funnier things I've ever read. Negative reinforcement can get ppl not to do things, rarely does it get them to do the things you want, much less do them the way you want them. "Shame and Confrontation" ROFL

Lath

"Optimism doesn't wait on facts. It deals with prospects. Pessimism is a waste of time."
-- Norman Cousins
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Postby Salen » Sat Apr 30, 2005 8:39 pm

Too bad Lathander doesn't know what negative reinforcement is 8(

Anyone want a psychology lecture? 30ish hours of it for a masters, so I'd hate for it to go to waste.
emote Rescuepractice
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Postby teflor the ranger » Sun May 01, 2005 1:21 am

kiryan wrote:who da f*ck cares why anymore? stop sidetracking. this isn't a thread about updates. 4 years... at a point reasons we lose that sympathy/empathy that makes them more than excuses. at this point, i really dont care if someone died.

Tiamat needs to come back in the next 3 weeks.


Kiryan, Kiryan, Kiryan,

if only you had the patience of a ranger.
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Postby Sylvos » Sun May 01, 2005 2:18 am

Indeed.

Code: Select all

help trap
TRAP
Applied skill.

Syntax:         trap
Aggressive:     Yes
Class/Level:    Ranger/Dire Raider 5th

COMING SOON

This skill allows you to set a trap within your current location.
When another creature walks into the room, it may trigger the trap and
suffer a loss of hit points.  The chances of something triggering the
trap and the resulting damage done are dependent on the level
difference between you and the triggerer, as well as your proficiency
in the skill.  At the moment, only one trap can be set in a room.  It
costs some movement points to lay a trap.
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Postby Ashiwi » Sun May 01, 2005 2:40 am

Negative reinforcement works best when there's no way to avoid the negative stimulus and that negative stimulus is a greater price to pay than the action required to defer it.
Gormal tells you 'im a dwarven onion'
Gormal tells you 'always another beer-soaked layer'

Inama ASSOC:: 'though it may suit your fantasies to think so, i don't need oil for anything.'

Haley: Filthy lucre? I wash that lucre every day until it SHINES!
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Postby kiryan » Sun May 01, 2005 4:11 am

well crap, i guess no one else is as cranky as i am about tiamat not being in the game or everyone else is too scared to say crap (or probably just nicer).

guess i'll just shut up then since this position has no support and isnt popular.
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Sun May 01, 2005 4:22 am

kiryan wrote:well crap, i guess no one else is as cranky as i am about tiamat not being in the game or everyone else is too scared to say crap (or probably just nicer).

guess i'll just shut up then since this position has no support and isnt popular.


I don't think it's a case of we're not as cranky about it, or are scared.

I think it's a matter of what good will it do? It's never done any good, why on earth would it start making a difference now?
Shevarash OOC: 'what can I say, I'm attracted to crazy chicks and really short dudes'
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Postby Ragorn » Sun May 01, 2005 7:59 am

kiryan wrote:well crap, i guess no one else is as cranky as i am about tiamat not being in the game or everyone else is too scared to say crap (or probably just nicer).

guess i'll just shut up then since this position has no support and isnt popular.


I can give you another rehash of the same lecture I give every year or so when the bitching reaches critical mass. The first sentence is, "If Toril, in its current state, is not the game you are interested in playing, then perhaps it's time for you to cut the cord, look around the internet a little, and find the game that fits your needs."

My ten year anniversary with Sojourn/Toril is coming up next year. In that time, I have not once, not ever, not even a little bit, seen any bit of code be implemented after a long bitchy forum thread. It took probably six years for Track to be implemented. Sylvos beat me to the "help trap" quote. I've been around this mud for nine years, and "Ranger fixes" threads are just as prevalant on the forums today as they were the day I rolled Ragorn for the first time. Things do not get done around here in direct response to player feedback. Just let it go. In fact, just for you, I will enable my sig for this reply, which I haven't done in months.

Look around you. Tiamat is not a breaking point for most of the players here anymore. The people who were frustrated by Tia's absence have long since left already. The current playerbase is the collection of people who are (more or less) happy to accept Toril in its current implementation. I can't imagine that anyone still plays this game with the hopes that "something cool is coming soon." Toril's days of hooks and cliffhangers are over... people play because they're comfortable with the game, not because a wicked new race or hometown is on the way. Tiamat's the same way. It'll get implemented eventually, probably six months or a year from now. You'll do it once, you'll do it five times, you'll do it ten times, and you'll look around and realize that Toril hasn't really changed much with the addition of the zone. And then you'll make a choice... try to push the gods into implementing the Next Big Thing, or just playing the god damn game and having a good time. Honestly, you'll be happier playing the game. If you need the Next Big Thing to keep you interested, I humbly suggest checking out City of Heroes, or World of Warcraft, or any number of MMORPGs that add patch content every month or so.
- Ragorn
Shar: Leave the moaning to the people who have real issues to moan about like rangers or newbies.
Corth: Go ask out a chick that doesn't wiggle her poon in people's faces for a living.
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Postby Yayaril » Sun May 01, 2005 5:24 pm

8)

The fact that Ragorn is celebrating some kind of 10 year anniversary of mudding is sort of scary.
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Postby Corth » Sun May 01, 2005 5:56 pm

Ragorn pretty much nailed it...
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth

Goddamned slippery mage.
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Postby Pril » Tue May 03, 2005 5:02 am

Kiryan is wrong as usual, he just doesn't know how to get there:

******Insert random god annoyances here******


Log from 5/2/2005 around midnight EST.


Someone has teleported you!
Throne Room of Avernus
Exits: -N#
*Tiamat, the ruler of all evil dragon kind awaits here to feast on your soul.(Red Aura)

< 822h/822H 111p/111P 120v/120V >
< P: std >
Tiamat snaps into visibility.
Tiamat lunges towards you and bites you savagely!
OUCH! That really did HURT!
You bleed profusely from the vicious wound!

< 611h/822H 111p/111P 120v/120V >
< T: Pril TC: few wounds E: tiamat EC: excellent P: std >
Tiamat dodges your futile attack.
Your attack only grazes Tiamat as she dodges aside!
Your attack glances harmlessly off of Tiamat's scales!
Tiamat misses you with her claw.
Tiamat misses you with her claw.
Tiamat misses you with her claw.
Tiamat breathes a massive bolt of lightning!
You are shocked by the electrical charge!
OUCH! That really did HURT!

< 443h/822H 111p/111P 120v/120V >
< T: Pril TC: few wounds E: tiamat EC: excellent P: std >
You miss Tiamat with your slash.
Your attack glances harmlessly off of Tiamat's scales!
You parry Tiamat's lunge at you.
You parry Tiamat's lunge at you.
Tiamat's attack only grazes you as you dodge aside!
Tiamat claws you very hard.
Tiamat flings her mighty tail into you with tremendous force!
YIKES! Another hit like that, and you've had it!!

< 136h/822H 111p/111P 120v/120V >
< T: Pril TC: pretty hurt E: tiamat EC: excellent P: std > acc *Tiamat, the ruler of all evil dragon kind awaits here to feast on your soul.(Red Aura)
You ASSOC: '*Tiamat, the ruler of all evil dragon kind awaits here to feast on your soul.(Red Aura)'

< 136h/822H 111p/111P 120v/120V >
< T: Pril TC: pretty hurt E: tiamat EC: excellent P: std > You barely slash Tiamat.
Your a holy avenger enshrouded in light glows brightly as you slice into Tiamat's body viciously!
You barely slash Tiamat.
The spell cast by Tiamat is partially absorbed!
You are burned as you hit Tiamat!
You parry Tiamat's lunge at you.
Tiamat half kills you with her mighty claw!
YIKES! Another hit like that, and you've had it!!
You wish that your wounds would stop BLEEDING so much!

Tiamat misses you with her claw.
Tiamat lashes out with mighty tail in a broad arc!
You are flung to the ground in a lifeless heap as the massive tail smashes into you!
With a final blow, you feel yourself falling to the ground.
Your soul leaves your body in the cold sleep of death...
The world starts spinning, and your ears are ringing!
Your magic armor fades away.
You feel less blessed.
You feel less blessed.

*** Welcome to Toril ***

Enjoy!

Pril
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Postby kiryan » Tue May 03, 2005 9:09 pm

so reimping old tiamat would be a matter of reconnecting the zone.

this is insane that you guys refuse to reimplement old tiamat when you have had 4 freaking years to imp new tiamat. There is no good reason not to DO SOMETHING when your 4 years late.

i still dont see the reason for hestitation. its not like any zone impd in the last 2 years wasnt downgraded after it became obvious it was too easy or just completely f*d up. this would just be par for the course. you wanna change that modus operandi? Start with new zones, not one that is 4 years late.

stop dangling this f*ing carrot and just give it back to us as it was. maybe if you had a reason to finish new tiamat it would get done.
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Postby Jhorr » Tue May 03, 2005 9:54 pm

Ashiwi wrote:Negative reinforcement works best when there's no way to avoid the negative stimulus and that negative stimulus is a greater price to pay than the action required to defer it.


Allow me, Salen:

Positive punishment is when an offending stimulus is delivered.
Negative punishment is when a rewarding stimulus is taken away.
Positive reinforcement is when a rewarding stimulus is delivered.
Negative reinforcement is when an offending stimulus is taken away.

All hail B.F. Skinner!

Now, please, continue...
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Postby Ambar » Tue May 03, 2005 10:55 pm

kiryan wrote:so reimping old tiamat would be a matter of reconnecting the zone.

this is insane that you guys refuse to reimplement old tiamat when you have had 4 freaking years to imp new tiamat. There is no good reason not to DO SOMETHING when your 4 years late.

i still dont see the reason for hestitation. its not like any zone impd in the last 2 years wasnt downgraded after it became obvious it was too easy or just completely f*d up. this would just be par for the course. you wanna change that modus operandi? Start with new zones, not one that is 4 years late.

stop dangling this f*ing carrot and just give it back to us as it was. maybe if you had a reason to finish new tiamat it would get done.



push power button on CPU, walk away from the keyboard ...

it is a GAME! :)
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Postby rylan » Tue May 03, 2005 10:59 pm

Ambar wrote:push power button on CPU, walk away from the keyboard ...

it is a GAME! :)


I didn't know that a CPU has a power button... a computer has one, but not the cpu. That would be pretty difficult, having to open the case and remove the heatsink every time you want to turn it off. :P
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Postby Shar » Tue May 03, 2005 11:16 pm

Kiryan,

As forger admin, SHUT UP!

As a fellow mudder, yeah. 4 freakin years? What the heck is up with that? is it lies? is it denial? What is it?

Who cares what it is? Normally I don't enjoy the type of statements you made in this thread and would be upset that 1) not only do I have to read them but, 2)in the end, I have to *do* something about them. But this is just funny. You (and those like you) concern me in an unburdensome manner. Leave the moaning to the people who have real issues to moan about like rangers or newbies.

When tia comes in, she's gonna get done. People will fail. A lot. People will eventually win. A lot. Then what? will you sprout another brain? Will your body morph into a higher state of being? Will you suddenly become a billionaire ? no. none of that will happen. what WILL happen is this: People will WHINE and MOAN about why X does Y and how Z should do A, why dosent item B give better stats and howcome we waited for years for THIS?! etcetera.

Call me crazy, but I just can't wait to get to read THOSE posts, too!

i'm so glad you care about the mud. It is very obvious that you do. Could you at least, you know, show it on the outside? Yer a good guy, right? behind that mask of 'im going to be in your face about everything' there has to be an understanding human mind. If not, disregard the above in its entirety.
Shar - Forger Administrator, TorilMUD

Brandobaris : (51) [ would a forgotten realms zombie be interested in brains? ]

Shevarash tells you 'Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down..... groan'
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Postby Ambar » Tue May 03, 2005 11:23 pm

rylan wrote:
Ambar wrote:push power button on CPU, walk away from the keyboard ...

it is a GAME! :)


I didn't know that a CPU has a power button... a computer has one, but not the cpu. That would be pretty difficult, having to open the case and remove the heatsink every time you want to turn it off. :P


::roll::
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Postby Osod » Tue May 03, 2005 11:59 pm

I'm sorry, but just starting to glance at the forums every so often.

Forgers are so funny (funny haha, not like that one guy at your high school who you always avoided*) sometimes. Here's a little pearl of wisdom, and I don't happen to have it as a saying.

If you're not happy with what you've got, you'll never be happy with what you get; i.e. if your happiness with the game is solely dependent on Tia being implemented, then I'd hazard to guess that you'll be posting a bunch of times that Tia's too easy within a year of it going in, and needing a new challenge.

Okay, maybe I turned it into a saying. However, point being, settle down man. Cool off. Find another hobby. Take it in stride, as it's just a game for most of the rest of us. It's like the crack dealer said about Marion Barry, "he'll come back."

-O

*well, never having met any of them, I wouldn't discount this.
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Postby kiryan » Wed May 04, 2005 4:44 am

your right shar i love this mud. i know you guys love it too.

but that doesnt change the fact that tiamat has been out for 4 years and coming soon. waiting hasnt worked, kissing butt hasn't work (not by me but by others). So if being a complete ahole isnt going to help then tell me what I or any of us players can do to change this:

"its coming soon"
"not until its 100% perfect"

if you guys wanna give me the power and the vision/direction. i'll freaking dedicate my time to fixing it. Here I am, I'll fix it. pick me. Heres a person with lots of free time if staff is willing to do something other than make excuses and tell off belligerent self-righteous players. I'm sure theres great reasons why this can't happen, but haven't we had enough excuses as to why we can't do anything?

so in closing, if there is NOTHING I can do, then ALL i can do when im sick of waiting is COMPLAIN. All you can do is actually do something about tiamat, ban me, revoke my bbs priveleges or ignore me.

I implore you to find some way to turn this into a win because i don't actually have the power to do anything except create more negativity.
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Postby kiryan » Wed May 04, 2005 4:51 am

just site ban me from reading the bbs. it would make things a lot hapier for everyone im sure.

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