Kern Quest

Feedback, bugs, and general gameplay related discussion.
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Kern Quest

Postby Gormal » Wed Feb 22, 2006 5:27 am

Why was the exp reward removed from this quest? Haven't you guys devalued Greycloak enough already? The quick exp was the best reward of the quest... nice surprise to find it suddenly gone.
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Postby Thilindel » Wed Feb 22, 2006 6:04 am

*sigh* Hope that's not true, or at least supposed to have been changed. It was chanter xp's best friend.
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Postby Gormal » Wed Feb 22, 2006 6:11 am

You petition 'bah who removed exp rewards from kern'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'they are temporarily removed till a bit of code is finished up, then they'll be put back in.'
You petition 'can i turn in the stuff i jsut quested then for my items back?'
You petition 'and a warning be posted to the bbs?'
You petition 'or you can just setbit me to the correct exp!'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'they have been removed for quite some time'
You petition 'i havent done the quest in quite some time'
You petition 'that does betray your "temporarily" statement however'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'shame on you. you're supposed to complete it at least once every boot.'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'temporarily in god time, of course :P'
You petition 'snicker'
You petition 'can i get all my items back?'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'afraid I can't do that. the exp rewards from the quest aren't meant to be the reason for doing the quest.'
You petition 'thats precisely what they are, why else would talos have written them in'
You petition 'its precisely why i spent more hours exping to give away the items to needy friends and quest it myself'
You petition 'i've lost exp getting some of the items'
You petition 'i don't see how you can justify continually nerfing old quests and zone equipment'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'people loose exp all the time getting parts of quests yet not every quest in the game gives exp back as a reward'
You petition 'so whats wrong with one quest giving decent exp back'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'whats wrong is that people were giving all the quest items to a level 1 char, then using that char to hand in all the items for free levels. until something comes in to ensure the char that got the items is the one turning them in, then the exp rewards will remain removed.'
You petition 'clump and chlora were made a LOT harder, books made less valuable... and the end fight was at one point one of 2 insta death proc fights left in the game to justify the rewards'
You petition 'i see nothing wrong with it'
You petition 'screwing us out of a reward until you "get around to fixing it" is a horrible solution'
You petition 'and not posting a warning is lame too'
You petition 'i think its lame that people quest equipment and use it to help their level one alt powerlevel'
You petition 'how is that any different than using this exp'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'I don't post on a lot of things I do. your fellow players have known for.. hmm.. six months? that the rewards had been removed. I know you're away for great lengths of time, but I know you're still in touch with many players.'
You petition 'i'm in touch but i don't ask them if a reward is gone as i gather the items'
You petition 'come on don't be assinine'
You petition 'every time i quest something i should ask about the rewards changing?'
You petition 'I can't believe you just put the onus on me to know when you make changes because "I'm in touch with other players"'
You petition 'i read the bbs even when i cant play when i'm in the middle of the ocean and i check the news regularly and every time i return to play'
You petition 'do you realize that the time involved in this quest is more than sitting in ds exping?'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'last time I looked, you couldn't get some really good gear from sitting in ds all day?'
You petition 'sitting in greycloak? do you even know the quest?'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'yes, I know the quest. I know you don't just sit in gc all day.'
You petition 'have you killed chlora since the changes?'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'yes, I have. good to see dragons aren't the pushovers they once were.'
You petition 'upgrade difficulty, downgrade rewards'
You petition 'AWESOME'
You petition 'its not even top notch eq, i'll give up the eq'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'you're welcome'
You petition 'I'm seriously disgusted with your attitude'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'I have no intentions of screwing anyone over. there was a problem with the rewards of the quest, and the problems were removed until a better solution could be put into place. these things happen all the time.'
You petition 'so why can't i get reimbursed to my stock items'
You petition 'i gain nothing'
You petition 'right now i'm losing out because of the staff poorly handling what they percive to be a problem'
Marthammor responds to your petition with 'so, like, should we start giving people back items that they quest and find out the rewards aren't what they were hoping for?'
You petition 'if you change those rewards without announcing it... aboslutely
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Postby Marthammor » Wed Feb 22, 2006 6:19 am

Like I said, its only temporarily removed until a better solution can be put into place.
The quest is for the equipment gained from it. The exp rewards were there as secondary rewards that as it turned out, were being used to level alts and was deemed broken.
There is a new system partially finished that would allow us to have exp as rewards on quests, but until that system is finished, most quests that gave exp have had the exp removed.
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Postby Gormal » Wed Feb 22, 2006 6:25 am

I don't see the exp rewards as secondary, they have ALWAYS been considered an extremely valuable portion of this quest. All I want is my quest items back until you decide to fix this... I don't see how this is an unreasonable request considering that you failed to notify the players of the change. Oh sure, some knew because they found out the hard way, but that doesn't change the fact that you were lazy in your implementation of this change.
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Postby Marthammor » Wed Feb 22, 2006 6:33 am

The admins have noted it and will be getting in touch with you on your request.
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Postby Thilindel » Wed Feb 22, 2006 9:20 am

The only 'tidbit' I could give is that I don't see how a player would use a lvl 1 noob and gain levels what a waste. It was quite clear that the cap you can gain is 24% per item. This was VERY nice for chanters or other classes with (y-a-w-n) slow xp tables. Keep in mind my char was lvl 47 at the time. Since players are buttraped on failing res, this quest was pretty nice.
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Postby ssar » Wed Feb 22, 2006 11:48 am

Gormal wrote:Marthammor responds to your petition with 'whats wrong is that people were giving all the quest items to a level 1 char, then using that char to hand in all the items for free levels.


r o f l

an exhibition of new lows in the pathetic stakes
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Postby Lahgen » Wed Feb 22, 2006 11:57 am

Well...how much levels were the people using 1st level alts to hand in quest items getting with that?

One solution could be to not let people below a certain level, say, 35, enter Kern's chambers.
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Rather than seeing "subpar race/class," see "challenge."
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Postby teflor the ranger » Wed Feb 22, 2006 2:33 pm

Constantly changing aspects of the mud that are not generally expected to be changed combined with an incredibly poor system of keeping players informed is generally poor policy.

I for one recommend that this type of policy should be generally discouraged and would like to present the following observations:

1) The system to inform players of changes to already approved and implemented quests is incredibly poor.

2) Changes to approved and implemented quests and equipment are frequent enough to indicate an unhealthy system or poor impelementation process.

3) The development of the mud is closed to the point where it is strangling the development base. The game relies on the creativity of very few people, which will only harm long-term development.
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Postby Shevarash » Wed Feb 22, 2006 3:36 pm

teflor the ranger wrote:Constantly changing aspects of the mud that are not generally expected to be changed combined with an incredibly poor system of keeping players informed is generally poor policy.

I for one recommend that this type of policy should be generally discouraged and would like to present the following observations:

1) The system to inform players of changes to already approved and implemented quests is incredibly poor.



There's some truth to that, and we could do a better job of making news updates for areas changes.

teflor the ranger wrote:2) Changes to approved and implemented quests and equipment are frequent enough to indicate an unhealthy system or poor impelementation process.



You're oversimplifying. There is a vast amount of quests and equipment. The MUD's equipment pool is a complex system that will always require some tweaking. Further, extreme changes are not very common these days.

teflor the ranger wrote:3) The development of the mud is closed to the point where it is strangling the development base. The game relies on the creativity of very few people, which will only harm long-term development.


That is total speculation on your part. It is arguable that a complex game system benefits from a singular vision controlling the path of development, as opposed to a gaggle of coders adding features independent of one another.
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Postby Botef » Wed Feb 22, 2006 4:09 pm

Marthammor wrote:Like I said, its only temporarily removed until a better solution can be put into place.
The quest is for the equipment gained from it. The exp rewards were there as secondary rewards that as it turned out, were being used to level alts and was deemed broken.
There is a new system partially finished that would allow us to have exp as rewards on quests, but until that system is finished, most quests that gave exp have had the exp removed.


I see no reason a reimbursment shouldn't be given if the outcome being changed is only temporary and the difficulty hasn't been altered. Thats like telling a player that tried to do a broken quest 'tough luck, do it again once we fix it.'
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Postby Marthammor » Wed Feb 22, 2006 5:24 pm

I couldn't care less if he is reimbursed or not. I can't make that call as its up to an admin if they do it or not.

I know I'm lacking when it comes to news updates, and for awhile there I was posting when I changed something. Just too easy to stop posting updates on things. Will try to get back into giving news updates to Cyric so he can update the news when major things like this are changed.
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Postby Corth » Wed Feb 22, 2006 6:46 pm

So its ok to do high level quests in order to benefit your level 1 alt by giving him the equipment, but not ok to do high level quests to benefit your level 1 alt by letting them get the exp. I don't get the logic. Taking out the exp 'temporarily' (which of course in this game means permanently) for this reason is petty, even by kia standards.

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Postby Dalar » Wed Feb 22, 2006 6:57 pm

Shevarash wrote:
teflor the ranger wrote:Constantly changing aspects of the mud that are not generally expected to be changed combined with an incredibly poor system of keeping players informed is generally poor policy.

I for one recommend that this type of policy should be generally discouraged and would like to present the following observations:

1) The system to inform players of changes to already approved and implemented quests is incredibly poor.



There's some truth to that, and we could do a better job of making news updates for areas changes.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.
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Postby Dalar » Wed Feb 22, 2006 7:04 pm

Gormal wrote:I don't see the exp rewards as secondary, they have ALWAYS been considered an extremely valuable portion of this quest. All I want is my quest items back until you decide to fix this... I don't see how this is an unreasonable request considering that you failed to notify the players of the change. Oh sure, some knew because they found out the hard way, but that doesn't change the fact that you were lazy in your implementation of this change.


I didn't get this memo. The badasses had enough exp to last them a while when they did this.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.

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Postby Shevarash » Wed Feb 22, 2006 9:28 pm

Corth wrote:So its ok to do high level quests in order to benefit your level 1 alt by giving him the equipment, but not ok to do high level quests to benefit your level 1 alt by letting them get the exp. I don't get the logic. Taking out the exp 'temporarily' (which of course in this game means permanently) for this reason is petty, even by kia standards.

Corth


The logic is simple. Equipment is transferrable, experience is not.
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Postby Corth » Wed Feb 22, 2006 10:13 pm

How does that make a difference? Mighty EQ on a low level alt will soon result in plenty of 'permanent' exp. We're talking about two equivalent things here. The same logic by which you remove exp from the Kern quest should result in the conclusion that high end equipment should be hardcoded so that low level characters cannot use it. Any way you look at it its petty.
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Postby Gormal » Wed Feb 22, 2006 10:59 pm

I think that the main issue here is that there isn't just one issue:

1) It was a lame change in the first place.
2) It was not advertised.
3) There is no policy in place to help players who get screwed by the constant changes the areas sphere makes (this is not localized to just this type of situation).
4) A reward was removed and slated for change which is probably so low on the priority list that we might as well assume that its gone forever (another recurring theme).
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Postby Sarell » Thu Feb 23, 2006 5:28 am

I believe Kern should get his exp back. More high end quests, and final mobs in zones, should yield chunks of exp, they are much harder, and present a better overall depiciton of the game than assist botting in DS.

For anyone that has ever completed a kern quest in order to level their level ones, I'm sorry, but your doing it all wrong. You can get to level 50 in the nude faster than you can complete a Kern quest in my experience, you'd be seriously wasting your time. But if you do want to go about this way, I can't see how it would damage the game. If you have that much exp on your character that actually did complete Kern that you can afford to give it to a level 1 - I know I couldn't and wouldn't - then your not going to be sitting around at level 5 grouping with new players anyhow. Also level 50s can interact and be more helpful to a new player learning the ropes so it's kinda mute.

SUMMARY: Kern exp = good for high level gameplay = pointless for low level = doesn't hurt gameplay.
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Postby Gormal » Thu Feb 23, 2006 6:36 am

Anyone who would do what the staff suggests and use Kern's exp on their level 1 char char to "powerlevel" them is... shall we say, less than intelligent and should be ENCOURAGED to use it thusly. I'm eagerly anticipating a response from admin on this.. which looks like it has to come from Shar being that I've seen so many others log on.
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Postby Dalar » Thu Feb 23, 2006 6:44 pm

Dear Jake,

Have you ever thought they don't care? How many times have you seen me post about similar shit and nothing gets fixed until a year or two later when it actually affects the casuals? It's fine, learn 2 play or play a different game. Seriously, you're in the same position i was in 2 years ago before I quit for WoW beta. In more recent news, EQ2 has a new PvP ruleset server.

Sincerely,
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Postby teflor the ranger » Fri Feb 24, 2006 7:41 am

Shevarash wrote:
teflor the ranger wrote:2) Changes to approved and implemented quests and equipment are frequent enough to indicate an unhealthy system or poor impelementation process.



You're oversimplifying. There is a vast amount of quests and equipment. The MUD's equipment pool is a complex system that will always require some tweaking. Further, extreme changes are not very common these days.


Certainly, but the vast amount of equipment consists of 6ac +1 to hit bracelets. Once you hit the realms of high-level quests and difficult areas the amount of equipment appears to become much more managable. 4 different popular high-end shields, six-eight wristwear items, etc. etc. From my observation the constant introduction of higher-than-before end equipment has created quite a need for 'tweaking'.

Shevarash wrote:
teflor the ranger wrote:3) The development of the mud is closed to the point where it is strangling the development base. The game relies on the creativity of very few people, which will only harm long-term development.


That is total speculation on your part. It is arguable that a complex game system benefits from a singular vision controlling the path of development, as opposed to a gaggle of coders adding features independent of one another.


I agree that it is arguable but in my opinion it appears that the mud is limited to that option. However, I do believe that this forum is a robust and healthy primary tool for the players to add their ideas and opinions - so long as both players and imms participate.

On one hand I wince when the players whine and whine on some threads, but game imm feedback is important to the players even when they're just crying like children.
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Postby Minofagal » Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:25 am

honestly after i read the log of the petition i glanced a few responses but i'm guessing mine will be similiar.. give the guy his stuff back.. he reads the forums and news and still didn't know about the 6 month temporary change.. oh yeah has it been fixed.. cause i'm guessing at least more than half a year has gone buy since the change was implemented, thats not very temporary.. and if its been that long i'm thinking it isn't very high on the priorities list..

he gains nothing and you lose nothing.. come on..
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Postby Llaaldara » Fri Feb 24, 2006 11:53 pm

I sincerely hope that some staff members will read that log and understand why there is so much resentment from players towards the staff.
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Postby Thilindel » Sat Feb 25, 2006 12:06 am

Well, I don't resent them, per se. I just wish some of the simple things that I pointed out in the other thread will get fixed rather than a large project. This is just my opinion, but I think that losing the xp from this quest really sucks. Other things that take away from the game (still my opinion) are the ranger vs. rogue issues - It's just dumb that a spelled up rogue can solo a certain zone faster than a ranger can. Ranger's aren't tanks and they're not even top notch damage. What the hell are they :P To me, it's the small things that have a ton of complaints . . flee, class imbalance, etc that should be priority. Either way, I enjoy the game as it is, but sure would be nice have the chronic complaints and problems fixed.

There's even a small tidbit, like why is it mobs that infra can see a lich in the dark? Just isn't right. Twink twink cry out the people, but being in the dark does not equal hide/sneak stacking.
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Postby Gormal » Sat Feb 25, 2006 12:12 am

Thilindel wrote::words:


Hijack often?
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Postby Thilindel » Sat Feb 25, 2006 12:13 am

Gormal wrote:
Thilindel wrote:This is just my opinion, but I think that losing the xp from this quest really sucks.


Hijack often?


*whap* reread the simple paragraph?

Dalar wrote:Dear Jake,

Have you ever thought they don't care? How many times have you seen me post about similar shit and nothing gets fixed until a year or two later when it actually affects the casuals?


I pointed out the same thing the dartman did.
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Postby Dalar » Sat Feb 25, 2006 12:24 am

Llaaldara wrote:I sincerely hope that some staff members will read that log and understand why there is so much resentment from players towards the staff.


Seriously. What kind of area god who claims to know the quest doesn't know that you have to sit in GC for hours to get the rares? Yes you do, because there CAN be competition assuming some other retard actually wants gear from there too.
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Postby Botef » Sat Feb 25, 2006 12:54 am

Llaaldara wrote:I sincerely hope that some staff members will read that log and understand why there is so much resentment from players towards the staff.


There seems to be a lack of communication/cooperation between spheres to resolve things like this...Obviously an admin, while able to give a reimbursment, isn't directly familiar with area changes...

Marthammor wrote:I couldn't care less if he is reimbursed or not. I can't make that call as its up to an admin if they do it or not.


Since the issue stems from an Areas change, I would think at least a mutual effort could be expected from spheres to come to a resolve.

I don't mean to sound negative, I really have no qualms with the way things are, but situations like this do raise an eyebrow and should be scrutinized a bit to work towards making things run smoother in the void between players and staff.
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Postby sotana » Sat Feb 25, 2006 10:32 am

Hrm, when did this stop being a free game run for us by people who have donated their time and can’t be expected to do what we, as players, think should happen just because we think it should happen?

I’ve seen so many posts of 'this is broken, do something' 'why did this happen, fix it!' 'I think this should be different so implement it now'. We are all certainly entitled to our opinions but we are not entitled to expect that if it wasn't implemented or even responded to, no one must have heard it or respected it. Dang those gods who are spending all their donated time doing things that must not be worthwhile because they are not the things we suggested! :-P

It sucks that Gormal didn’t get the xp he thought he would get from Kerns quest so now what? Is that going to mean he just can't play here anymore with these gods who obviously must not care or listen to us or, even better, must not be doing their jobs (as some have expressed)? Does it mean he’ll talk to the staff, try to work out the best solution he can but in the end accept whatever their decision may be and go have fun with the stuff he does like in the game? Does it mean he will try to gather support for his position from other players on the bbs?

Posts on the bbs seem to move so quickly from 'expressing an opinion' to instead working to garner player support, helping to nudge other people into being as dissatisfied as you are until, finally, enough voices are hollering that you get what you want. Sometimes change occurs because a posted point is valid and timely. But sometimes it seems folks hope to get what they want just by being loud enough to cause previously content people to question the good time they thought they were having here before someone told them they're being cheated by the ‘uncaring, incompetent staff’.

Why is there such a negative, demanding attitude in so many of the posts I read on the bbs? It can't be entirely blamed on the staff since the old 'I have taken a dislike to your player's eq ansi, consider yourself deleted' way of doing things is gone. Express your opinion, then, if it doesn't happen the way you like, go play somewhere else or find the stuff you DO like and try to be more supportive to please give this game a more enjoyable atmosphere for everyone.

I play this game to have fun and, since I can’t control what the gods do or don’t do, they don’t decide whether or not I have fun. If things don’t change after being brought up, either find stuff you like, have fun and help other folks have fun, or find a different game that better fits your interpretation of the way things ‘should’ be.

I realize not everyone agrees with my point of view but I figured since we hear so often from the people who are unhappy with something or other, I should at least interject my differing opinion. :-)

P.S. This post is addressed to the populace at large, not Gormal in specific :-P
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Postby Marthammor » Sat Feb 25, 2006 1:46 pm

I've argued that time should be part of the value of quest items, but it isn't considered. The only thing that seems to matter is the difficulty of the fights and rareness of items/mob involved.

Botef: The entire staff knew of the change when it was made, or at least those that cared to know. The change was posted on the god boards, along with the reasoning, to keep everyone in the loop. I didn't have one person tell me that they didn't think it needed to be addressed.

Now obviously I should have posted this change someplace, and I apologize for that. Even if I had, we'd still have this complaining going on about how it shouldn't have been removed and so on. Damed if you do, damed if you don't.


As a side note, I would have already given gormal his stuff back, but was told it was something an admin should do and they should be the one to decide what should be done, so its really up to them.. even though I prefer to clean up my own messes so others don't have to deal with it.
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Postby Tasan » Sat Feb 25, 2006 11:28 pm

Actually most of the complaining stems from what you did(or rather FORGOT to do), which seems to happen all to often.

Sitting here and trying to make excuses constantly for why things are changed doesn't address the fact that you didn't notify anyone who it actually affected. For too long the attitude of the areas sphere seems to have been "change things willy-nilly and never tell the players who it will actually affect".

Obviously people were going to be upset with the change, but a post in the news as well as a post in GD about why the change was enacted etc. would probably get positive feedback instead of what you see here. This is a direct result of not telling anyone what's going on and someone basically getting screwed because of it.

How can you expect people to want to play a game when it seems like you are deliberately changing things without telling people? Then you tell them they need to find someone else to talk to about fixing a problem that arose from the situation? How many times do threads like this need to be brought up because the areas staff simply cannot be bothered to write a snippet about something being changed?

Kudos to Eil for being very upfront about things he's tweaked and for listening to feedback in a postive manner.
Danahg tells you 'yeah, luckily i kept most of it in my mouth and nasal membranes, ugh'

Dlur group-says 'I have a dead horse that I'm dragging down the shaft with my 4 corpses. Anyone want to help me beat it?'

Calladuran: There are other games to play if you want to play with yourself.
Selias
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Postby Selias » Sun Feb 26, 2006 2:45 am

wow jake!! I didn't think you could whine that much =P
*snicker*
teflor the ranger
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Postby teflor the ranger » Sun Feb 26, 2006 3:28 am

Marthammor wrote:I've argued that time should be part of the value of quest items, but it isn't considered. The only thing that seems to matter is the difficulty of the fights and rareness of items/mob involved.

Botef: The entire staff knew of the change when it was made, or at least those that cared to know. The change was posted on the god boards, along with the reasoning, to keep everyone in the loop. I didn't have one person tell me that they didn't think it needed to be addressed.

Now obviously I should have posted this change someplace, and I apologize for that. Even if I had, we'd still have this complaining going on about how it shouldn't have been removed and so on. Damed if you do, damed if you don't.


As a side note, I would have already given gormal his stuff back, but was told it was something an admin should do and they should be the one to decide what should be done, so its really up to them.. even though I prefer to clean up my own messes so others don't have to deal with it.


At one point in time this matter was left up to "those that cared to know."

Why chose to respond to it now?

I highly doubt it's damned if you do and damned if you don't. It's damned if you had handled the matter poorly at any stage.
Teflor does. Teflor does not.
Gurns
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Postby Gurns » Sun Feb 26, 2006 5:49 pm

Selias wrote:wow jake!! I didn't think you could whine that much =P
*snicker*

Agreed. Sad.

Tasan wrote:doesn't address the fact that you didn't notify anyone who it actually affected.

I've always thought part of the original attraction of this game over other muds was that it was challenging. And part of the challenge was discovering the world and what was going on while the world kept on changing. Part of the challenge was that the staff didn't tell us everything. Hell, they didn't tell us anything! It was a good game because it was the exact opposite of a "here, let me hold your hand and make sure you don't get hurt" game.

Man, Gormal and Tasan wanting their hands held. Somewhere, Miax is laughing his ass off.
Lahgen
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Postby Lahgen » Sun Feb 26, 2006 7:00 pm

Well, it's not like we wake up and find that our breakfast spoons now weigh 100 pounds each....
Kesena OOC: 'i wish my daddy bought me power tools'

Dorgh group-says 'damn, even with Cofen helping Mori, they STILL can't kill someone

Hekanut says 'I know level doesn't matter much, but most won't take seriously if a level 2 claims to be the best thing before, during, and after sliced bread.'



Rather than seeing "subpar race/class," see "challenge."
Lilira
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Postby Lilira » Sun Feb 26, 2006 10:43 pm

Gurns wrote: It was a good game because it was the exact opposite of a "here, let me hold your hand and make sure you don't get hurt" game.


*cough* EQ2 *cough*

I find it ironic that all this complaining is going on with regards to a free game that all the people who spend money to go play the graphic MMORPGs return to when they get bored with the flashy graphics games that hold your hand.

So what if they forgot to inform the general public that the XP was disabled for the quest. Last I knew, people did the quest for a piece or two of the gear. *shrug* If you were doing it for the XP, I can think of faster ways to level since I don't remember the xp being THAT terrific!

Don't get me wrong.. I was horribly glad to finish my Kerns. I hate having things like open quests hanging over my head. I did it to do the quest, not for the XP, so to be honest, I couldn't care.

Marthammor has already responded , basically its outta his hands for now. Buck up, stop whipping up the troops and get back to the GAME.

Yeah.. that's right.. a game.
Ragorn
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Postby Ragorn » Mon Feb 27, 2006 1:55 pm

Areas Staff: Please inform the players when making large-scale changes like removing a significant portion of the reward from a major quest. Please be open to feedback about the necessity of such changes. Please take ownership of the fallout from such changes by handling disgruntled players in an effective manner, either yourselves or by working with the admins.

Admin Staff: Please gently remind the Areas staff when they post changs on the god board that players should also be notified of major alterations. Please work with the areas staff to resolve the fallout from such changes.

Players: Please remember that the staff are people who make mistakes. Please remember that no one god has absolute authority to accomplish everything you would like to see done all by himself in response to a petition. Please remember that this is a game, hosted by volunteers, and as such, you may encounter things you don't like.

Gormal: Please have my babies.

Everyone: Move on with your lives.
- Ragorn
Shar: Leave the moaning to the people who have real issues to moan about like rangers or newbies.
Corth: Go ask out a chick that doesn't wiggle her poon in people's faces for a living.
Shar
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Postby Shar » Mon Feb 27, 2006 3:41 pm

Huh.

I've just now read this thread. RL had me but I'll be doing *something* about this, to the best of my ability. I realize thats vague but hey.
Shar - Forger Administrator, TorilMUD

Brandobaris : (51) [ would a forgotten realms zombie be interested in brains? ]

Shevarash tells you 'Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down..... groan'

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