Tiny Golden Earring

A forum for discussion of the object changes...one thread per item please. Read the first post!
Vassana
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Tiny Golden Earring

Postby Vassana » Fri Nov 07, 2003 2:19 am

AC0 +2hit. Condsidering how easy it is to get an that it is mined every boot I guess not too bad. But who the heck wears them but new players that wanted the hit and AC to help level.

This change wasnt aimed at anyone but low to mid level players that needed AC and a hit. Add AC and DG the hit. Hell, all the alts that have flamings and scorps around, for gawds sake.

You can tell a noob on Toril by his/her TG's!
Malia
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Postby Malia » Fri Nov 07, 2003 2:40 am

I have to agree with this, if all the "noob gear" gets hit with this point system the real noobs are gonna be hurting. If we are putting such an effort into getting more new players at least leave them some fun eq. I still remember getting my first TG! MY first GCD! My first Flaming mace! All this stuff that high end players or most players for that matter dont use, is still used and sought after by new players. AC 5 +2 hit does nothing on top end players but damn, that really helps when your lvl 20-30 and just starting out. Deco eyepatch is another sure its easy to get but man that +3hit really helps new players actualy hit consistantly, not that its used by any high ender players. Noob rogues gonna have it really tough trying to find noob eq to actualy hit with.

On a side not maybe shouldnt even mention it here, but id like to see the auction discontinued. It makes gear like tg, deco eyepatch, gcd, all too easy to get. You just buy your set, instead of learning how to get the item or learning where its from. Id say at least 50% of the current mud base doesnt even know where to get the gcd from, they just know its a cool mid lvl dagger that procs.
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Postby amolol » Fri Nov 07, 2003 4:25 am

hey ive been here for over a year now and i wear tg's but thats mostly cause i couldnt get any help with upgrades
i dont know what your problem is, but i bet its hard to pronounce

myspace.com/tgchef
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Postby Ruxur » Fri Nov 07, 2003 6:25 am

umm the rux wears a tg
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Postby Zoldren » Fri Nov 07, 2003 2:36 pm

tiny golds
decos
onyx rings
blue addys
purple earthstones
gold rings
dwarf scale
etc etc

all n00b - mid lvl eq
all gona/havebeen pwned by downgrade

changing eq without changing skills/spells is even more unbalancing than before.

now wars will have to totaly rely on spellups
now they have to get barked and armored before fights
bark/armor/scale/blur/vit/embodiment/globe >>>>>>>>> any eq change

n00bs are screwed mid lvl players screwed, high end players screwed but will recover.

balance is skills/spells NOT EQ eq is player happieness.
fix balance and let players b happy leave eq alone.
Delmair Aamoren
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Postby Delmair Aamoren » Fri Nov 07, 2003 2:46 pm

This thread amuses me. Albeit i don't like making life harder for the lower level or less experienced crowd, but how can one balance eq without affecting it across the board without prejudice? If you downgrade the mid-high, and high, and don't downgrade the mid, you close the gap between the two, sometimes making it negligable. This is precisely the problem we had with top end gear. Not changing lower level gear is NOT the answer. don't ask me what THE answer is, but this surely isn't it.
Mitharx
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Postby Mitharx » Fri Nov 07, 2003 5:04 pm

Low level life sucks on the mud. It wasn't all that long ago that I restarted on sojourn 3. I used crappy newbie gear they gave me forever. How did I get any better? People helped me out. They were able to lend or give things that weren't awesome, but gave me an ability to do xp without getting my but kicked over and over. Oh yeah. I did get some friends together (which with less newbies, it seems more rare that those kind of friendships are formed because they hang out with people less frequently) and we killed what we could for fun, but that wasn't a huge deal for eq.

When I hit 50 my eq sucked. I hadn't done much zoning and I was just relying on the few things I had gotten from people and what I could afford to buy (which isn't much). With these eq changes it seems that the eq that people in my situation can actually get isn't able to be used for zoning very effectively. In the end, it seems that XP is longer and getting in zoning groups is harder. EQ doesn't make the player (completely) and I haven't turned down someone from doing a zone because they were using newbie type stuff, but when it comes down to doing that zones that are more worthy of doing now I'm going to want to take someone with descent eq, especially since the more newbie-ish eq is so much worse than it was before.

EQ changes across the board sounds good, but is it the right thing to do for new players trying to get a foot in the door?
belleshel
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Postby belleshel » Fri Nov 07, 2003 5:16 pm

Mitharx wrote:EQ doesn't make the player (completely) and I haven't turned down someone from doing a zone because they were using newbie type stuff, but when it comes down to doing that zones that are more worthy of doing now I'm going to want to take someone with descent eq, especially since the more newbie-ish eq is so much worse than it was before.

EQ changes across the board sounds good, but is it the right thing to do for new players trying to get a foot in the door?


Yes.

1) I have NEVER seen someone turned away from a zone group because of the equipment they were wearing. Maybe I just group with nice folks..
We'd much rather have a nice person with crap gear, then some a-hole with an uber set in our groups.

2) Getting a 'decent' set is far easier now then it has EVER been on Soj3.
Delmair put it best, you can't leave lower end gear the same, and downgrade much harder gear to be on par.
Mitharx
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Postby Mitharx » Sat Nov 08, 2003 7:29 am

Why? Is it physics? Yes, the higher end gear should be better than the lower end stuff, but it already is. Even with the dgs to higher end stuff.

The lower end gear wasn't making things unbalanced. Infact, it was primarily helpful for XP and to give some help to people who couldn't get their hands on good eq because they're new.

I would suggest there is a "floor" for the level of eq where at this level they could keep the stats on the eq the same and not throw the game out of balance.

Why is this the right thing to do for new players? The logic seems to be that Mister Experienced Player X has this really awesome eq and he was too powerful so you should be less powerful.
Vassana
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Postby Vassana » Sat Nov 08, 2003 11:39 pm

Agree Mitharx.

I dont see how ppl that say "if you DG high level items low/mid items must also be DG'ed" have explained why very well.

The only one I read mentioned the low and low/mid getting too close to the top if not changed.

In the end this EQ balancing is to help standardize things for areamakers also? It seems by looking at the who list and and talking to players that the majority of ppl on this mud are old schoolers from several incarnation in the past - or have hit a high level. The mud population is old. I would think more and more zones will be written for the largest mud populous and you find the diveristy of EQ being created in the Top teir not the bottom.

Since most if not but a handful of posters on the BBS are old schoolers with at least one wipe and sometimes several wipes under thier belts. I thinking they are comforatable with the disparity between noobs and themselves - they are used to the enviroment. But you must admit to someone that has never played here that it can me mind numbing XP to get into a zone group if you didnt have friends, leaders and associations in place when you arrived.

Sure some new ppl you advertise for will stay. Leave low/mid eq alone and it will more just on the extra ease added to the game. And please dont give me that "I had to slog 9 miles uphill in the snow to kill sedawi villagers with a peg handled dagger." line that seems to prove that NO player on the mud can have any skill or personal character unless you start from scratch. We come to the game with our personal character. You are either interested in being better, being moral when you get here or not. Wish for a better life for your youth than you had - and teach them well. Making them slog uphill just makes them grumpy sloggers!

The most fun I am told in this game is at the top end. Let ppl get thier with the use of some high AC hit dam eq, some with a little HP but fewer protects, fewer saves etc.

After the management is now selling the game to the public outside the true faithful that has called Toril home for years. Leave low mid alone.
Vassana
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Postby Vassana » Fri Nov 14, 2003 6:06 pm

After shifting around eq, making some trades for AC. I still cant get enough AC plus hit/dam to hope to tank much 2handed. I can get -100 with a nice shield so 1handed combat is fine. I think a lot of paladins and some AP's are in the same situation?

Mid level eq that was kept for AC was hit too hard in my book. If not ppl are just holding onto things waiting for the changes to be final?

Still baffled at TG's.

O well! :P the Imms are trying!
mynazzaraxxsyn
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Postby mynazzaraxxsyn » Fri Nov 14, 2003 6:19 pm

Vassana wrote:Still baffled at TG's.


Well its a single mob fight, that requires nothing harder then walking there. There are no guardians, no traps, no flying monkies. The hardest part about getting a TG is the fight. If you can kill then ancient you can get the tg, its not a zone item that you have to wade through 10 aggros to get to the first real mob.
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Postby thanuk » Fri Nov 14, 2003 6:51 pm

mynazzaraxxsyn wrote:no flying monkies.


No flying monkies? *sniff*
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Vassana
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Postby Vassana » Fri Nov 14, 2003 6:54 pm

mynazzaraxxsyn wrote:
Vassana wrote:Still baffled at TG's.


Well its a single mob fight, that requires nothing harder then walking there. There are no guardians, no traps, no flying monkies. The hardest part about getting a TG is the fight. If you can kill then ancient you can get the tg, its not a zone item that you have to wade through 10 aggros to get to the first real mob.


Exactly right M. Its not a zone fight it doesnt require much, its should have AC and less hit and no protects maybe 1 dam. The point is its in my mind one of those items that ppl dont list as zone eq. PPl dont go trading Diamondines for TG's or looking for dwarfscale or earthstones because they are getting thier char zoneable.

It does require a low/mid level player to get help to do tho. I cant solo it. Too many ppl on this mud think as high level zone players. Seems like some are really good at thinking about helping the new players. Others think it should be a significant challenge.. as hard as it is at the zoneable level of play. I disagree. I think it should be a challenge, but the tools should be easy enough gathered to meet it w/o a bunch of high level players help. No poke at you M.
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Postby mynazzaraxxsyn » Fri Nov 14, 2003 6:59 pm

What I am saying is if we're considering items based upon the new system 5ac 2hit is VERY high for the fight/difficulty to get. Regardless if you can solo it or not. Or if you would wear it to a zone. It is a VERY easy item to get. For it to keep its stats or have prots or 1dam as you say the ancient needs a few guardians in room with it. A !pick locked door with 3+ guardians !steal with the key. Then it might be difficult enough for those stats.

Do I like the fact that it got dg'd? Nope. I don't like any of the item changes. I think it was done with the best of intentions but very badly imp'd. But its something that isn't going to go away. So we have to live with it and understand why an item is what it is now. This is one item I do understand why it is what it is now.
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Postby Uzzel » Thu Nov 20, 2003 8:03 am

I agree with some of the people posted here.
Both the deco and tg was great items and relative easy to get.
Yet they could still be there after the game had been up a few hour for mid level groups to go down and practice their skills.

You can say they dont have the 'points' to get their good stats, but if you say they ruin game ballance you most be truely gesting.

They are just great items makeing leveling easyer, and atleast I find the brownie entertaining to fight regadless of my charaters level.

Uzzel
Stamm
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Postby Stamm » Thu Nov 20, 2003 1:59 pm

The amount of enjoyment you get from this game is directly related to how difficult it is.

You think if the Kazgaroth epic quest was easy that people would get the enjoyment out of doing it?

You think that if Erlans was just something you did between zones we'd all be pleased for Talsorwuss because he did it?

You can't have people complaining about powerleveled newbie level 50s at the same time as people complaining life is too tough for the low levels.

Think about all the times you've seen someone post "In the second wipe I only got to level 23, I sort of hit a wall". If you make it easy then you're taking away the achievement.

Generally speaking the only tgs and decos in the game were ones that were gotten by level 40+ chars and given to low levels anyway.

If we listened to the wrong people long enough then we'd be waiting for new players to arrive, we'd be throwing gear on them before they can master the use of say and we'd have them leveled up to level 20 before they knew what hit/dam or spell slots were.... and then we'd leave them to muddle around the mud, clueless having robbed them of any sense of fun or achievement.
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Postby Yayaril » Thu Nov 20, 2003 2:14 pm

8)

I get enjoyment out of doing driftwood staves, so I guess that kills that theory.
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Postby rylan » Thu Nov 20, 2003 5:13 pm

Ahh yes.. those downgraded driftwood staves that only do vig light now
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Postby Todrael » Thu Nov 20, 2003 10:20 pm

I vigorously avoided learning how to do the driftwood stave quest. All that hard work of spamming gsays/etc off the screen finally paid off.
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