just....wrong

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Zoldren
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just....wrong

Postby Zoldren » Sat Sep 29, 2007 4:20 am

<604h>
< >
Score information for Ssosset

Level: 49 Race: Yuan-Ti Class: Illusionist
Hit points: 604(604) PSP's: 381(381) Moves: 127(129)
Experience Progress: 90 %
Coins carried: 0 platinum 0 gold 0 silver 0 copper
Coins in bags: 236 platinum 298 gold 380 silver 369 copper
Coins in bank: 6189 platinum 1 gold 3 silver 1 copper
Prestige: 5608 Acheron Kill Count: 0
Citizen of: Gloomhaven
Outcast from: Griffon's Nest, Leuthilspar
Playing time: 48 days / 21 hours/ 32 minutes
Title: - Maggot - Shadow Scream
Group Name: We are SOOO Set!
Group Leader: Ssosset
Followers:
Mori
Status: Standing.
Disguise: a human traveler
Detecting: Evil Good Magic Life Heat
Protected from: Fire Cold Gas Acid
Enchantments: Fly


<604h>
< > Crossing the Zundbridge
Exits: -E -W
A chipmunk scampers about looking for nuts.
A guard has been stationed here, his cyclas bearing the symbol of the Waterdeep Guard.(Gold Aura)
A guard has been stationed here, his cyclas bearing the symbol of the Waterdeep Guard.(Gold Aura)

<604h>
< >
Nymantar group-says 'the entrance gates in beluir are in the south *nod* it's a messed up city'

<604h>
< > You start chanting...

<604h>
< >
Casting: mirror image

<604h>
< >
You complete your spell...
Several mirror images of you pop into existence at your side!

<604h>
< > From the north, someone fires a steel tipped arrow at you. Ouch, you have been hit!
You start chanting...

<604h>
< >
From the north, someone fires a steel tipped arrow at you. Ouch, you have been hit!
From the north, someone fires a steel tipped arrow at you. Ouch, you have been hit!
From the north, someone fires a steel tipped arrow at you. Ouch, you have been hit!
OUCH! That really did HURT!
Your disguise falls apart!
Casting: displacement *

<461h>
< >
Casting: displacement

<461h>
< >
You complete your spell...
Your form is displaced!

<461h>
< >
a burly guard sends you sprawling.

<459h>
<T>
You miss a burly guard with your pound.
a burly guard misses you with his hit.
a burly guard misses you with his hit.



welcome to toril...
Arilin Nydelahar
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Postby Arilin Nydelahar » Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:24 pm

so..

er.. what happened to the other 450 hp there? fleeing? anything?
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Ambar
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Postby Ambar » Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:30 pm

I see a displace and mirror images cast but I am guessing they didnt have time to *tick* ...not sure if thats what is wrong here .. or am i missing it?
"When a child is born, so is a grandmother."

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Eilistraee
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Postby Eilistraee » Sat Sep 29, 2007 3:48 pm

The archery engine has never interacted properly with the standard defensive spells such as stone/scale/blur/displace/mirror image and defensive skills like dodge. While wrong, it has also been ruthlessly enjoyed by rangers and dire raiders for years.

The problem lies in that archery was never merged with the standard combat engine, and to do so now would require an intensive amount of effort that would look more like a nerfing of archery than a bug fix.

It will be corrected with 2.0.
Eilistraee
moritheil
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Postby moritheil » Sat Sep 29, 2007 5:41 pm

At issue here is not only the proper interaction of archery with defensive spells, which Eil kindly noted already, but the fact that the archers were firing at someone disguised as a human traveler.

This broke his disguise, and that in turn caused the guards to attack him.

Arilin Nydelahar wrote:so..

er.. what happened to the other 450 hp there? fleeing? anything?


Well, he posted "a burly guard sends you sprawling. " My understanding is that he got bashed and killed summarily, but I guess he wanted to spare you the details.
Yotus group-says 'special quest if you type hi dragon'
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muxxissinix
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Postby muxxissinix » Sun Sep 30, 2007 10:20 am

May be wrong, but I think the thing hes pointing is the fact that archery mobs can see through your disguise :P .
Zoldren
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Postby Zoldren » Mon Oct 01, 2007 2:00 pm

1 problem is they shot a human... then the fact they fired from the north in a E/W room....
Marthammor
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Postby Marthammor » Mon Oct 01, 2007 2:14 pm

Just because YOU can only go east and west doesn't mean that they weren't on a tower on the north side of the road shooting south at you. ;)
Lilira
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Postby Lilira » Mon Oct 01, 2007 10:10 pm

True Marth, but do they have something against humans?

*laugh* I think that's the point. I've met a few mobs who didn't care I was disguised. I just rolled my eyes and performed the CR. But then I've always hated the idea of 'machining' something to death.

And I've always wondered how a snake can disguise as a human... *wink* I know, the beauty of magic.
~\o--Lilira Shadowlyre--o/~

You group-say 'my chars will carry the component on them if I can.'
Inama group-says 'hopefully they'll have some sort of volume discounts on ress items for people like you'
You group-say 'oh? Ya think? *giggle*'
Inama group-says 'they could at least implement frequent dier miles'

Suzalize group-says 'oh, eya's over weight i bet'
Marthammor
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Postby Marthammor » Tue Oct 02, 2007 6:37 am

He made for a really fuggly human and the archers wanted to put him out of his misery?
Lilira
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Postby Lilira » Tue Oct 02, 2007 12:18 pm

*grin*
~\o--Lilira Shadowlyre--o/~

You group-say 'my chars will carry the component on them if I can.'
Inama group-says 'hopefully they'll have some sort of volume discounts on ress items for people like you'
You group-say 'oh? Ya think? *giggle*'
Inama group-says 'they could at least implement frequent dier miles'

Suzalize group-says 'oh, eya's over weight i bet'
Pril
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Postby Pril » Tue Oct 02, 2007 1:41 pm

Lilira wrote:True Marth, but do they have something against humans?

*laugh* I think that's the point. I've met a few mobs who didn't care I was disguised. I just rolled my eyes and performed the CR. But then I've always hated the idea of 'machining' something to death.

And I've always wondered how a snake can disguise as a human... *wink* I know, the beauty of magic.


Lilira,

It's the same way a dwarf can disguise as a yuan with a disguise kit. Exactly howe big is the kit to hold a tail big enough to hide your legs etc?!? :p

Cof
The best of WTF statments of '06
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Danila group-says 'afk, machine gun in backyard started shooting cats'
Danila group-says 'afk a sec, 3 horned monkeys trying to steal hose'
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Zoldren
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Postby Zoldren » Tue Oct 02, 2007 6:00 pm

So basically what we are saying is mobs can see through disguise/change self.....??
Zoldren
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Postby Zoldren » Tue Oct 02, 2007 6:01 pm

Birile
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Postby Birile » Tue Oct 02, 2007 6:45 pm

Out of curiosity, has this issue of seeing through the disguise been looked into? From what I understand, it'll fool any other form of justice/race-aggro mob. I could be wrong, though!
Eilistraee
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Postby Eilistraee » Tue Oct 02, 2007 7:52 pm

My expectation is this is another instance of the archery code living in a world on its own and not going through the other checks most other mobs do. Note for instance that the guards themselves didn't attack until the disguise was dropped due to the archery.

I have, over the years, tried to tweak and work with the archery engine with little success. It is an element which has been revamped and brought in line with the standard engine in the 2.0 model.
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Raiwen
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Postby Raiwen » Wed Oct 03, 2007 12:54 am

maybe make archery not break disguise?
Zoldren
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Postby Zoldren » Wed Oct 03, 2007 2:07 pm

El, Tx for lookin at it. I'll be glad to die if you need to test it some ;p

Also, something i forgot to mention before... any reason why mislead doesn't work while 1 room away anymore? It used to...(ie mobs track still if 1 room away but 2 or more your ok) 1 room used to be sufficient.

Tx,

Pink

oh ya can take a look at Nokies post too? about disguise.. are they related?
Eilistraee
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Postby Eilistraee » Wed Oct 03, 2007 2:27 pm

Justice is about as broken as archery. There's a reason they have both either been extensively redone or eradicated with 2.0. Like archery, it doesn't play by quite the same rules as the rest of the game.

With regards to mislead (and PWT) while one room away, the reasoning is simple. The mob that pursues (tracks) may not be able to follow your trail, but it just has to look over --> there and look, there you are.

Essentially, if you are one room away the mob can see you and move to go let you know just what it thinks about what you did to it. More than one and it needs to rely on your 'trail'.
Eilistraee

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