Wipe?

Discussion concerning the upcoming Toril 2.0 update as well as general 3.5 edition D&D discussion

Do you want a full player wipe?

Yes.
51
47%
No.
57
53%
 
Total votes: 108
Delmair Aamoren
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Delmair Aamoren » Sat May 17, 2008 1:11 pm

I guess "selfishness" might be an appropriate word, but i don't see it that way. Selfishness would be saying "no way, i'm going to play again if there is a complete wipe" and convincing my friends to do likewise. I'm merely suggesting as an aide to luring long time players back to the already anorexic playerbase, a little bit of favoritism. I think its a great move from a PR perspective, and i think it would have negligible balance issues so long as there were some limits as to what type of gear could be transferred. (gives no reason to go to the endgame if you've already got 3 pieces of tia gear).
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Teyaha » Tue May 20, 2008 9:29 am

um, the handful of long-time toril players that i still keep in touch with that quit the game either after soj3 launched or right after it was renamed to torilmud have no intention of coming back - wipe or not

not because there is anything wrong with the game. they have simply moved along.

those that want a wipe can self-wipe by duckponding their gear. those that dont shouldnt have it forced on them.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Nurpy Fuzzyfeet » Mon May 26, 2008 5:45 am

Teyaha wrote:um, the handful of long-time toril players that i still keep in touch with that quit the game either after soj3 launched or right after it was renamed to torilmud have no intention of coming back - wipe or not

not because there is anything wrong with the game. they have simply moved along.

those that want a wipe can self-wipe by duckponding their gear. those that dont shouldnt have it forced on them.


They should have it forced on them if it's for the overall good of the mud...which has already been discussed and proven.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby flib » Mon May 26, 2008 6:41 am

ya, I really think a wipe would hurt more than help at the moment. I can see alot of people just going f this throwing up their hands and never coming back if that would occur, me not being one of those heh. But still I think we'd lose a fair percentage of our already mildly small playerbase.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Teyaha » Mon May 26, 2008 7:09 pm

Nurpy Fuzzyfeet wrote:
Teyaha wrote:um, the handful of long-time toril players that i still keep in touch with that quit the game either after soj3 launched or right after it was renamed to torilmud have no intention of coming back - wipe or not

not because there is anything wrong with the game. they have simply moved along.

those that want a wipe can self-wipe by duckponding their gear. those that dont shouldnt have it forced on them.


They should have it forced on them if it's for the overall good of the mud...which has already been discussed and proven.


proven? NOTHING has been proven. all you and everyone else has done is thrown around your opinions. that hasnt proved anything

there are just as many people saying NO to a wipe than are saying YES. and the actual poll shows more votes for no than yes.

where is this proof?
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Nurpy Fuzzyfeet » Sat Jun 14, 2008 10:29 pm

The proof is common sense....the dyeing pbase, lack of noobs, and the enormous benefits a pwipe offers compared to keeping the 20 afking vets that are here now...
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Raiwen » Sun Jun 15, 2008 5:40 pm

I doubt one pwipe will solve much of anything.

It is a solution - but it is a short term solution. In a year or less, you will have a lesser version of what you have now. Instead of everyone having 10 alts, they'll have 3, etc..

If you want to cloak the real issues of the mud with the steady churn of activity, then pwipe yearly.

If you want to solve the real issues, then read the many threads that offer suggestions and then motivate the staff to act upon some of those suggestions.

To be fair, the staff has listened in recent months, and I do see progress. Albeit slow. It is still progress.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Vigis » Wed Jun 18, 2008 6:40 pm

Teyaha wrote:
Nurpy Fuzzyfeet wrote:
Teyaha wrote:um, the handful of long-time toril players that i still keep in touch with that quit the game either after soj3 launched or right after it was renamed to torilmud have no intention of coming back - wipe or not

not because there is anything wrong with the game. they have simply moved along.

those that want a wipe can self-wipe by duckponding their gear. those that dont shouldnt have it forced on them.


They should have it forced on them if it's for the overall good of the mud...which has already been discussed and proven.


proven? NOTHING has been proven. all you and everyone else has done is thrown around your opinions. that hasnt proved anything

there are just as many people saying NO to a wipe than are saying YES. and the actual poll shows more votes for no than yes.

where is this proof?


You do realize that the poll is including results from over a year ago right? In order for it to be representative of the populations current beliefs, it would have to be more recent. Absolutely no poll ever posted on this board should be considered representative.

Now, to contribute to the thread:

Would I come back if there was a pwipe?
Probably not.

Would I come back if there was not a pwipe?
Probably not.

Do I think a pwipe would be good for the game?
Yes.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby loshaenar » Thu Jun 19, 2008 5:12 am

I just can't help but remember the completely different feel to the game that accompanied each pwipe we've had. The sense of urgency to get a char leveled up asap, to find new eq, rares, learn about quests, getting regular crews to do things with, finally being able to zone, guilding..

each of these experiences has made each pwipe a good thing...even though i detested it when told it was happening... afterwards it just completely reenergised the pbase.

I have as much to lose as most of you, but compared to the idle crowds we have now sitting around waiting for the possibility of a zone... (with a few exceptions)... I really believe a pwipe would revitalise the mud; definitely in the short term, perhaps even the long term once 2.0 comes around.

tai.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Thilindel » Fri Jun 20, 2008 5:13 am

I just absol-fuggin-lutely hate questing spells. I don't like having to zone and all the energy to get bids just to get items for a single spell. I think questing spells should be removed outright.

If that were the case, it'd be something I'd consider if each of us had say in a wipe.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Gormal » Fri Jun 20, 2008 4:46 pm

I don't mind any quest spell other than disruption burst. Neat spell, but a quest that is downright stupid. Not to mention the fact that the Shentoin version is so much more difficult than Shenthoin. I think that quest spells do force you to invest a little more in your character, and in the end aren't that difficult or time-consuming (excluding dburst).
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Artmar » Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:42 pm

Nurpy Fuzzyfeet wrote:The proof is common sense....the dyeing pbase, lack of noobs, and the enormous benefits a pwipe offers compared to keeping the 20 afking vets that are here now...
I sincerely doubt that implementing pwipe would bring a significant number of new players to this mud (or not wiping would prevent them from coming). If the potential new players would find the mud interesting, they would come. Otherwise, they won't. For this "interest" factor to really work, it has to be something permanent (or long-term), and not an one-time solution - otherwise the old players (those that will remain) would soon get their levels back, outpacing the newcomers, everything would return to its old place, and the "flood" (or perhaps only trickle) of the new players would stop anyway. Would you then call out for a new pwipe "for the greater good"?

The idea of a Pwipe righting all wrongs and bringing back the glory age is nothing more than a mirage, a wishful thinking. People always want simple solutions for everything, and in the end are always dismayed when these solutions turn out to be either not so simple, or not so helpful as they believed.

As i see it, either the Toril 2.0 changes will be good enough to bring new people in, or they won't. In the first case, not pwiping will not stop people from coming. In the second case, pwipe will not help anyway.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby shalath » Mon Jun 30, 2008 12:34 pm

Artmar wrote:
Nurpy Fuzzyfeet wrote:The proof is common sense....the dyeing pbase, lack of noobs, and the enormous benefits a pwipe offers compared to keeping the 20 afking vets that are here now...
I sincerely doubt that implementing pwipe would bring a significant number of new players to this mud (or not wiping would prevent them from coming). If the potential new players would find the mud interesting, they would come. Otherwise, they won't. For this "interest" factor to really work, it has to be something permanent (or long-term), and not an one-time solution - otherwise the old players (those that will remain) would soon get their levels back, outpacing the newcomers, everything would return to its old place, and the "flood" (or perhaps only trickle) of the new players would stop anyway. Would you then call out for a new pwipe "for the greater good"?

The idea of a Pwipe righting all wrongs and bringing back the glory age is nothing more than a mirage, a wishful thinking. People always want simple solutions for everything, and in the end are always dismayed when these solutions turn out to be either not so simple, or not so helpful as they believed.

As i see it, either the Toril 2.0 changes will be good enough to bring new people in, or they won't. In the first case, not pwiping will not stop people from coming. In the second case, pwipe will not help anyway.

Wow, Artmar! Czesc, long time no see :-)
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Hyldryn » Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:59 pm

I wouldn't mind Toril 2.0 and a pwipe happening at the same time.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Klandal » Tue Jul 22, 2008 9:47 pm

Unless something substantial happens with zones, item stats, equipment distribution, etc., I think a pwipe would be pointless. We'd be running to the same places to get the same equipment that we had before. If there is a complete overhaul in zone/quest item distribution and stats, such as forcing tiers by allowing much larger gaps between tier equipment so you couldn't do the next tier without exhausting that tier, then I'd likely back a pwipe with the introduction of 2.0.

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Re: Wipe?

Postby Gormal » Tue Jul 22, 2008 9:51 pm

Saying that a pwipe would be pointless unless there are massive changes is pretty greedy. Running those same zones now is pointless, at least people would be actively gearing characters up instead of working on their 3rd hitter set an hoarding piles of loot. Lets face it, if you're still gearing up even your second character at this point, you're probably not playing more than 1 day a week if that and aren't much of an asset anyway.

There's no competition in the least anymore, and every zone is just a grind for crap you don't need.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Klandal » Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:26 am

It's a bit off to call me greedy because I'd rather not be forced to do the exact same shit for the exact same rewards I've already done before. If there are substantial changes to make it feel like I'm not just repeating what I already accomplished, I'm open to a wipe. Otherwise it would just be a really unimaginative way to artificially prolong gameplay and I would see a wipe without significant changes as a slap in the face.

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Re: Wipe?

Postby Kifle » Tue Jul 29, 2008 11:58 am

Klandal wrote:It's a bit off to call me greedy because I'd rather not be forced to do the exact same shit for the exact same rewards I've already done before. If there are substantial changes to make it feel like I'm not just repeating what I already accomplished, I'm open to a wipe. Otherwise it would just be a really unimaginative way to artificially prolong gameplay and I would see a wipe without significant changes as a slap in the face.

Klandan


Do you find it a slap in the face when you start a new game after you beat it once? I certainly don't. The point is, you're doing the zone's anyway, but after a wipe, there is actually a meaningful goal -- gearing up your only chr. As it is now, the goal is meaningless because you can easily do without that 5th scorpion earring to give to your 3rd hitter class. In a wipe, it would be your first and there would be competition to make rare hunting more meaningful than it is now -- because, at the end of the day, do you really care if somebody beats you to some rare to gear up your 17th alt? Not really.

I guess it comes down to whether or not you want replay value out of the MUD or are you content with a competitionless environment.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby daggaz » Thu Aug 28, 2008 4:39 pm

I'm only in favor of a wipe because it would force everybody to really start over from scratch and claw their way back to the top, learning as they go.

Even with a totally revamped world, the first thing that is going to happen is the league of uber players are going to go out, and start hitting zones hard (once they figure their characters out) and basically brute force their way into the world, one step at a time, until they learn everything they need to do it effectively.

Its just.... meh, boring. But thats me. And the most recent fun I had on this mud, was when a bunch of us played "pwipe darkies." At least, until that degenerated into a retarded flame war..

If anything, after 2.0 comes in, hopefully the world, the mobs, the objects, the magic and the players themselves will be SO vastly different, a pwipe will be pretty much a moot point either way.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby ssar » Fri Jan 16, 2009 5:03 am

Hmm, some interesting ideas in this thread, especially from you Delmair - I like some of that.

Permitting each person to keep 30 or 40 items of thier choice (especially including Tiamat/high-end quest items) whilst executing a full pwipe might indeed be OK by most.

A full pwipe, however, I fear will largely killit.
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Re: Wipe?

Postby Delmair Aamoren » Sun Feb 08, 2009 4:06 pm

Lol Ssar, check your prescription on those lenses again!

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