The Ant and the Grasshopper

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Lathander
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The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Lathander » Sun Apr 27, 2008 10:26 pm

Two Different Versions! Two Different Morals!



OLD VERSION: The ant works hard in the withering heat all summer long, building his house and laying up supplies for the winter.

The grasshopper thinks the ant is a fool and laughs and dances and plays the summer away. Come winter, the ant is warm and well fed.

The grasshopper has no food or shelter, so he dies out in the cold.

MORAL OF THE STORY: Be responsible for yourself!

-------------------------------------------

MODERN VERSION:

The ant works hard in the withering heat all summer long, building his house and laying up supplies for the winter.

The grasshopper thinks the ant is a fool and laughs and dances and plays the summer away.

Come winter, the shivering grasshopper calls a press conference and demands
to know why the ant should be allowed to be warm and well fed while others are cold and starving.

CBS, NBC, PBS, CNN, and ABC show up to provide pictures of the shivering
grasshopper next to a video of the ant in his comfortable home with a table filled with food. America is stunned by the sharp contrast.

How can this be, that in a country of such wealth, this poor grasshopper is allowed to suffer so?



Kermit the Frog appears on Oprah with the grasshopper, and everybody cries when they sing, 'It's Not Easy Being Green.'

Jesse Jackson stages a demonstration in front of the ant's house where the news stations film the group singing, 'We shall overcome.' Jesse then has the group kneel down to pray to God for the grasshopper's sake.

Nancy Pelosi & John Kerry exclaim in an interview with Larry King that the ant has gotten rich off the back of the grasshopper, and both call for an immediate tax hike on the ant to make him pay his fair share.

Finally, the EEOC drafts the Economic Equity & Anti-Grasshopper Act retroactive to the beginning of the summer.

The ant is fined for failing to hire a proportionate number of green bugs and, having nothing left to pay his retroactive taxes, his home is confiscated by the government.

Hillary gets her old law firm to represent the grasshopper in a defamation suit against the ant, and the case is tried before a panel of federal judges that Bill Clinton appointed from a list of single-parent welfare recipients.

The ant loses the case.

The story ends as we see the grasshopper finishing up the last bits of the ant's food while the government house he is in, which just happens to be the ant's old house, crumbles around him because he doesn't maintain it.

The ant has disappeared in the snow.

The grasshopper is found dead in a drug related incident and the house, now
abandoned, is taken over by a gang of spiders who terrorize the once peaceful neighborhood.

MORAL OF THE STORY: Know Your Congress
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Sarvis » Sun Apr 27, 2008 11:41 pm

Isn't it funny how most Republican beliefs can be summed up using a simple archetype and 2 paragraph story?

Who knows, maybe the world really is just that simple.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Mon Apr 28, 2008 12:50 am

Kind of reminds me about how that slimy bank lent me $300,000 knowing full well I would never be able to pay it back. Now they want to take my house away! Luckily, the government is bailing me out. Those other suckers who did the right thing and saved up enough to buy the house they wanted.. well, its a good thing they pay so much $$$ in taxes. Otherwise, how would the government bail me out?!

Be responsible for yourself? WTF does that mean? Why bother to be responsible when government is always there to wipe your ass for you? Thats the moral of the story. Take huge risks. If you win, you get to keep all the profits for yourself. If you lose, then the taxpayers get it on the chin... not your problem.

Moral hazard.
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth

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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Sarvis » Mon Apr 28, 2008 1:10 am

The best way to build a civilization is with most of the populace facing starvation!
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Mon Apr 28, 2008 1:34 am

Yes, everyone would starve if there weren't rich people to shoulder their burden :)

(Thank god for rich people)?!!!?!!?
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Sarvis » Mon Apr 28, 2008 1:41 am

Corth wrote:Yes, everyone would starve if there weren't rich people to shoulder their burden :)

(Thank god for rich people)?!!!?!!?



Technically the wealthy people only shoulder about half the burden. Of course they do it with 90% of the money so that shouldn't be too tough for them.

Of course, if they didn't gouge us so much on prices people might be able to afford their own food... right? ;)
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Xisiqomelir » Mon Apr 28, 2008 1:51 am

Lath, if we had a gold standard (ie real money), Congress wouldn't be able to use the hidden inflation tax to print their way out of this. ;)
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Ragorn » Mon Apr 28, 2008 2:09 am

Blah blah, ant.

Ant is running around one day and has two legs ripped off by a passing 5 year old.

Rest of ant community throws ant out of colony. "You can't work, why should you get our food?" say the ants. Ant dies.

Moral of story: If you are poor, it's ALWAYS your own fault and nobody should ever help you.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Mon Apr 28, 2008 2:10 am

Thats kind of the nice thing about all the financial products available these days. You can put yourself on your very own gold standard. If government starts inflating away its debts, which is a reasonable thing to expect, your gold assets increase in value to make up for the dilution of your dollars. Power to the people!

Actually, I'm waiting for the first smart person/corporation that starts selling prepaid credit cards backed by commodities. Value of the account fluctuates based upon the value of gold, oil, or whatever other commodity you choose to back it in. I can't see how its any different then essentially choosing to go on the gold standard individually.
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby shalath » Mon Apr 28, 2008 7:00 am

Sarvis wrote:The best way to build a civilization is with most of the populace facing starvation!

Are you quoting from THE THEORY AND PRACTICE OF OLIGARCHICAL COLLECTIVISM by Emmanuel Goldstein?
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Shar » Mon Apr 28, 2008 2:30 pm

Imo, it is never a bad thing to promote self reliance and responsibility. In this country, the usual outcome for those people who are responsible enough to take care of themselves beyond just sufficiency will either feel obligated to, or are guilted by their social/political peers into being obligated to help those who are *unable* to be responsible for themselves. Currently, it is not the responsibility of the individual to help others who are *unwilling* to help themselves. Because of this, the problem then becomes one for society, but because not everyone can differentiate between the two "types" of people, this becomes a political discussion instead of a moral one.

As a "modern" society, how can we sift the two types of people into the correct group, and even if we could/should, what would/should we do after that was accomplished? Idealistically, we would lend enough support to those who do not have it without taking into account their personal ability, thereby creating the feeling of self-reliance. However, I believe that by doing so, it would only perpetuate an illusion of self-reliance, and would in the end, do more to hurt our "modern" society than to help it. Just as the US welfare system by design is a hearty step up for many individuals who need that kind of support, it is also wholly abusable and nearly impossible to be used as intended because... people lie.

For me, I would almost always want to err on the side of compassion than risk having one human fall through the cracks.

Just my initial thoughts.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Xisiqomelir » Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:38 pm

Corth wrote:Thats kind of the nice thing about all the financial products available these days. You can put yourself on your very own gold standard. If government starts inflating away its debts, which is a reasonable thing to expect, your gold assets increase in value to make up for the dilution of your dollars. Power to the people!


Perfectly fine, but then there would be a number of essentially purposeless overpaid economist positions at the Fed which should be terminated. Along with the Fed itself, of course.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Tue Apr 29, 2008 3:48 am

Oh, I am crying so mightily for the Fed. *weep*

:)
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby shalath » Tue Apr 29, 2008 6:37 am

shalath wrote:
Sarvis wrote:The best way to build a civilization is with most of the populace facing starvation!

Are you quoting from THE THEORY AND PRACTICE OF OLIGARCHICAL COLLECTIVISM by Emmanuel Goldstein?

Since I've been asked by a number of people what this is about (and by the way all of you could jfgi), this was the name of the book in Orwell's 1984, created to propagate the idea of a fictitious resistance against Big Brother, but describing the fundamentals of how the state worked. The function of the society strongly echoes what Sarvis said above.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Lathander » Fri May 02, 2008 2:19 am

I don't know Ragorn. The ant seems like a pretty smart ant. He had a lot of success and clearly, he would know injure would be a risk. Like most bright folks, he'd have disability insurance. The ant loses his legs, but receives the same income as before. Ant is in good shape, and the rest of us are not forced to support him because he made good choices. The moral continues to be have responsibility for yourself and your family.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Ragorn » Fri May 02, 2008 5:26 am

Sorry, there's no disability insurance. Barack Antbama didn't get elected, so only the queen ant can afford insurance.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Fri May 02, 2008 5:57 am

Image

I lub joo Ragorn!
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Sarvis » Fri May 02, 2008 12:16 pm

Lathander wrote:I don't know Ragorn. The ant seems like a pretty smart ant. He had a lot of success and clearly, he would know injure would be a risk. Like most bright folks, he'd have disability insurance. The ant loses his legs, but receives the same income as before. Ant is in good shape, and the rest of us are not forced to support him because he made good choices. The moral continues to be have responsibility for yourself and your family.



More elaborate version of Rags' point:

There are only three jobs in an ant-hill: gatherer, guard and breeder (queen.) Because there are so few jobs and so many ants, competition for those jobs has driven wages incredibly low and all but eliminated benefits. Because of this the ant could not afford insurance, and has no medical benefits anyway. His accident and the resulting medical bills mean he is facing bankruptcy, and has no income now anyway because he cannot work.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Lathander » Mon May 12, 2008 2:41 am

From the story I wrote, the ant was successful. How you go from successful and smart to bankruptcy boggles me. Like any smart person, he has disablity insurance so he's covered.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Ragorn » Mon May 12, 2008 2:45 am

Corth wrote:I lub joo Ragorn!

Really?

I just said I'm scared shitless of spiders, so you're going to post pics on purpose?

That's as awesome as posting screamer links.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Ragorn » Mon May 12, 2008 2:46 am

Lathander wrote:From the story I wrote, the ant was successful. How you go from successful and smart to bankruptcy boggles me. Like any smart person, he has disablity insurance so he's covered.

Yeah, don't you know Sarvis? In Republicanland, the only reason anyone would be without disability insurance is if they're too stupid to work.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Lathander » Mon May 12, 2008 2:48 am

If your job offers health insurance, you probably have the option for disability as well. Rags, I assume you have a job. If you have health insurance through it, why would you not take the disability?
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Ragorn » Mon May 12, 2008 2:56 am

Lathander wrote:If your job offers health insurance, you probably have the option for disability as well. Rags, I assume you have a job. If you have health insurance through it, why would you not take the disability?

Do all Americans who work in this country have jobs that offer insurance benefits?

How about part time workers?
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Lathander » Mon May 12, 2008 3:00 am

A part time worker probably doesn't make much money. In that situation, their social security disability benefit would probably be sufficient.

Any job that doesn't have insurance benefits is probably a really low end job.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Ragorn » Mon May 12, 2008 3:06 am

Lathander wrote:Any job that doesn't have insurance benefits is probably a really low end job.

Yep. So...?
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Lathander » Mon May 12, 2008 3:14 am

Disability insurance covers the risk that you lose your income due to not being able to work. If you make like 20K, you don't need DI as the social security benefit would suffice to replace a low income.

So Rags, do you have disability insurance? I know I have it through work, and I would be interested in why you might not have it. I'm assuming you may not since you avoided answering the question on whether you chose it or not.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Ragorn » Mon May 12, 2008 4:12 am

Lathander wrote:So Rags, do you have disability insurance? I know I have it through work, and I would be interested in why you might not have it. I'm assuming you may not since you avoided answering the question on whether you chose it or not.

Of course I have it. I'm not worried about universal health care for my own sake. My company's health plan is the stone cold nuts.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Lathander » Mon May 12, 2008 4:26 am

So let me ask you this. What's special about you that you know to insure your risks, work hard and not be a blight on society? Clearly you're not a republican, so why are you like the "ant"? Why not be the "grasshopper" and waste your time. In the second story, the "grasshopper" uses his lack of success from laziness and sloth to claim some kind of discrimination in the system against him. Why do you feel bad for the "grasshopper" when he made his own choices?
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Mon May 12, 2008 4:35 am

As soon as I found out my wife was pregnant I went and got term life insurance policies for both my wife and myself, along with disability insurance for myself (my wife is covered through work). Thats what a responsible person does. Simple as that. I have a kid who is dependent upon my income, and I can rest easy knowing that if something were to happen, his life would not suffer as a result.

The concern here is that about 70+ years after FDR's 'new deal', collectively as a society we may have lost the ability, in general, to take responsibility for ourselves. Every single time the government creates some new entitlement the message is sent that you shouldn't worry, government is there to take care of you. At some point it became a whole lot SMARTER to be the grasshopper. To take excessive risks with debt, be lazy, be among the majority, and live off the back of the ants who are dutifully working hard, being responsible, saving money, and paying their taxes.
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Kifle » Mon May 12, 2008 5:32 am

Lathander wrote:So let me ask you this. What's special about you that you know to insure your risks, work hard and not be a blight on society? Clearly you're not a republican, so why are you like the "ant"? Why not be the "grasshopper" and waste your time. In the second story, the "grasshopper" uses his lack of success from laziness and sloth to claim some kind of discrimination in the system against him. Why do you feel bad for the "grasshopper" when he made his own choices?


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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Sarvis » Mon May 12, 2008 3:34 pm

Corth wrote:As soon as I found out my wife was pregnant I went and got term life insurance policies for both my wife and myself, along with disability insurance for myself (my wife is covered through work). Thats what a responsible person does. Simple as that. I have a kid who is dependent upon my income, and I can rest easy knowing that if something were to happen, his life would not suffer as a result.


You're a LAWYER. You're practically the definition of upper class. You can't understand how some of us might not be able to afford those coverages? I mean really, come the fuck on. Get your head out of your ass and stop acting like you're somehow special and everyone else is a drone who deserves to die because they don't have everything you do.

The concern here is that about 70+ years after FDR's 'new deal',


Yeah, the new deal. Legislation that came about because of the sheer number of people who became impoverished, homeless and simply dead without this kind of help. You're fooling yourself if you think those people magically had the ability to help themselves before the New Deal. We haven't lost shit, we've gained the ability to care for members of our society.

Well some of us have, others have only gained the ability to disparage others while watching their portfolio.

Remember folks, if you can't afford life and disability insurance you're a dumb person and your kids deserve to starve!
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Mon May 12, 2008 4:13 pm

Then don't have fucking children if you can't take steps to protect them in the event you are hurt or killed. Sorry.

Goddamn. I wish I had the unlimited money that Sarvis thinks I have. Its fucking insulting. I am sacrificing for the good of my kid. Do you know what happens when I pay those life insurance and disability premiums? I put off retirement. Or I don't take a vacation I might otherwise have. Or I don't go out to dinner. If YOUR option is to not pay the rent, or not put food on the table.. then don't have any children!!!

Really seriously starting to think your better off in this day and age to be the grasshopper. Fuck it. Don't pay the premiums. Go out to dinner. Enjoy life. If shit happens, let the government give my children the bare minimum.
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Sarvis » Mon May 12, 2008 4:35 pm

Corth wrote:Then don't have fucking children if you can't take steps to protect them in the event you are hurt or killed. Sorry.


Oh yes, it's just that easy. 50% of our population simply shouldn't breed! You haven't cut enough of life off from them yet, that you have to rob them of the most basic human activities so your portfolio can get a little bigger?

Goddamn. I wish I had the unlimited money that Sarvis thinks I have. Its fucking insulting.


As insulting as saying everyone who doesn't make higher than the median income in this country isn't worth allowing to breed?

I am sacrificing for the good of my kid. Do you know what happens when I pay those life insurance and disability premiums? I put off retirement. Or I don't take a vacation I might otherwise have. Or I don't go out to dinner. If YOUR option is to not pay the rent, or not put food on the table.. then don't have any children!!!


Yes, and we really, truly fucking feel sorry for you. Oh no, Corth can't retire for another year. Boo-fucking-hoo. Because Corth can't retire until he's 46, which I'm betting is a crock of shit anyway, my mother shouldn't have had me. I shouldn't exist. Simple as that.

Fuck off.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Birile » Mon May 12, 2008 4:38 pm

Alright, enough already.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Mon May 12, 2008 6:10 pm

Sarvis,

You seem to think that 50% of the country is as pathetic as you are. I beg to differ.
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Sarvis » Mon May 12, 2008 6:24 pm

How quaint. Slipping from any semblence of a valid point to pure insults then? Not enough for you to back-handedly insult my parents, many of the people I know and large portions of the country is it?

Tell us again how anyone who can't afford service X shouldn't be allowed to breed. Please, we never get enough of that elitist crap.

Maybe after you're done you can explain how well you leet people will manage when the countries population dwindles and there is no longer enough labor to process your life insurance forms. Or can you name many societies that have done well with birth rates that were below replacement levels?
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Mon May 12, 2008 6:31 pm

Ok, I'll tell you again.

If you cannot afford to provide for children by giving them shelter, warmth, and food, and arranging for them to be taken care of in the event of your death or disability, you should not have any.

Despite the fact that apparently the whole country is destitute and living in horribly dire straits, most people are able to provide these basic things. Its very odd.
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Sarvis » Mon May 12, 2008 6:34 pm

Ok, and I'll tell YOU again. You just described my parents. You just said I shouldn't have been born.

Care to insult me again? Care to address the last paragraph of my post (admittedly edited in?)

Care to explain why only a few elite people, who mostly don't care to have many children anyway, should be the ones who have them?
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Mon May 12, 2008 6:43 pm

Well Sarvis.. I'm not directing this at you in particular. I am merely saying that it is wrong to have children when you are not capable of providing for them. It is morally wrong to expect others, through government or otherwise, to take over your own responsibility for your offspring.

Again, I will reiterate that you seem to think that most people are as destitute as you apparently are. I disagree. Its a rich country with a thriving middle class. Highways full of people commuting to their jobs. Endless tree-lined suburbs. People working hard to provide for an enjoyable life for both themselves and their children. I am among these people, and I certainly don't see us as any sort of elite.
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Gormal » Mon May 12, 2008 7:48 pm

Damn you people that work hard enough that the only sacrifices you have to make are putting off a vacation! Don't you know that there are a lot of us trying to play up our hardships and get free money?! STOP MAKING US LOOK BAD ASSHOLE LAYWER ELITIST JERKS!
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Sarvis » Mon May 12, 2008 7:53 pm

In your own words: Fuck off, Gormal.

Or no, you can keep on believing that everyone who has less than you worked less hard than you. It's logical!
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Gormal » Mon May 12, 2008 8:00 pm

No, I rather think I worked harder than many people who have plenty. I blame myself though and I have the personal responsibility to not breed while I can't afford to support children as they deserve. Right now, I'm pretty broke but that's my own fault and the government shouldn't have to pay me because I had plenty of chances to step up that I passed on.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Ragorn » Mon May 12, 2008 8:02 pm

Goddamn. I wish I had the unlimited money that Sarvis thinks I have. Its fucking insulting. I am sacrificing for the good of my kid. Do you know what happens when I pay those life insurance and disability premiums? I put off retirement. Or I don't take a vacation I might otherwise have. Or I don't go out to dinner.

For the record: I'm staying way the hell out of this now :)

I'm just going to say that I wish motivation and intelligence were all you needed to live comfortably. I seriously considered applying for public aid when I was in college, because the town I lived in was a saturated labor market. There were 27,000 students competing for about 5,000 jobs, most of which paid minimum wage with no benefits. I did take the student healthcare package, which is a government subsidized health plan (omigosh, welfare!). I remember there was one day before I was married when Emily and I were standing in Wal-Mart with $35, trying to pick out food that would give us the most meals per dollar so we could survive until my next paycheck.

At that point, no I did not have disability insurance. I didn't even have health or dental. I managed a Gamestop for $7/hr, they didn't offer benefits, and they scheduled me 32-36 hours a week so they could avoid making me a full time employee. Emily waited tables. She slipped on a patch of wet floor one night, broke her wrist, and couldn't carry trays for three weeks. We paid for the medical bills out of pocket (by borrowing from her family). Disability? Lulz. The restaurant fired her (the joys of living in a Right to Work state).

So all I can say is, please don't tell us tales of sacrifice because you can't eat dinner out or you can't take the vacation you wanted. That's a little insulting.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Gormal » Mon May 12, 2008 8:04 pm

I thought this was about sacrificing for children? If you were irresponsible enough to knock Emily up while being that broke, then yeah you shouldn't be allowed to breed.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Mon May 12, 2008 8:09 pm

Ok ragorn. Did you consider having children when all of that was going on? I also clipped coupons at one point and was in serious debt. I didn't consider having children at that point. We did the responsible thing and waited until our financial condition was sufficient to justify it.

I understand you have a job now that provides diability benefits. Awesome. Mine doesn't. I have to pay for it. And I don't have unlimited money. It *IS* a sacrafice. Granted, I don't need those things I am sacrificing. But if I had to sacrifice things that I needed, then I have no business having children in the first place. THAT is the point.

When shouldn't you have children? When you would have to forego paying rent in order to pay for your life insurance or disability insurance premiums. When you do not make enough income to provide for basic things like shelter, clothes, food, and warmth. People that have children without having the capability of providing these things do so with an understanding that someone else will provide them. Namely, ME through the tax dollars I pay. These are the grasshoppers in Lathander's example, and I *seriously* resent them.
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Sarvis » Mon May 12, 2008 8:15 pm

Corth wrote:Ok ragorn. Did you consider having children when all of that was going on? I also clipped coupons at one point and was in serious debt. I didn't consider having children at that point. We did the responsible thing and waited until our financial condition was sufficient to justify it.

I understand you have a job now that provides diability benefits. Awesome. Mine doesn't. I have to pay for it. And I don't have unlimited money. It *IS* a sacrafice. Granted, I don't need those things I am sacrificing. But if I had to sacrifice things that I needed, then I have no business having children in the first place. THAT is the point.

When shouldn't you have children? When you would have to forego paying rent in order to pay for your life insurance or disability insurance premiums. When you do not make enough income to provide for basic things like shelter, clothes, food, and warmth. People that have children without having the capability of providing these things do so with an understanding that someone else will provide them. Namely, ME through the tax dollars I pay. These are the grasshoppers in Lathander's example, and I *seriously* resent them.


I wonder how many had husbands who left them? How many had good jobs that moved to mexico? How many got knocked up when a condom broke? How many grasshoppers have children that will do better than their parents?

Resent them all you want, you're still flat out wrong on this. Of course, we could just stop all that welfare and watch the children starve. I'm sure you'd be thrilled then, right?
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Corth » Mon May 12, 2008 8:20 pm

No, I would not be thrilled. These unfortunate kids are not to blame. Someone needs to meet their needs. Its a miserable day, however, when people like you are sitting here defending the rights of their parents to create this societal problem.
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Sarvis » Mon May 12, 2008 8:25 pm

Sorry, I just understand that people make mistakes. I understand that making a mistake does not make a person a bad person. You might want to write off anyone who was raped and left pregnant and alone, but I do not.

Further, I would postulate that our species would not have survived if the majority of us held that attitude.
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Kifle » Mon May 12, 2008 8:38 pm

Corth wrote:No, I would not be thrilled. These unfortunate kids are not to blame. Someone needs to meet their needs. Its a miserable day, however, when people like you are sitting here defending the rights of their parents to create this societal problem.


I wasn't aware Rag was defending a woman's right to be a divorced, single mother. I wasn't aware he was defending my very educated and very hardworking father's right to have his job moved to mexico. What you're talking about, Corth, are ghetto welfare bitches that breed for money. We are talking about the honest, hard-working people that just get fucked by life. I'm SURE you were having sex when you were poor. I would seriously die laughing if your wife, or whatever girl you were screwing at the time, got pregnant and you had to drop out of school because you didn't think it would be right to get on medicaid or welfare for a bit. It would have been hilarious to see somebody like you forego medicaid so you can "honestly pay your bills" for the birth and then the possible complications during/after the pregnancy.

And what I think is very funny about this, is that Corth needed to take out loans to go to college. Loans that are set up and regulated through government agencies. Hell, you probably even got some of them subsidized, didn't you? Damnt hat government for giving you a chance to better yourself! Since my tax dollars helped subsidize your loans, I demand that I get to hold on to that shiny degree until you pay me and the rest of the country back you dirty grasshopper!
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Re: The Ant and the Grasshopper

Postby Gormal » Mon May 12, 2008 8:39 pm

If you're banging someone, you'd damn well better realize that pregnancy could be the result. Don't come crying to me because the condom broke and you can't afford to feed the little twerp, you should've thought it through before you let your Little Sarvis do the thinking for you. Why should the government be responsible when you obviously don't think that everyone should be? There is no greater commitment than having a child, and while certain circumstances occur that create hardships on families, its not something to go into lightly.


Excluding rape, there is no such thing as an accidental pregnancy.

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