Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Life, the universe, and everything.
Forum rules
- No personal attacks against players or staff members - please be civil!
- No posting of mature images/links, keep content SFW. If it's NSFW, don't post it on these forums.
Shar
FORGER ADMIN
Posts: 791
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2001 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Shar » Fri May 02, 2008 1:26 am

Gormal wrote:But the policies just changed, that's the entire point that has eluded you. You can play semantics all you want and say that certain rules have been in place, but they haven't and the recent crackdown is effectively a change in policy.


Not to use your above argument against you, but you can play sematics all you want and pretend that certain rules haven't been in place, but you are fully aware of them currently, and you have been asked before on different occassion(s) to modify your behavior to fit within the rules. From the time we reformatted the forums, I haven't ever stated that the policies were 100% the same as they were previously. As a matter of fact, we have said that we are starting fresh with the new version of PHP. Certain of the rules we have now have also been in place for years, aka standing. I stated earlier in this thread we will be enforcing those rules, old or new, starting now. We are trying to limit our on again-off again style of moderation.

Gormal wrote:You stated: "the policy for this is standing and will not be debated again any time soon..." so is this really a discussion? You're not reasserting policies that have been overlooked for a short period of time and it seems that no matter how many huge threads I dig up to support this fact, you're going to ignore it, but I'll reiterate this point again. The "Hi, Maxler!" thread was the second-most viewed thread of all time in GD excluding political debates and gathering threads. The image and accompanying phrase has been used and linked throughout the forums and the game and you still were ignorant of it.


You tell me I'm ignorant of material within these forums. I'm ok wearing the title of "Ignorant" for many things, however, I am all too familiar with the content that has recently been archived. It does not matter to me if you think me ignorant or not. We are all entitled to our own opinions about others.

Gormal wrote:How about we take the vend-a-goat image that you claim is innocuous? Realize that it was first posted as a response to me as part of the trend of goatfucking jokes that have been directed at me for over half of a decade. To defend your staff, admin or not, by saying it wasn't directed at me is another glaring example of how you (yourself and Shev) don't know your own forums. Realistically, you're an outsider thats making policy despite your rank in the hierarchy.


Apparently I give off a massive vibe of ignorance. I have been around for almost 14 years and I know all too well about the goat jokes. I'm truly sorry if they offend you. I haven't received any requests for them (from you) to help put them to a stop, nor did you attempt to contact me to make me personally aware that you were offended by them. Certainly, that picture Vaprak posted can be found to be in distaste, but was it directed at you? I don't know. Honestly, it does not matter. If it truly offends you and you can provide a reason for its removal, I will be more than happy to oblige, just as I would with any other request of questionable material.

You were wanting to speak to Shevarash and I don't feel the need to be speaking for or on behalf of him. I will tell you that I am perfectly willing to discuss polices that are due for a change. This SFW content policy will not be up for a change, probably ever.

In short, I'm not ignoring anything. I acknowledge your desire to discuss policy, but you have yet to acknowledge my authority to say which of the policies will or will not be open to change. We can talk about any of them all you like, aka *discuss*. What you want, at this point, appears to be a *debate*. That is what I am unwilling to give you. I'll say it one final time in this thread: The rules and policies of this forum are not going to change.

This will be my final post in this thread about this topic as Shevy has stated that he wants to be the one to discuss your issues with you, in a *new* thread.

Thanks,
Shar - Forger Administrator, TorilMUD

Brandobaris : (51) [ would a forgotten realms zombie be interested in brains? ]

Shevarash tells you 'Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down..... groan'
Kifle
Sojourner
Posts: 3830
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2002 6:01 am
Location: Huntington, IN USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Kifle » Fri May 02, 2008 2:24 am

Image

If you can't beat'em, join'em. This is my white flag :(
Fotex group-says 'Behold! penis!'

Kifle puts on his robe and wizard hat.

Thalidyrr tells you 'Yeah, you know, getting it like a jackhammer wears you out.'

Teflor "You can beat a tank with a shovel!!1!1!!one!!1!uno!!"
Gormal
Sojourner
Posts: 3917
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2001 6:01 am
Location: A Whale's Vagina
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Gormal » Fri May 02, 2008 2:37 am

Why bother? Your wife has already answered all of my questions with "because I said so" and said multiple times that the rules are not up for debate and will not be changed. We know you're not liars because you said so, so you get your wish; I'll just add a few more reasons to be disgruntled at this place and move along.
Last edited by Gormal on Fri May 02, 2008 2:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
Pril
Sojourner
Posts: 1834
Joined: Sat May 11, 2002 5:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Pril » Fri May 02, 2008 2:40 am

Image

The monkey stole the doggy
The best of WTF statments of '06
--------------------------------------------------------
Danila group-says 'afk, machine gun in backyard started shooting cats'
Danila group-says 'afk a sec, 3 horned monkeys trying to steal hose'
Danila group-says 'afk, koala bear trying to mount my car'
Corth
Sojourner
Posts: 6002
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2001 6:01 am
Location: NY, USA

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Corth » Fri May 02, 2008 2:43 am

Kifle wrote:If you can't beat'em, join'em. This is my white flag :(


And the last remaining principled man sells himself out. My work here is done! :)
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth

Goddamned slippery mage.
Kifle
Sojourner
Posts: 3830
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2002 6:01 am
Location: Huntington, IN USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Kifle » Fri May 02, 2008 2:51 am

Corth wrote:
Kifle wrote:If you can't beat'em, join'em. This is my white flag :(


And the last remaining principled man sells himself out. My work here is done! :)


I decided my energy is better spent doing something I enjoy -- appreciating art!
Fotex group-says 'Behold! penis!'

Kifle puts on his robe and wizard hat.

Thalidyrr tells you 'Yeah, you know, getting it like a jackhammer wears you out.'

Teflor "You can beat a tank with a shovel!!1!1!!one!!1!uno!!"
Vaprak
Staff Member - Areas
Posts: 630
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2005 5:46 pm
Location: Midwest

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Vaprak » Fri May 02, 2008 4:58 am

Actually I hadn't even pondered anyone's alleged affinity for goats when I posted the Vend-a-Goat picture. It's just a picture that always makes me smile, more-so than rainbow kisses (the idea of which makes me want to vomit blood). I also get a healthy chuckle out of pictures of paint drying.

I do believe that spidersquirrel may be my new favorite picture though.
Vaprak, the Destroyer
-Formerly Tempus of HomelandMUD -- pre-merger
Pril
Sojourner
Posts: 1834
Joined: Sat May 11, 2002 5:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Pril » Fri May 02, 2008 12:47 pm

Vaprak wrote:Actually I hadn't even pondered anyone's alleged affinity for goats when I posted the Vend-a-Goat picture. It's just a picture that always makes me smile, more-so than rainbow kisses (the idea of which makes me want to vomit blood). I also get a healthy chuckle out of pictures of paint drying.

I do believe that spidersquirrel may be my new favorite picture though.


ROAR! Cofen 1 Corth 0!!!!
The best of WTF statments of '06

--------------------------------------------------------

Danila group-says 'afk, machine gun in backyard started shooting cats'

Danila group-says 'afk a sec, 3 horned monkeys trying to steal hose'

Danila group-says 'afk, koala bear trying to mount my car'
User avatar
Shevarash
FORGER CODER
Posts: 2944
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Shevarash » Fri May 02, 2008 2:46 pm

Gormal wrote:Why bother? Your wife has already answered all of my questions with "because I said so" and said multiple times that the rules are not up for debate and will not be changed. We know you're not liars because you said so, so you get your wish; I'll just add a few more reasons to be disgruntled at this place and move along.


Great, moving along sounds like the best thing for everyone.
Shevarash -- Code Forger of TorilMUD
Llaaldara
Sojourner
Posts: 998
Joined: Fri Aug 16, 2002 5:01 am
Location: Dobluth Kyor

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Llaaldara » Fri May 02, 2008 5:59 pm

I think I get it.

We have two different definitions of the same word. The word is "discussion".


Gormal's 'discussion' is that he wants to talk about the policy in a give-and-take form of communication (aka a debate) which could possibly lead to a change of said policy based on the opinions and information presented in said 'discussion'.

Shar's 'discussion' is simply another way of saying she (or the staff) are open to talking about the reasons why said policy is in place, but that the policy itself is not subject to change regardless of any opinions or information presented on the matter. Simply put, they'll tell you why it is in place, but nothing you say or do will change the current policy - as the policy itself is not subject to 'discussion' or debate, but only why it is in place.


The Short:

Gormal - I want to debate this.

Shar - This is how it is, and we'll tell you why, but it is otherwise not subject to debate.
Ragorn
Sojourner
Posts: 4732
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2001 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Ragorn » Fri May 02, 2008 6:51 pm

The problem is that we have two different definitions of "SFW."

One includes bikinis.
One doesn't.
- Ragorn
Shar: Leave the moaning to the people who have real issues to moan about like rangers or newbies.
Corth: Go ask out a chick that doesn't wiggle her poon in people's faces for a living.
Gormal
Sojourner
Posts: 3917
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2001 6:01 am
Location: A Whale's Vagina
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Gormal » Fri May 02, 2008 7:43 pm

SFW ladies ITT

A pleasure slave starts following you.
May you enjoy your pet.

< 493h/493H 50v/120V >
< P: std > l slave
Branded and chained, this slave is ready and willing to serve her new
master. Tamed by the slaver's whip, she is guaranteed to be gentle and
servile. Trained in the palace's pleasure gardens, she knows hundreds
of ways to pleasure a master. Dressed in diaphanous silks, her stunning
figure is just visible. Her eyes are the only part of her left uncovered, and
she averts her gaze whenever looked at directly.
User avatar
Shevarash
FORGER CODER
Posts: 2944
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Shevarash » Fri May 02, 2008 8:46 pm

The key word in the forum rules above is "images".
Shevarash -- Code Forger of TorilMUD
Gormal
Sojourner
Posts: 3917
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2001 6:01 am
Location: A Whale's Vagina
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Gormal » Fri May 02, 2008 8:47 pm

TorilMUD: Pandering to illiterate prudes since 2008.
Sarvis
Sojourner
Posts: 6369
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2001 6:01 am
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Sarvis » Fri May 02, 2008 8:58 pm

Shevarash wrote:The key word in the forum rules above is "images".



Technically it says "keep content SFW." Text is content.

But that's really besides the point and entirely semantic. The point is you're trying to make the forum for a non-child-friendly game be child friendly.

Just sayin...
<a href="http://www.code-haven.com">Code Haven</a> - For all your programming needs.

I detest what you write, but I would give my life to make it possible for you to continue to write. - Some Guy Who Paraphrased Voltaire
User avatar
Shevarash
FORGER CODER
Posts: 2944
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Shevarash » Fri May 02, 2008 9:12 pm

"content", in this case is referring to the aforementioned images/links. Is that not clear the way the sentence is worded?
Shevarash -- Code Forger of TorilMUD
Sarvis
Sojourner
Posts: 6369
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2001 6:01 am
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Sarvis » Fri May 02, 2008 9:15 pm

Like I said, it's just semantics. I'm sure someone could tell us exactly why that doesn't say what you wanted it to... but it's still entirely besides the point.

So why are you ignoring the actual point?
<a href="http://www.code-haven.com">Code Haven</a> - For all your programming needs.

I detest what you write, but I would give my life to make it possible for you to continue to write. - Some Guy Who Paraphrased Voltaire
User avatar
Shevarash
FORGER CODER
Posts: 2944
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Shevarash » Fri May 02, 2008 9:27 pm

Gormal wrote:TorilMUD: Pandering to illiterate prudes since 2008.


These forums need to be clean enough that they can be viewed in a corporate environment, which means we can't have any explicit pictures posted here, or even close to explicit. That's what "NSFW" means - not. safe. for. work.

I don't make up the standards enforced in the American corporate environment, nor do I necessarily agree with them. I honestly don't understand why you can't comprehend this.

This is the last time I'm going to reply calmly to one of your insulting remarks, Gormal. I offered you the opportunity to have a discussion and you declined and continue to attack with no intent of being constructive. I'm willing to talk with you, but I'm done being civil in response to your acidity.
Shevarash -- Code Forger of TorilMUD
User avatar
Shevarash
FORGER CODER
Posts: 2944
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Shevarash » Fri May 02, 2008 9:30 pm

Sarvis wrote:Like I said, it's just semantics. I'm sure someone could tell us exactly why that doesn't say what you wanted it to... but it's still entirely besides the point.

So why are you ignoring the actual point?


I've explained the intent of this rule over and over again. What is it you're not clear on?
Shevarash -- Code Forger of TorilMUD
Sarvis
Sojourner
Posts: 6369
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2001 6:01 am
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Sarvis » Fri May 02, 2008 9:46 pm

Hrm... what don't I understand...

Well:

1) Why are you so worried about the corporate environment on website for a game type mostly played by college students.

2) Why you have higher standards for "work safe" content than a site like Fark, which is far more popular among cube-jockeys.

3) Why content that has been acceptable for years upon years suddenly isn't.
<a href="http://www.code-haven.com">Code Haven</a> - For all your programming needs.

I detest what you write, but I would give my life to make it possible for you to continue to write. - Some Guy Who Paraphrased Voltaire
User avatar
Shevarash
FORGER CODER
Posts: 2944
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Shevarash » Fri May 02, 2008 9:52 pm

1) Who says this is mostly played by college students? I would guess that we have more users who work in a corporate environment than from college.

2) I don't frequent Fark or understand how you could draw that comparison from our editing out all of 4 images. I think we've been pretty reasonable.

3) Because the moderation policies changed. This was a direct result of receiving complaints about the state of the forums.
Shevarash -- Code Forger of TorilMUD
Sarvis
Sojourner
Posts: 6369
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2001 6:01 am
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Sarvis » Fri May 02, 2008 9:56 pm

1) I didn't say this game was mostly played by students, I said this TYPE of game is. Frankly, to survive the game needs to focus more on new blood than on keeping old players.

2) Well for one thing, I've seen some of the images you removed NOT get removed on Fark.com quite frequently.

3) Ok, fair enough. We're talking about the why of that though, so that's a bit unsatisfactory of an answer.
<a href="http://www.code-haven.com">Code Haven</a> - For all your programming needs.

I detest what you write, but I would give my life to make it possible for you to continue to write. - Some Guy Who Paraphrased Voltaire
User avatar
Shevarash
FORGER CODER
Posts: 2944
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Shevarash » Fri May 02, 2008 10:26 pm

Family game.

Safe to browse the forums from work.

Don't post explicit images.

What part of this is not clear?
Shevarash -- Code Forger of TorilMUD
Gormal
Sojourner
Posts: 3917
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2001 6:01 am
Location: A Whale's Vagina
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Gormal » Fri May 02, 2008 11:06 pm

Simply stunning.
Dalar
Sojourner
Posts: 4905
Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2001 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Dalar » Fri May 02, 2008 11:19 pm

Shevarash wrote:Family game.

Safe to browse the forums from work.

Don't post explicit images.

What part of this is not clear?


Seems clear to me.
It will be fixed in Toril 2.0.
Aremat group-says 'tanks i highly suggest investing 20 silver in training weapons from cm to cut down on the losing scales to shield'
Kifle
Sojourner
Posts: 3830
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2002 6:01 am
Location: Huntington, IN USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Kifle » Fri May 02, 2008 11:40 pm

Shev, with all due respect, I think the point that is trying to be made is that a NSFW tag in the threat title or a NSFW tag before a link to content would for all intents a purposes provide the exact same safeguard for those who waste company time surfing the internet instead of working -- which is in itself NSFW. So, I guess the question is, what is the difference in utility (your admited reasoning behind the current policy changes) between banning content and a NSFW tag?

The second question is, and I would really like this to be taken in a non-agressive manner, why does it seem like you're catering to the moral minority in this matter. The current percentage of the general forums users have been the same who find this newly banned content enjoyable and appropriate (some however do rely on nsfw tags). If you scan through the general forums, you will quickly see that the posters in ideas/gameplay and all the rest hardly respond to threads here -- even the ones which are largely benign. I guess it could be argued that the reason they don't post here is because of the attitudes and content of the general forums, and you would have leg to stand on in that case; however, the attitudes will not change regardless of policy. You will find that instead of blatant insults, posters will resort to subtle condescendsion, sarcasm, and semantical arguments about flaming the content rather than the poster (finger-pointing intended). These things, while just as effective as an out-right insult, are much harder to police in any objective manner which will then result in further complications and bad blood between moderators and users.

Lastly, I think that either you notice but don't care, or haven't thought about it, but the type of policing over the past few weeks is remeniscent of what parents do to their children by blocking showtime or not letting you play D&D because they don't agree with the morals or message these things are sending to their children. The difference here is that we are no longer children. We have all made decisions a long time ago about what we feel is proper. To have someone once again try to force these types of arbitrary morals upon us (and yes, they seem quite arbitrary -- especially the maxler picture) is not only insulting, but it is seen as extremely unfair (due also to previously stated reasons).

I think that if we all really tried, we could agree to a middle-ground. The problem is, that while you say that you are open to discussion, you are again taking the parent role and assigning the child role upon the users -- which again is insulting. If by discussion you mean a mature and meaningful debate about the rules with an opportunity to adjust with good reason, then I would gladly take you up on the offer. If it is the prior, however, I think you're fooling yourself if you truely belive that you're doing anybody a favor.
Fotex group-says 'Behold! penis!'

Kifle puts on his robe and wizard hat.

Thalidyrr tells you 'Yeah, you know, getting it like a jackhammer wears you out.'

Teflor "You can beat a tank with a shovel!!1!1!!one!!1!uno!!"
Gormal
Sojourner
Posts: 3917
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2001 6:01 am
Location: A Whale's Vagina
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Gormal » Fri May 02, 2008 11:45 pm

Excellent post, Kifle. We've posted question after question, resurrected old threads to support our points, and all we've gotten thus far is "these are the rules, we know what's best, deal with it". Its why I chose not to post a new thread for discussion, because it would be you justifying things rather than an open forum for debate with possibility for change. Your community is telling you something, and you're telling them to be quiet, because its whats best for them.

Edit: I think its important to point out that you have an issue here where a group of posters who are often at odds with eachother and many of whom rarely agree, but here are on the same page.
User avatar
Shevarash
FORGER CODER
Posts: 2944
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Shevarash » Sat May 03, 2008 12:26 am

Kifle, thank you for stating your opinion civilly, I appreciate it.

It's really not my intent to force morals upon anyone, treat you like children, or anything of the sort. I'm a pretty strong believer in personal liberties myself, and I understand the reaction to what's perceived as censorship. I started these forums as a venue for players to be as open as they wanted and be able to discuss the game candidly without fear of reprisal, and I don't want to have to restrict anything.

The resurgence in moderation for these forums is a direct result of complaints from other members of the community about the content of posts and the extreme amount of flaming. People get flamed for posting an idea and trying to contribute, and they never want to come back here and post. I want this forum to be open for everybody, and I want it to be appropriate for younger players. I think that's pretty standard - I've never seen a game forum with as loose moderation as we have, and most feature heavy duty word censors and block image posting outright.

The "SFW" label itself isn't because I want to browse these forums at work, it's because it's a well known guide for internet content that I thought everyone was familiar with, and it's closest to what I'd like the Toril forums to be. All of the comments about whether one should or shouldn't be browsing a game forum at work are completely irrelevant.

I realize that the player base is mostly older, so I've tried to offer a compromise between our ideals and the desires of the community by stating that you can post NSFW material in a link so long as it's labelled appropriately (this would obviously exclude content like pornography or anything illegal in the U.S.). I think that's a really fair compromise and leaves the community with only two real restrictions: 1) no flaming 2) no posting explicit images inline. That compromise is completely a modification of the posted rules and yet when I propose it, I am ignored and subsequently told that I am unwilling to change the rules.

As for the Maxler picture, I removed it mostly because I think he finds insults about his weight offensive. Of course I've seen the old thread and realize the history it has here. When I saw it posted again I figured I had to enforce the rules equally - even for Maxler - and so I removed it. If I'm completely off base about what he finds offensive, then I'll restore it if he communicates as such to me either privately or publicly.

I don't know what else I can say about this issue, but I'm still open to civil discussion about it. Before any of you post another scathing, sarcastic remark and tear this post apart as well, please understand that I am trying to be honest and forthright.
Shevarash -- Code Forger of TorilMUD
teflor the ranger
Sojourner
Posts: 3923
Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2002 5:01 am
Location: Waterdeep

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby teflor the ranger » Sat May 03, 2008 4:22 am

Gormal wrote:Your community is telling you something, and you're telling them to be quiet, because its whats best for them.


It seems that there are only three, possibly four of you arguing. From what I get, mostly because you feel that you're being ignored or treated unfairly.

I'm wondering why it is that your band of fellows requires so much of the attention of the staff? The moderation level to keep these forums safe for work DO have the support of the general mud community. I believe the forgers are acting upon the requests of their community to clean up these boards. I too would like to be able to read these in a corporate environment that allows me free time to pursue personal interests during my breaks or my lunch hour.
Teflor does. Teflor does not.
Sarvis
Sojourner
Posts: 6369
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2001 6:01 am
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Sarvis » Sat May 03, 2008 4:31 am

Shevarash wrote:What part of this is not clear?



Perhaps the part where you didn't address any of my points?
<a href="http://www.code-haven.com">Code Haven</a> - For all your programming needs.

I detest what you write, but I would give my life to make it possible for you to continue to write. - Some Guy Who Paraphrased Voltaire
Sarvis
Sojourner
Posts: 6369
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2001 6:01 am
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Sarvis » Sat May 03, 2008 4:34 am

teflor the ranger wrote:
Gormal wrote:Your community is telling you something, and you're telling them to be quiet, because its whats best for them.


It seems that there are only three, possibly four of you arguing. From what I get, mostly because you feel that you're being ignored or treated unfairly.

I'm wondering why it is that your band of fellows requires so much of the attention of the staff? The moderation level to keep these forums safe for work DO have the support of the general mud community. I believe the forgers are acting upon the requests of their community to clean up these boards. I too would like to be able to read these in a corporate environment that allows me free time to pursue personal interests during my breaks or my lunch hour.



I read them in my corporate environment long before the new censorship rules.

Heck, I read worse than that (NSFW) from work. Of course, that link should get me a warning per the rules, so maybe Ishouldn't have posted something with a clear fucking warning. Because, you know, Ash's kid can't read the warning so we have ot be careful.
<a href="http://www.code-haven.com">Code Haven</a> - For all your programming needs.

I detest what you write, but I would give my life to make it possible for you to continue to write. - Some Guy Who Paraphrased Voltaire
teflor the ranger
Sojourner
Posts: 3923
Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2002 5:01 am
Location: Waterdeep

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby teflor the ranger » Sat May 03, 2008 4:43 am

Sarvis wrote:I read them in my corporate environment long before the new censorship rules.

Heck, I read worse than that (NSFW) from work. Of course, that link should get me a warning per the rules, so maybe Ishouldn't have posted something with a clear fucking warning. Because, you know, Ash's kid can't read the warning so we have ot be careful.


Some of us are more responsible, perhaps.
Teflor does. Teflor does not.
Kifle
Sojourner
Posts: 3830
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2002 6:01 am
Location: Huntington, IN USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Kifle » Sat May 03, 2008 5:49 am

Sarvis wrote:

I read them in my corporate environment long before the new censorship rules.

Heck, I read worse than that (NSFW) from work. Of course, that link should get me a warning per the rules, so maybe Ishouldn't have posted something with a clear fucking warning. Because, you know, Ash's kid can't read the warning so we have ot be careful.


Actually, Shev mentioned in the post responding to mine that links labeled as NSFW were allowed under the new rules. I think he just had issue with pictures being directly linked to the posts which are now banned. Correct me if I'm wrong, shev. Also, either Ambar or Vena was the one with the kid on the lap issue. Grandma Ashiwi's kid has a kid :) Personally, I'm fine with having to label and link NSFW things as it is a good compromise; however, the only think I have issue with concerning the new moderation is what falls under the category of NSFW. Personally, I don't believe ladies in bikinis should be nsfw as you will find that stuff on the disney channel and nickalodeon all the time. The only thing in Gormals legendary 3k post thread I would have considered NSFW (and I am on the fence about that even) was the Cuthbert image.

I think what would help the situation would be a clearer definition of what is and what is NSFW and maybe have a bit of discourse again to come to some type of compromise or, at the very least, and understanding of what the definition we will be using here. Again, would you like to comment, Shev? It would be greatly appreciated and it may help solve the issue.

Also, as a personal plea, could you try your hardest to refrain from quoting teflor's posts as I and some others have him on block and really don't wish to even glance at things that he writes. My blood preasure is high enough as it is.
Fotex group-says 'Behold! penis!'

Kifle puts on his robe and wizard hat.

Thalidyrr tells you 'Yeah, you know, getting it like a jackhammer wears you out.'

Teflor "You can beat a tank with a shovel!!1!1!!one!!1!uno!!"
Gormal
Sojourner
Posts: 3917
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2001 6:01 am
Location: A Whale's Vagina
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Gormal » Sat May 03, 2008 6:04 am

I'm out of energy to debate this topic when there's obviously no way Shev's going to budge. I will say however, that the bright red forum rules contradict your statement that NWS links are allowed, and I think I understand you when you say that as long as we mark links NWS and it doesn't lead to porn its okay. What about NWS threads then? Can I drop a warning on the thread title and post whatever I want inside it? I asked that before and was never answered, and rather than removing the [img] tags or changing thread titles you've always deleted threads/posts/images.

The only reason I really care is because I enjoy posting funny stuff, and funny stuff for adults is a tad edgier than a knock knock joke. Another suggestion I posted before was why not create a General Discussion subforum that follows the bbs guidelines from the last few years and you guys can avoid it entirely when at work?
Teyaha
Sojourner
Posts: 1085
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Teyaha » Sat May 03, 2008 6:08 am

why not create your own forums and put a link in your sig (labelled as not safe for work)? or ask shev to create a private board within these boards where they can be posted without moderation?
Gormal
Sojourner
Posts: 3917
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2001 6:01 am
Location: A Whale's Vagina
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Gormal » Sat May 03, 2008 6:10 am

I just suggested that, do you even read before you post? You now are joining Teflor on my foes list.
Teyaha
Sojourner
Posts: 1085
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Teyaha » Sat May 03, 2008 6:12 am

Gormal wrote:I just suggested that, do you even read before you post? You now are joining Teflor on my foes list.


and why would i care?

you suggested to shev that YOu creat your OWN FORUM? interesting. this needs shevs' or shars' approval or something? and yes i knew about the second part, and he never responded to it now did he. try using pm's
Teyaha
Sojourner
Posts: 1085
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Teyaha » Sat May 03, 2008 6:15 am

Kifle wrote:why does it seem like you're catering to the moral minority in this matter.


this is an interesting point. are you sure it's a minority that has complained? i dont know shev personally in any way, but i find it hard to believe that he and shar would use the upgrade as an excuse to archive and then wipe the general forum due to one or two complaints. maybe i'm being naieve in my faith of their ability to run this game and these boards but neither he nor shar have given us numbers - nor do they need to.
Kifle
Sojourner
Posts: 3830
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2002 6:01 am
Location: Huntington, IN USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Kifle » Sat May 03, 2008 6:46 am

Gormal wrote:I just suggested that, do you even read before you post? You now are joining Teflor on my foes list.


Rofl, such a coincidence.
Fotex group-says 'Behold! penis!'

Kifle puts on his robe and wizard hat.

Thalidyrr tells you 'Yeah, you know, getting it like a jackhammer wears you out.'

Teflor "You can beat a tank with a shovel!!1!1!!one!!1!uno!!"
Teyaha
Sojourner
Posts: 1085
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2001 5:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Teyaha » Sat May 03, 2008 7:03 am

Kifle wrote:
Gormal wrote:I just suggested that, do you even read before you post? You now are joining Teflor on my foes list.


Rofl, such a coincidence.



is it really?

who has the warnings, and who does not?

the only times i fly off the handle is when i'm attacked. thankfully these new forum rules would actually prevent such things from happening anymore. I, too was surprised when the hammer dropped with this new board, but i welcome it.

you can ignore me all you wish. that wont stop me from voicing my opinions. i have that right. you have that right. we, however, do not have the right to voice those opinions in a profane way.
flib
Sojourner
Posts: 322
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:14 pm
Location: Annapolis, MD

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby flib » Sat May 03, 2008 8:53 pm

I swear, you people take yourselves too seriously. I honestly don't feel like the freedom to drop the f bomb and show scantily clad pictures of some dudes butt is really all that big of a deal. Flame wars are annoying at best and get nothing accomplished, you end up feeling bitter with nothing resolved. So honestly, a lack of that on these boards is a good thing I'd think. I don't think though that this mud has really ever been kid oriented, it's always been geared for the 18 + crowd I think, but still less flaming is fine by me, it's a pointless exercise in trying to make yourself sound right, which in the end alienates you from other people.
avak
Sojourner
Posts: 672
Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby avak » Sat May 03, 2008 9:33 pm

I think it is funny (or sad) how this forum sort of reflects the state of the mud. Leaders are nonexistent and when they do show up they misdirect their energy massively. I mean seriously, how many people even read the forums anymore? Seriously? 50? 100? Yes, we really need to moderate this place or god forbid someone will be offended or not be able to see it from work. The plane has crashed into the fucking mountain man...and you guys are worried about forum content!

About the only things that makes the forums interesting are flames and drama.

Personally, I've about weened myself completely. Just like the game, my boredom to nostalgia ratio is hitting a tipping point.

All this nonsense makes me wonder what we did in those cold dark days of non-moderation. For that, I thank you.

And for those frail-skinned of you that would faint at the thought of seeing something risque, in the words of Artie Lange, WAAAAAAA.....
Ragorn
Sojourner
Posts: 4732
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2001 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Ragorn » Sun May 04, 2008 3:06 am

It's a question about what's "safe for work."

I don't mind images of girls in bikinis or covered breasts. If my boss walks up behind me while I have those images on my screen, it'll probably be pretty embarassing. However, if my company's Director of IT sees those URLs in my temp files history, they aren't going to get me fired. They're safe for work, because they don't endanger my job.

Porn is not safe for work. It will get me fired.

I don't think it's necessarily a good idea to start proactively moderating the forums based on what you THINK people might be offended by. I don't know if Maxler is offended by that picture or not. If he complains, remove it. If he doesn't, don't. If you start pre-emptively removing things you think might be considered personal attacks, then we can't have pictures of goats on the forum because it's well known that Gormal doesn't like goat jokes. But seriously, that's a degree of moderation which I don't think is necessary here. When people complain, remove things. Don't remove them because you're afraid that people might complain.
- Ragorn
Shar: Leave the moaning to the people who have real issues to moan about like rangers or newbies.
Corth: Go ask out a chick that doesn't wiggle her poon in people's faces for a living.
Raiwen
Sojourner
Posts: 430
Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2001 6:01 am
Location: Atlanta, Ga USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Raiwen » Sun May 04, 2008 5:51 pm

Sarvis wrote:1) Why are you so worried about the corporate environment on website for a game type mostly played by college students.

I was in college when I first started playing this game - some 14 years ago. You'd think you guys would have already graduated in 14 years!!
Sarvis
Sojourner
Posts: 6369
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2001 6:01 am
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Sarvis » Sun May 04, 2008 11:20 pm

Raiwen wrote:
Sarvis wrote:1) Why are you so worried about the corporate environment on website for a game type mostly played by college students.

I was in college when I first started playing this game - some 14 years ago. You'd think you guys would have already graduated in 14 years!!



You have to read _all_ the words, silly.
<a href="http://www.code-haven.com">Code Haven</a> - For all your programming needs.

I detest what you write, but I would give my life to make it possible for you to continue to write. - Some Guy Who Paraphrased Voltaire
ssar
Sojourner
Posts: 1446
Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2001 6:01 am
Location: Newcastle, NSW, Australia
Contact:

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby ssar » Mon May 05, 2008 12:00 pm

Image
BEER
Corth
Sojourner
Posts: 6002
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2001 6:01 am
Location: NY, USA

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Corth » Mon May 05, 2008 2:43 pm

Image
Having said all that, the situation has been handled, so this thread is pretty much at an end. -Kossuth



Goddamned slippery mage.
teflor the ranger
Sojourner
Posts: 3923
Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2002 5:01 am
Location: Waterdeep

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby teflor the ranger » Mon May 05, 2008 5:59 pm

avak wrote:I mean seriously, how many people even read the forums anymore? Seriously? 50? 100?


You, sir, are an optimist. But seriously, how many people, even out of those that come here and look at the pages actually read?
Teflor does. Teflor does not.
teflor the ranger
Sojourner
Posts: 3923
Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2002 5:01 am
Location: Waterdeep

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby teflor the ranger » Mon May 05, 2008 6:01 pm

Sarvis wrote:
Raiwen wrote:
Sarvis wrote:1) Why are you so worried about the corporate environment on website for a game type mostly played by college students.

I was in college when I first started playing this game - some 14 years ago. You'd think you guys would have already graduated in 14 years!!



You have to read _all_ the words, silly.


You know, Sarvis, you used to have such a problem when I'd tell you to learn to read. Admittedly, though, you did always go back and read the parts you skipped. I'm glad we've moved past all of that.
Teflor does. Teflor does not.
User avatar
Shevarash
FORGER CODER
Posts: 2944
Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:01 am

Re: Rainbow kisses and dogs chasing their own tail

Postby Shevarash » Thu May 08, 2008 11:27 pm

Gormal wrote:I'm out of energy to debate this topic when there's obviously no way Shev's going to budge. I will say however, that the bright red forum rules contradict your statement that NWS links are allowed, and I think I understand you when you say that as long as we mark links NWS and it doesn't lead to porn its okay. What about NWS threads then? Can I drop a warning on the thread title and post whatever I want inside it? I asked that before and was never answered, and rather than removing the [img] tags or changing thread titles you've always deleted threads/posts/images.

The only reason I really care is because I enjoy posting funny stuff, and funny stuff for adults is a tad edgier than a knock knock joke. Another suggestion I posted before was why not create a General Discussion subforum that follows the bbs guidelines from the last few years and you guys can avoid it entirely when at work?


Sorry I missed these questions. I think I read the first sentence and stopped.

The bright red forum rules DO contradict the compromise I laid out, as it would be a change in the rules to allow those links. To be clear, I'm talking about external links here - if you want to post something that's NSFW we can allow a labelled external link so long as it doesn't lead to straight up porn or something illegal.

A sub-forum doesn't really address the issue. It's not about me not seeing it at work, it's that we don't want to host the material at all. I don't begrudge you your right to enjoy adult or edgy entertainment - I just want the game TorilMUD to be family oriented and not be associated with that kind of content. I hope that makes sense.
Shevarash -- Code Forger of TorilMUD

Return to “T2 General Discussion Archive”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests