Don't worry, we'll get there.

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kiryan
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Don't worry, we'll get there.

Postby kiryan » Fri Dec 04, 2009 5:05 pm

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,579297,00.html

2 year old boy in UK was "underweight", DHS advised parents feed him junk food. Parents outright refused, court took the kid put him in foster care where he gained a measly 8 ounces (half a pound) in the 4 months it took the parents to win custody back.

sheer ludicricy. 4 out of our 6 chidren were lower than the 15th percentile at birth, 6, 12 and 2 years. 2 of which were basically 0th percentile at various points and the other 2 are > 95th percentile. I'd be f*king pissed if some DHS worker tried to tell me we needed to do something different.

This is exactlyhy the governmnt needs to stay out of our private lives.
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Re: Don't worry, we'll get there.

Postby Todrael » Fri Dec 04, 2009 5:13 pm

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/bo ... 19807.html

For every event where a parent's rights are improperly infringed, the hope is that there are 10 or more cases such as the above that were prevented. Do you know the statistics on how many children these regulations protected from such a fate?
kiryan
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Re: Don't worry, we'll get there.

Postby kiryan » Fri Dec 04, 2009 6:05 pm

For every kid saved, theres 10 families who were thrown under a cloud of suspicion where thousands of pages of paperwork were filed and reviewed by hundreds of government workers for no reason other than some one thinks that xyz parent isn't raising their kids how they should. Its a huge invasion of privacy and most of the time its not warranted.

This kid was separated from his parents for 4 months because of some do gooder social worker. I'm sure I could find plenty of experts who would argue that it was severely traumatizing to the child. You are trying to save too many kids. The government is trying to get involved in too many aspects of every private citizen's life to ensure that no one harms anyone else and no one else comes to harm. There are 6 billion people on the earth, some people are gonna die, some are going to be poor, some are going to be abused. you don't inflict government control on 97% to save that 3%.
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Re: Don't worry, we'll get there.

Postby Sarvis » Fri Dec 04, 2009 6:33 pm

kiryan wrote: We have scientific analysis, but we use a bunch of opinion to decide policy.


Where are your statistics Kiryan. You were bemoaning people who cry based on anecdotal evidence yesterday, and now you are doing the same.
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Re: Don't worry, we'll get there.

Postby Ragorn » Fri Dec 04, 2009 6:47 pm

Sarvis wrote:
kiryan wrote: We have scientific analysis, but we use a bunch of opinion to decide policy.


Where are your statistics Kiryan. You were bemoaning people who cry based on anecdotal evidence yesterday, and now you are doing the same.

I think kiryan made up his own statistics for this thread.
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Re: Don't worry, we'll get there.

Postby Ambar » Sat Dec 05, 2009 4:35 pm

Sometimes ya just gotta shake your head and laugh .. smile / nod .. whatever :)
kiryan
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Re: Don't worry, we'll get there.

Postby kiryan » Sun Dec 06, 2009 11:08 pm

Its called hyperbole. I don't actually think any of you are stupid enough to believe I think 97% or 3% is the actual #, but I suppose I could be wrong.

So when do we start doing genetic testing to weed out the criminals and the retards? Have the government protect us from having to go through the trouble of raising either and protecting society from them?
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Re: Don't worry, we'll get there.

Postby Sarvis » Mon Dec 07, 2009 2:35 am

kiryan wrote:Its called hyperbole. I don't actually think any of you are stupid enough to believe I think 97% or 3% is the actual #, but I suppose I could be wrong.

So when do we start doing genetic testing to weed out the criminals and the retards? Have the government protect us from having to go through the trouble of raising either and protecting society from them?


So you think criminality is genetic? Interesting.
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Re: Don't worry, we'll get there.

Postby Ragorn » Mon Dec 07, 2009 3:11 pm

kiryan wrote:Its called hyperbole. I don't actually think any of you are stupid enough to believe I think 97% or 3% is the actual #, but I suppose I could be wrong.

So when do we start doing genetic testing to weed out the criminals and the retards? Have the government protect us from having to go through the trouble of raising either and protecting society from them?

Shrug, I'm not really interested in your hyperbole. You have a tendency to make a hyperbolic statement and then use THAT as the basis for a slippery slope argument... like you did above. Again, this is an article about underweight kids in the UK, and within half a dozen posts, you're talking about genetically testing criminals.

Your point, I believe, is that you dislike government intrusion into public life. Your point is taken. However, your arguments are ludicrous.
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Re: Don't worry, we'll get there.

Postby kiryan » Mon Dec 07, 2009 5:09 pm

Ragorn, this is a forum, not an academic debate team meet. There is a difference.

Interestingly enough, there were some articles recently about how they found some dna variations they believe contribute significantly to obesity in some cases. I think the figure was 2 out of 1,000 obese kids for the strongest one. So a couple of kids were taken off the governments watch list in Britian because of this.

WHat I find curious is if the point of government intrusion is for the benefit of the morbidly obese children in this case. Why does a genetic predisposition get the family off the list? Doesn't the government still have an obligation to fix these kid who are in immnent danger due to their obesity? The fact is the kids are unhealthy to a gross degree, regardless of their circumstances, doesn't somthing need to be done to protect them? Isn't that the whole point of the government intrusion in the first place?

If the parents are incapable of bringing their children to a healthy weight, shouldn't they be taken away and provided with the proper government care? Or do we just give thm a bunch of accomodations, like being allowed to eat in school and handicapped placards, because they are handicapped by their genetics?

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