Obama and Israel and the Jewish vote.

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kiryan
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Obama and Israel and the Jewish vote.

Postby kiryan » Sun Mar 14, 2010 4:46 am

Obama's defeat in 2010 is going to be epic. I mean a lot can happen, but pissing off jews is not a good idea when they hold large influence in key states. This probably isn't any worse given the initial posture Obama took after inauguration, but wow how much harder do you want to make it on team blue?

What exactly is he gaining too for trashing Israel?

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSLDE62B28W20100314
Botef
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Re: Obama and Israel and the Jewish vote.

Postby Botef » Sun Mar 14, 2010 4:18 pm

Out of curiosity Kiryan, do you support Israel's expansion into settlements and the regular disruption of Palestinian communities?
spunionring
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Re: Obama and Israel and the Jewish vote.

Postby spunionring » Sun Mar 14, 2010 5:40 pm

Is the jewish vote really significant? From what I understand jewish people are a pretty small percentage of the population, even in NY/FL and similar areas.

On the part of Israel and Netanyahu, just apologizing and going ahead with the plans is pretty headstrong, and imo shows that they don't need America as much as we seem to think. If Israel wants to go it alone, then I don't see why we can't let them. But if they want our aid, then as a gesture of goodfaith to both our partnership and also to the coming peace talks, we should expect them withdraw the plans that they announced for those new settlements.

Expanding settlements is advancing the problem in that region, and we need to at least pause both Israeli expansion as well as the fighting. If they won't halt this development while we talk, then I don't see our involvement being positive. In that case, we are just backing them and making them credible while they bully their neighbors.

btw Kiryan, I dont see anywhere in that article where Obama was "trashing Israel". In fact I dont see any mention of Obama at all.
kiryan
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Re: Obama and Israel and the Jewish vote.

Postby kiryan » Sun Mar 14, 2010 9:13 pm

The jewish vote was very important to Obama's election as was the Catholic vote and theres a lot of money involved.

Obama not involved? Who sets foreign policy? Who is responsible for the recent change in US Israel relations? Seriously?

--

I'm conflicted about Israel and Palestine. The creation of Israel in the first place was ridiculous. The response of the arabs are justified in my opinion, and Israel's response to the first war was justified as well. I'm not sure how to recitfy the situation given where we are 50 years later. The occupation of Palestine (whether its a state or just a province under martial law) is wrong, but Israel is justified in providing security for its law abiding citizens.

In the end, for me I tend to come down a little more positively on the side of Israel. The palestinians could have peace if the give up violence. They may face discrimination for generations, but they could have peace and begin the healing. When can the Israeli's have peace? When they are dead? When they relocate out of the middle east?

I don't think its fair... but thats the price we (the world) pays for the creation of Israel. We owe the Palestinians and the entire middle east a great debt for what we have done to their region. but if I have to pick one group or the other to govern, well its no contest which religion, government takes care of the people better.
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Re: Obama and Israel and the Jewish vote.

Postby teflor the ranger » Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:15 pm

You almost expect a Facebook group to pop up: "I support Obama not supporting Israel."
kiryan
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Re: Obama and Israel and the Jewish vote.

Postby kiryan » Tue Mar 16, 2010 9:35 pm

Democrats criticizing Obama's handling of Israel. Relations at a 35 year low according to Israel... So we've gone backwards in relations to the tune of 35 years while simultaneously saying you may have been a US ally in the past but that doesn't count for anything going forward since President XYZ is in charge now. What stature did we gain with Muslim countries for throwing Israel under the bus?

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/ ... srael.html

Pro-Israel Democrats have begun to criticize the Obama administration's stern stance toward Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.

Pennsylvania Rep. Christopher Carney, a Democrat, and Illinois Republican Rep. Mark Kirk are sending a letter this morning to President Obama asking the administration to climb down.

New York's intensely pro-Israel delegation has also begun to criticize the White House openly, if in measured tones.

Jewish groups, including the American Jewish Committee and Anti-Defamation League, have also criticized the White House, and while the Congressional criticism remains measured, it appears to be growing louder.
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Re: Obama and Israel and the Jewish vote.

Postby kiryan » Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:18 pm

More criticism on Obama. This one basically says Obama is stirring up a hornets nest by inciting Palestinians to rise up against Israel due to the announcement of 1600 new residences in a palestinian neighborhood in Jerusalem. It claims he is blowing it up to extract concessions from Israrel on negotiations. It may or may not work, but I wonder if he is prepared to take credit if it devolves into violence.

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2010/03/ ... d-axelrod/

After a diplomatic crisis last week, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has been working to bring calm to the region, while U.S. President Barack Obama inexplicably appears to be trying to escalate tensions. Obama, a novice in Middle East diplomacy, may soon learn that fabricating controversy is not a good idea. Not in the Middle East

Rather than issue a quiet rebuke, the Obama administration saw an opportunity to put Israel on the defensive. Israeli apologies were not enough. The plan was clearly to extract concessions from Israel in future peace talks

Egged on by the administration's admonishments, several prominent Palestinian leaders called upon Arabs living in Israel to march upon Jerusalem to "protect it from the Jews," leading to heightened tensions in the holy city over the weekend. Yesterday, youths wrapped in Palestinian flags and checkered headscarfs came out in force to burn tires and throw rocks at Israeli soldiers. Ten Palestinians and one Israeli were reported injured.

It's too soon to know if a new round of violence is officially underway. But if it is, Obama will have himself to blame. If the president was looking for a way to jumpstart peace, he chose poorly. Drawing out this diplomatic crisis has only fanned the flames of hatred on the Palestinian street.

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