Elves rally!!

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Selias
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Elves rally!!

Postby Selias » Sun Dec 15, 2002 9:48 am

alright, I'm an elf junkie. My invoker char is an elf and he just got mooshed. I figured that since other <20 chars can get a ress, so can't I? Too bad I lost that 20% that would have put me... oh so much closer to getting off the island. So yeah umm... why are we 2x penalaized again? I understand that elves could get ress'd on the mainland get get teleported there. But I'm on EM soil and I can't get a ress? That's just discrimination.

Also I understand that is how it is coded, so that elves, no matter where they are, can't get a ress until they're above level 20. But since we were removed that privledge b/c people decided to ress onto the mainland doesn't mean that we should lose the privledge on our on soil.

If you're going to make elves the hardest goodie race to play, please at least give us an island to call our own where only we can go. That's what Evermeet was supposed to be anyway. Maybe the randomly lucky person got to visit, but other than that, the traditional EM was to the elves only.

I'm not advocating that EM should be anything more special than any other zones in the mud. I'm just simply asking that since the elves are the hardest goodie race at least give us a reason to be elves! Make EM untraversable by any other race on Faerun, or let elves >20 ress. If the island is so badass that we need to stay here until 20, at least make other people wonder what's on it...

Edit: messed up the < and >, thanks Lenefir

[This message has been edited by Selias (edited 12-15-2002).]
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Postby Lenefir » Sun Dec 15, 2002 9:58 am

I think you're mixing < and > Image

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Postby Guest » Sun Dec 15, 2002 10:01 am

The old D&D rule on ress for elves was you could never be resurrected, period. This is much nicer.

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Selias
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Postby Selias » Sun Dec 15, 2002 10:07 am

itchy, if we were playing D&D rules then a lot would be different. Are you saying that you'll pick and choose?
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Postby Selias » Sun Dec 15, 2002 10:09 am

oops


[This message has been edited by Selias (edited 12-15-2002).]
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Postby Yayaril » Sun Dec 15, 2002 1:54 pm

The gods pretty much get to pick and choose what DnD rules they use. Or else the displacer beast wouldn't cast spells =9

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Postby Malacar » Sun Dec 15, 2002 3:06 pm

And I'll note that elves CAN be resurrected in DnD now, so your point is moot.

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Postby Yayaril » Sun Dec 15, 2002 3:28 pm

It's not moot if you're playing with Second Edition rules, Malacar.

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Postby Malacar » Sun Dec 15, 2002 3:29 pm

I don't see him quoting any particular edition, so it can go either way.

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Postby rylan » Sun Dec 15, 2002 4:18 pm

I think the mud is losely based on 2nd edition rules.

But anyway, it would be nice to be able to res elves on EM. I have no idea how much of a coding nightmare that would be however. Or maybe just make it so you can't drag elf corpses under level 20 through a portal, and remove the res restriction? Maybe that would be easier to code up.
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Postby Snurgt » Sun Dec 15, 2002 4:24 pm

Every time I read a thread like this I feel just a tiny bit cooler.

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Postby Ambar » Sun Dec 15, 2002 5:19 pm

Bah be glad you are an elf .. 20% sub lvl 20 isnt that hard to get ..

Elves are DIFFERENT .. if you dont like the restrictions, don't play Image

big warm Ogre hugs!

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Postby Ashiwi » Sun Dec 15, 2002 5:41 pm

I really don't see much reason to get ressed pre-20. The experience is easy enough to make back.
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Postby Yayaril » Sun Dec 15, 2002 5:47 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Malacar:
<B>I don't see him quoting any particular edition, so it can go either way.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, he said that elves couldn't be ressed at all. Thus, I'm sure he isn't talking about Santa's Elvish toymakers. Then you responded with elves CAN be ressed in DnD, so you are probably referring to third edition where they can be ressed. I'll repeat and expound- you can play with any edition of DnD you want to. From what I can tell, this mud is based on second edition DnD. So, in the end, his point really isn't moot. Lump it up, elf boy =9


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Postby Malacar » Sun Dec 15, 2002 6:22 pm

Bite me goggleboy. :P

And if this mud is based on 2nd edition, I have a list of 3 pages worth of stuff that doesn't fit... So why not one more. Image

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Postby Yayaril » Sun Dec 15, 2002 7:10 pm

Do you even understand what you type? You yourself wrote 'based on second edition'. Do you know what 'based on' means? =9

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Postby Malacar » Sun Dec 15, 2002 7:21 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Yayaril:
<B> I'll repeat and expound- you can play with any edition of DnD you want to. From what I can tell, this mud is based on second edition DnD. So, in the end, his point really isn't moot. Lump it up, elf boy =9


</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, and I was quoting you.

Do you? Image

Don't forget, based on means not exact.. Thus monks could easily exist. So really, both of us are arguing a moot point, yes?

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Malacar - omg ymir!
Tanji ASSOC:: 'god was blueballed the night before he made Thanuk'

[This message has been edited by Malacar (edited 12-15-2002).]
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Postby rylan » Sun Dec 15, 2002 9:39 pm

Fight! .. Fight! .. Fight!

*cackle*
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Postby Selias » Sun Dec 15, 2002 9:45 pm

Alright, I understand that sub20 xp is easy, but still, why can't elves ress at least on EM? I had my voker up to 90% or so to level 20, died, no ress, and am now at 66%. That 24% is equal to 10-12 solo kills on the xp mobs on the island. Let's say that each kill takes 4mins (prep, battle, mem). I just lost 40-50mins of my time where I have to be bored to tears on EM again instead of being able to hop on the mainland and actually find a group or two.

The elves are penalized, and granted this is only a small one, but there are others. Evils are penalized, but at least they have innates to make up for it. It is a simple problem to fix, and a simple question to answer.

Why do the elves get the shaft over arguably every other race in the game (cept maybe yuanti)? It seems that elves get jack and sh*t, and I haven't seen jack around lately.

Not meant as insulting, I just really want to know what makes us so special that we receive such bad treatment.
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Postby cherzra » Sun Dec 15, 2002 9:54 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Selias:
Evils are penalized, but at least they have innates to make up for it. </font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yeah. Innates make up for having only a few ppl online 90% of the day!

Type who evil s, then who good s, and rethink your brilliant statement.
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Postby Salen » Sun Dec 15, 2002 10:22 pm

Cheesy Ra needs a huge I think.

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Postby Malacar » Sun Dec 15, 2002 10:55 pm

Yeah, shame on you Selias for voicing your opinion. Don't you know the evils are the underdog and always will be no matter what?

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Postby Xisiqomelir » Mon Dec 16, 2002 12:52 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by cherzra:
<B> Yeah. Innates make up for having only a few ppl online 90% of the day!
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Don't you know it! Every time we're about to go somewhere and then the resser logs, why, all the group leader needs to do is say "OK all you illithid/drow, start LEVITATING" and then all the problems are solved! You Neutrals shouldn't let us keep getting away this. Image

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Postby Selias » Mon Dec 16, 2002 1:37 am

I didn't say that innates make up for the fact that more people choose to play good chars. I'm sorry if that's what you thought Cherz, but I meant that their innates make up for the prejudice that their races get b/c of wandering aggros and harder hometowns.

EM has wandering aggros, granted they are only a %load, but many newbies have died to the manticore that likes to load on the main road. Also being a sub20 elf leaves maybe 2 or 3 other people to group with until you're level 20 and can get to the mainland. None of the other races are hardcoded to be segregated like that, so why elves?

Do we get something special that I don't know about? If so someone pls tell me ingame so I can put this to rest.
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Postby oteb » Mon Dec 16, 2002 2:02 am

You have infra, easy to get -100ac even for caster, fastest memtimes and Lilithelle. Isn't that enough?

And mainland has Moritheil... Image

[This message has been edited by oteb (edited 12-15-2002).]

[This message has been edited by oteb (edited 12-15-2002).]
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Postby Ashiwi » Mon Dec 16, 2002 3:36 am

We are elves, and there are high prices to pay for innate coolness.
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Postby Corth » Mon Dec 16, 2002 3:39 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Xisiqomelir:
<B> You Neutrals shouldn't let us keep getting away this. Image
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not much us neutrals can do. That race of female trolls you guys have tanking for you are hardcore bashers!

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Postby Treladian » Mon Dec 16, 2002 4:12 am

"I think the mud is losely based on 2nd edition rules."

Actually, I think it's mostly 1st edition. Some classes resembled their 1st edition versions more than anything else until various tweaks and additions were put in with time.

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Postby Iktar » Mon Dec 16, 2002 4:17 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by oteb:
<B>You have infra, easy to get -100ac even for caster, fastest memtimes and Lilithelle. Isn't that enough?
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

agree on lilithelle! but gnomes have fastest mem time for goodie caster
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Postby Tanji Smanji » Mon Dec 16, 2002 4:28 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Ashiwi:
We are elves, and there are high prices to pay for innate coolness.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Like being shoved in lockers and wedgies!

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Postby Bipple » Mon Dec 16, 2002 5:38 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Iktar:
<B> agree on lilithelle! but gnomes have fastest mem time for goodie caster

</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Gnomes don't mem faster than elves, at best their even although I think their a notch or two behind.
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Postby Kunrikan » Mon Dec 16, 2002 5:45 am

Actually, in second edition, elves _could_ get ressed, they just couldn't get raise dead
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Postby Shevarash » Mon Dec 16, 2002 6:56 am

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Iktar:
<B> agree on lilithelle! but gnomes have fastest mem time for goodie caster

</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is not so. Elves are the fastest good raced memmers.

They were equal to Gnomes earlier in the wipe, but this was changed over the summer.

I will look into a fix for the sub-20th elven ress situation.


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Postby Zoldren » Mon Dec 16, 2002 1:14 pm

just be glad our res isnt like fr res... youd loose a level :P

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Postby thanuk » Mon Dec 16, 2002 3:36 pm

!ress for anyone under 20 Image You cant enter wells and portals, why should u get ressed? Save highlevel spells for highlevel characters.


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Postby Malacar » Mon Dec 16, 2002 4:38 pm

I think that's a fair trade-off actually, Nuk.

It gets my vote.

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Postby belleshel » Mon Dec 16, 2002 6:26 pm

Is this really that big a deal that we should have coders looking into this rather than fixing/adding other features? Elves are hard to level, this is known. We are tougher than your run of the mill dwarf/human Image Chars on the mainland can do a lot of things those of us on the island couldn't. I personally like the extra challange,
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Postby amolol » Mon Dec 16, 2002 6:38 pm

if you dont like the restrictions play a diff race...this comming from an elf...elves are penalized yes...do i see a hige reason for it no elves suck as a hitter class dont do a whole lot as casters till there off the island theres no such thing as an elven tank so its even harder i play em any way because i enjoy the chalenge...isnt that what mudding is about being challenged and having fun?....somone please set me strait if my veiws on playing a game are wrong...
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Postby Malacar » Mon Dec 16, 2002 7:03 pm

Saying "if you don't like it, don't play it" is a cop out to the 8millionth degree.

Really wish people would throw out the broken record.

And this is not directed solely at you, Amolol, nor is it intended as an 'attack'. Hope it is not taken as such.

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Postby moritheil » Mon Dec 16, 2002 7:51 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Shevarash:
<B>I will look into a fix for the sub-20th elven ress situation.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hey Shevy,

I think Iuz and I had this out a few months earlier. Basically you can't be ressed <20 because your corpse could be dragged to the mainland. However, they DID make it so that if you lose 20 on the mainland and are then 19.8 or whatever, you can be ressed back.

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Postby amolol » Mon Dec 16, 2002 8:46 pm

no offence taken and i will do my best to not repeat others in the future but i think that it is a vallid point...one should do there reaserch before they play a charictor...there are things that i dont like about elves but i stick with it and dont complain for it is the will of the gods that this is so ....ive learned not to question those who are more powerful than me...tomuch
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Postby Malacar » Mon Dec 16, 2002 8:48 pm

You should -always- question those 'above' you. Just do it quietly and politely, they're not always right.

I've played an elf for years and years.. I still have issues with the way they are handled, but hey, I am not going to stop playing them because I have a few complaints. I'll just keep lobbying for change.

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Postby Ashiwi » Mon Dec 16, 2002 9:46 pm

Make it tougher on us, we can take it! You gotta have balls of steel and butt muscles of iron to be an elf!
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Postby sok » Tue Dec 17, 2002 12:13 am

make them eunuchs
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Postby Treladian » Tue Dec 17, 2002 5:00 am

Amolol: "no offence taken and i will do my best to not repeat others in the future but i think that it is a vallid point...one should do there reaserch before they play a charictor"

And how would someone playing for the first time research a character? Remember, nothing about the unique hardships of many races are mentioned in the helpfiles.

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Postby Selias » Wed Dec 18, 2002 12:20 am

Shev: thanks for this... I'd even be happy if you made it so that no sub20 chars can get res'd. At least then it would be an even playing field.

Amolol: I've been playing either a half-elf or a grey elf, starting on EM ever since I started this mud some 7 years ago. I know all about their hardships and their challenges. They're my favorite race, and *I* can deal with it, but what about the new players (if we have any these days) that don't know about elves. The fact that you basically have to solo to 20 is ridiculous, especially for casters w/o any gear. I remember dying to sparrows in the parks in Leuth at the start of this wipe.

As I've said before the elves get the shaft in several areas. This whole ress situation is just one of them that I felt should be pointed out. All in all, I still don't get why elves are restricted to the island until level 20. Is this just b/c it's a grandfathered rule?
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Postby Glorishan » Wed Dec 18, 2002 4:32 am

I don't think elves should be let off the island before 20, personally. As far as ressing goes, either all should be able to or none. Would seem fair. But then again I don't feel very strongly about it.

Glorishan


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Postby amolol » Wed Dec 18, 2002 6:29 pm

well quit complaining and if you rolled a decent char then mebbe you could kill somthing...bvesides i play a ranger you complain about soloing to lvl 20 try soloing to lvl 50...thats hard work especiall yas a new player without any gear...
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Postby Rausrh » Wed Dec 18, 2002 8:43 pm

All you so-called geeks think you know everything. First edition this, second edition that, third edition those. You're an embarassment. Bask in the basement you pasty skinned geek-wannbies! Back I say!

A true geek knows that this game is not based off, but an exact copy (down to every last description and table) of the Fouth edition DnD rules. Luckly, copyright protection does not extend into the future yet.

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Postby Malacar » Wed Dec 18, 2002 9:01 pm

Oh crap, I thought it was 4.357893 edition.. I stand corrected.

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