Why do we need a justice?

[ilerim]

I was waiting for my friends this evening and had nothing to do. I practiced unbind and assassinate a bit and went to the inn because my friend icq'ed me that he will login in 5 minutes. Only 1 thing left - disguise. As you may aware the easiest way to remove disguise is attacking a mob - you remove it without delay. I have killed a dog and someone decided to report the crime. Now have a look what happened:

Cefiw enters from above.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > You stop trying to hide.
Swirling shadows engulf you as an etched shadow dagger dances into the air
striking a stray dog repeatedly. With a final deadly blow the
dagger spirals deeply into a stray dog's chest then wrenches
itself back to your hand forcing him to drop to his knees in agony.
Your disguise falls apart!
A stray dog is stunned!
a stray dog is dead! R.I.P.
You receive your share of experience.
Your blood freezes as you hear the rattling death cry of a stray dog.
Bands of shadowy scalemail wrap around you!
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
Something resembling the blast of a horn can faintly be hear outside.

< P: std > The corpse of a stray dog does not contain the coins.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > Saving...
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > You disguise yourself into a dwarf.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
Danahg leaves west. <--- I guess he went to report me
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
Cefiw leaves west.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
The magical side of things is less visible.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > You attempt to hide yourself.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > Saving...
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
Tida puts some spellbook(s) in bag.
Tida stops sitting around and gets to her knees.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
An elite RDF guard enters from the west.
An elite RDF guard enters from the west.
Tida whispers a soft prayer to Sharess.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
Tida rises to her feet.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
An elite RDF guard says 'Stop! Ilerim, you're under ARREST! Damn tourists alway
s cause problems around here.'
An elite RDF guard says 'Looks like we need to teach you a lesson.'
An elite RDF guard strikes out wildly about the area in a mighty burst of power!
An elite RDF guard hits Tida extremely hard.
An elite RDF guard says 'Stop! Ilerim, you're under ARREST! Damn tourists alway
s cause problems around here.'
An elite RDF guard says 'Looks like we need to teach you a lesson.'
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
An elite RDF guard attacks Tida, landing three hits.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
Tida attempts to flee.
Tida leaves up.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
From outside, the faint chimes of the clock tower sound 12 midnight.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
An elite RDF guard gets a leather backpack.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
An elite RDF guard leaves west.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
An elite RDF guard attacks Shaiith, landing a single hit.
An elite RDF guard kicks Shaiith in the solar plexus. Shaiith is rendered breathless.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
An elite RDF guard attacks Shaiith, landing two hits.
An elite RDF guard attacks Shaiith, landing two hits.
An elite RDF guard knocks Shaiith backwards several feet with a powerful kick.
Shaiith attacks an elite RDF guard, landing a single hit.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > You stop trying to hide.
Assist whom?
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > < 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > Sorry, no one here is that smart.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
Saving...
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > Your assassination attempt goes wide of the mark.
Your disguise falls apart!
Your attack only grazes an elite RDF guard as he dodges aside!
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< T: Shaiith TC: nasty wounds E: guard EC: few scratches P: std >
Your attack only grazes an elite RDF guard as he dodges aside!
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
n elite RDF guard dodges your futile attack.
An elite RDF guard attacks Shaiith, landing a single hit.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >

You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
An elite RDF guard attacks Shaiith, landing a single hit.
An elite RDF guard misses a kick at Shaiith's groin.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< T: Shaiith TC: pretty hurt E: guard EC: few scratches P: std > Tavern of the Dead Orc
Exits: -W
A bottle of ale lies here.
Corpse of Yarash is lying here. (magic)
Averis (AFK) (Human) sits resting.
A bartender watches you calmly, while he skillfully mixes a drink.
You escape eastward!
< 457h/457H 122v/123V >
Why? You are not fighting anyone.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > Entrance to the Inn of the Dead Orc
Exits: -E -W -U
A torch lies discarded here.
Corpse of a stray dog is lying here.
Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic) (glowing)
Corpse of Iriulaes is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Smirn is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Darel is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Anofin is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Alabas is lying here. (magic)
An elite RDF guard stands here, fighting Shaiith.
Migalat (AFK) (Grey Elf) stands, inches above the surface here.
Shaiith (Grey Elf) stands in mid-air here, fighting an elite RDF guard.
Galzar (Human) stands here.
< 457h/457H 122v/123V >
< P: std > You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
< 457h/457H 122v/123V >
< T: Ilerim TC: excellent E: guard EC: few scratches P: std >
Danahg enters from the west.
< 457h/457H 122v/123V >
< T: Ilerim TC: excellent E: guard EC: few scratches P: std >
You dodge an elite RDF guard's vicious attack.
An elite RDF guard hits you extremely hard.
OUCH! That really did HURT!
You dodge an elite RDF guard's vicious attack.
An elite RDF guard switches targets..
Your attack only grazes an elite RDF guard as he dodges aside!
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You miss an elite RDF guard with your pierce.
< 384h/457H 123v/123V >
Tavern of the Dead Orc
Exits: -W
A bottle of ale lies here.
Corpse of Yarash is lying here. (magic)
Averis (AFK) (Human) sits resting.
A bartender watches you calmly, while he skillfully mixes a drink.
You escape eastward!
< 384h/457H 122v/123V >
< P: std > < 384h/457H 122v/123V >
Why? You are not fighting anyone.
< 385h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > Entrance to the Inn of the Dead Orc
Exits: -E -W -U
A torch lies discarded here.
Corpse of a stray dog is lying here.
Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic) (glowing)
Corpse of Iriulaes is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Smirn is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Darel is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Anofin is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Alabas is lying here. (magic)
Danahg (Human) stands here.
An elite RDF guard stands here, fighting Shaiith.
Migalat (AFK) (Grey Elf) stands, inches above the surface here.
Shaiith (Grey Elf) stands in mid-air here, fighting an elite RDF guard.
Galzar (Human) stands here.
< P: std > Your attack only grazes an elite RDF guard as he dodges aside!
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
An elite RDF guard dodges your futile attack.
< 385h/457H 122v/123V >
< T: Ilerim TC: small wounds E: guard EC: few scratches P: std >
An elite RDF guard hits you extremely hard.
An elite RDF guard hits you extremely hard.
OUCH! That really did HURT!
A mighty hit from an elite RDF guard makes you contemplate a new career!
OUCH! That really did HURT!
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
< 207h/457H 122v/123V >
< T: Ilerim TC: nasty wounds E: guard EC: few scratches P: std >
Danahg completes his spell...
Danahg utters the words, 'babratgtui'
Shaiith's skin gains the texture and toughness of bark.
< 207h/457H 122v/123V >
< T: Ilerim TC: nasty wounds E: guard EC: few scratches P: std >
Danahg starts casting a spell.
< 208h/457H 123v/123V >
You gasp in pain from an elite RDF guard's awesome hit!
OUCH! That really did HURT!
You dodge an elite RDF guard's vicious attack.
You dodge an elite RDF guard's vicious attack.
An elite RDF guard dodges your futile attack.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
< 134h/457H 123v/123V >
< T: Ilerim TC: pretty hurt E: guard EC: few scratches P: std > Danahg completes his spell...
Danahg utters the words, 'babratgtui'
Your skin gains the texture and toughness of bark.
Tavern of the Dead Orc
Exits: -W
A bottle of ale lies here.
Corpse of Yarash is lying here. (magic)
Averis (AFK) (Human) sits resting.
A bartender watches you calmly, while he skillfully mixes a drink.
You escape eastward!
< 134h/457H 122v/123V >
You attempt to hide yourself.
You extend your sights westwards.
Entrance to the Inn of the Dead Orc
Exits: -E -W -U
A torch lies discarded here.
Corpse of a stray dog is lying here.
Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic) (glowing)
Corpse of Iriulaes is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Smirn is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Darel is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Anofin is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Alabas is lying here. (magic)
An elite RDF guard stands here, fighting Shaiith.
Migalat (AFK) (Grey Elf) stands, inches above the surface here.
Shaiith (Grey Elf) stands in mid-air here, fighting an elite RDF guard.
Galzar (Human) stands here.
< 137h/457H 123v/123V >
< 138h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
Your skin crawls as you hear a death cry nearby!
< 138h/457H 123v/123V >
You extend your sights westwards.
Entrance to the Inn of the Dead Orc

Exits: -E -W -U
A torch lies discarded here.
Corpse of Shaiith is lying here.
Corpse of a stray dog is lying here.
Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic) (glowing)
Corpse of Iriulaes is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Smirn is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Darel is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Anofin is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Alabas is lying here. (magic)
An elite defense force guard stands here, scanning for invaders.
Migalat (AFK) (Grey Elf) stands, inches above the surface here.
Galzar (Human) stands here.

[ 5 minutes later ]

An elite RDF guard enters from the west.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
An elite RDF guard enters from the west.
< 457h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
An elite RDF guard says 'Stop! Ilerim, you're under ARREST! Damn tourists alway
s cause problems around here.'
An elite RDF guard says 'Looks like we need to teach you a lesson.'
An elite RDF guard sends you sprawling.
< 454h/457H 123v/123V >
< T: Ilerim TC: few scratches E: guard EC: excellent P: sit >
An elite RDF guard says 'Stop! Ilerim, you're under ARREST! Damn tourists alway
s cause problems around here.'
An elite RDF guard says 'Looks like we need to teach you a lesson.'
You dodge a bash from an elite RDF guard, who loses his balance and falls.
< 454h/457H 123v/123V >
< T: Ilerim TC: few scratches E: guard EC: excellent P: sit >
Galzar peers around intently, looking for something.
< 454h/457H 123v/123V >
< T: Ilerim TC: few scratches E: guard EC: excellent P: sit >
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You miss an elite RDF guard with your pierce.
You miss an elite RDF guard with your pierce.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
An elite RDF guard hits you extremely hard.
OUCH! That really did HURT!
You dodge an elite RDF guard's vicious attack.
You stagger from a fearsome hit from an elite RDF guard!
OUCH! That really did HURT!
< 323h/457H 123v/123V >

An elite RDF guard dodges your futile attack.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You barely pierce an elite RDF guard.
You dodge an elite RDF guard's vicious attack.
You stagger from a fearsome hit from an elite RDF guard!
OUCH! That really did HURT!
You stagger from a fearsome hit from an elite RDF guard!
OUCH! That really did HURT!
< 199h/457H 123v/123V >
< T: Ilerim TC: nasty wounds E: guard EC: few scratches P: sit > You clamber to your feet.
200h/457H 123v/123V >
< T: Ilerim TC: nasty wounds E: guard EC: few scratches P: std > Tavern of the Dead Orc
Exits: -W
A bottle of ale lies here.
Corpse of Yarash is lying here. (magic)
Averis (AFK) (Human) sits resting.
A bartender watches you calmly, while he skillfully mixes a drink.
You escape eastward!
< 200h/457H 122v/123V >
< P: std > You attempt to hide yourself.


[ Next 10 minutes Danahg was trying to bind me and bring to justice. Do I really need to say that it is amlost impossible to do that with 50 level rogue? Even if he would have brought me to the justice, I would easily escape from the jail.
Well at the end i decided to switch chars because I though that Danahg would not let me play at all...]

An elite RDF guard enters from below.
An elite RDF guard enters from below.
< 298h/457H 119v/123V >
< P: std >
An elite RDF guard says 'Stop! Ilerim, you're under ARREST! Damn tourists always cause problems around here.'
An elite RDF guard says 'Looks like we need to teach you a lesson.'
An elite RDF guard says 'Stop! Ilerim, you're under ARREST! Damn tourists always cause problems around here.'
An elite RDF guard says 'Looks like we need to teach you a lesson.'
An elite RDF guard strikes out wildly about the area in a mighty burst of power!
An elite RDF guard lands a mighty hit on Celera!
Celera attempts to flee.
Celera leaves down.
< 298h/457H 120v/123V >
Entrance to the Inn of the Dead Orc
Exits: -E -W -U
A torch lies discarded here.
Corpse of Shaiith is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic) (glowing)
Corpse of Iriulaes is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Smirn is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Darel is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Anofin is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Alabas is lying here. (magic)
Celera (Human) stands here.
A street cleaner is walking around, picking up trash.
Galzar (Human) stands here.
< 299h/457H 121v/123V >
< P: std > Tavern of the Dead Orc
< P: std > Tavern of the Dead Orc
Exits: -W
A bottle of ale lies here.
Corpse of Yarash is lying here. (magic)
Averis (AFK) (Human) sits resting.
A bartender watches you calmly, while he skillfully mixes a drink.
< 299h/457H 120v/123V >
You stop trying to hide.
You attempt to hide yourself.
< 300h/457H 121v/123V >
< P: std > Saving...
< 301h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std > Saving...
< 301h/457H 123v/123V >
< P: std >
Your skin crawls as you hear a death cry nearby!
< 301h/457H 123v/123V >
You extend your sights westwards.
ntrance to the Inn of the Dead Orc
Exits: -E -W -U
A torch lies discarded here.
Corpse of Celera is lying here.
Corpse of Shaiith is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Elusia is lying here. (magic) (glowing)
Corpse of Iriulaes is lying here. (magic)
[2] Corpse of Smirn is lying here. (magic)

[2] Corpse of Silena is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Darel is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Anofin is lying here. (magic)
Corpse of Alabas is lying here. (magic)
An elite defense force guard stands here, scanning for invaders.
A street cleaner is walking around, picking up trash.
Galzar (Human) stands here.
< 302h/457H 123v/123V >
You tell Danahg 'you just killed Celera :P'

[Ambar]

I didnt think justice *worked* when killing animals .. sure it wasn't something else? Maybe earlier? Seemed INSTANTANEOUS that Danahg left and the RDF came in, usually take at LEAST a couple seconds...

If no justice, then we could just kill any old thing in town. Think it was set to discourgae exp in home towns?

A 50th lvl rogue should know the penalties from killing in town :P

[Yasden]

WTF?!

You were wanted by justice 4x over, and the RDF's were hunting you down because of that, not because anyone turned you in. Your repeated hiding and unhiding were what caused them to constantly come.

I was trying to turn you in so the damn justice crap would stop. *YOU* pkilled Shaiith and Celera both, and I'm sure Shaiith will attest to this.

The only reason you managed to escape from me was because I messed up my drag alias. Don't claim you "know" justice just because you kill a few mobs and are wanted. I maxed my unbind skill by knowing the ins and outs of it.

Seems like I need to petition now...I wasn't going to, before. Ass.

[rylan]

The RDFs should not use hitall. Thats absurd for a mob that is enforcing justice to to attack innocents that are in the same room.

[Lilira]

And people wonder why I don't AFK under the inn... visions of a certain person irritating a magician and causing it to area come to mind...

I agree that RDFs should not hitall unless they are actively engaged in combat with more than one person though. As for the killing the dog? That's not what set them on you. Justice only kicks in if you kill a citizen. (ie A peasant, fool, street cleaner, etc.)

When you get wanted, leave town! Can't tell you how many tie-up parties I've had at Turning Point or the Farmhouse while working my unbind. (Don't go there guys...) By the time you head back in, the RDFs will have settled down, and you won't get anyone else killed.

By the way.. I don't believe that unbind is class related.. its str vs. str on the person you're trying to tie up. Yasden, please correct me if I'm wrong, but I think I remember you telling me something like that when you were maxing yours.

[ilerim]

WTF?!

You were wanted by justice 4x over, and the RDF's were hunting you down because of that, not because anyone turned you in. Your repeated hiding and unhiding were what caused them to constantly come.

I was trying to turn you in so the damn justice crap would stop. *YOU* pkilled Shaiith and Celera both, and I'm sure Shaiith will attest to this.

The only reason you managed to escape from me was because I messed up my drag alias. Don't claim you "know" justice just because you kill a few mobs and are wanted. I maxed my unbind skill by knowing the ins and outs of it.

Seems like I need to petition now...I wasn't going to, before. Ass.

Don't say bullshit! You were trying to tie me up at tp and at 4way :P
Thats first... Second I was at the inn during 15 minutes and RDF came only after you left... Sorry logs dont show that clearly, but passed about 1 minute after you left the room and RDF came in.
Third, you didn't tell me that you want to stop crap... instead of that you were constantly reporting to justice ( I was sneaking around and i saw your 1 east from the judge... ) and trying to tie me. You didn't reply on any of my tells. You welled to me to 4ways ( near vines ) and tried to bind me there...

Today i was in WD again and spend about an hour unhiden - justice didn't came and I am still wanted. That means you lie. They dont came on time... they only came if someone reports.

fix your alliases and come bring me to justice... I bet 1k plat :P If i get sentensed i pay you 1k, if not you pay me, you agree?

[ilerim]

A 50th lvl rogue should know the penalties from killing in town :P

Anyway RDF's should try to kill me, not other players. I knew what I was doing and I didn't want to kill other players. For example Justice in ZK works much better. One guard searches and another bashes - thats fine. Why RDF in WD just do "hitall all"?

[Yasden]

You obviously know justice about like you know your ass from a hole in the wall. You CANNOT report someone unless they committed a crime, and you CANNOT report it more than once. Did you ever stop to think that maybe the RDF's reported you again for Escape after they couldn't kill you? I'm not saying they did, I'm just saying even I don't know how Waterdhavian justice works when it comes to the RDF's failing to kill you.

You're damned right I was trying to tie you up and turn you in. You pkilled Shaiith, then Celera, and tried to blame it on others, instead of yourself. I was sitting 1e of judge waiting for Shaiith to un-afk to minor create some more ropes for me. He was sitting there to be a well target. Had I not been called to Izan's, I would've spent the rest of the night trying to turn you in. That's how stubborn and relentless I am. I was not, however, "reporting you over and over" as you'd like to believe.

Why don't you just admit you have absolutely no freakin' clue how justice works other than crimereport? Have you ever played Grand Theft Auto? The more you get yourself wanted, the more relentless the police are in trying to catch/kill you. You were wanted for *4*, yes, FOUR separate offenses...it's the same concept here. They were going to kill you, and unfortunately the combat routine they use involves hitall all, not hitall, resulting in two player deaths.

Accusing me of pkill is not something I'm going to sit back and take idly, so sorry for any vitriole in my responses. If you'd just let me turn you in, you could've cleared your name, so to speak.

-Deathmagnet

[ilerim]

May be you right, Yasden, I wasn't sitting at the judge and don't know who has reported me, but definately someone did it, because I only had 3 crimes when I came to the INN. But how you can explain that they didn't came after me again when you went to zone?

My apologize to Shaiith and Celara for being cause their death, but it is not completely my fault, it is definately a BUG in justice system. As you can see from the log I have tried my best to save Shaiith, but I coudn't do much unfortunately without stone and haste. You should have told me that I need to leave the town instead of trying to turn me and that could save Celara :P. Anyway thank you for the fun you made trying to tie me up. I enjoyed it :)

[ilerim]

...
Y I was sitting 1e of judge waiting for Shaiith to un-afk to minor create some more ropes for me. He was sitting there to be a well target.
...
-Deathmagnet

Are you sure you can drag someone through the well? I am prety sure you can't do it thought portals, so I assume you can't do it through well too...

[Yasden]

We were going to find that one out, but he was mostly a well target because I needed ropes and someone with uber int to keep searching you out while I tied/drug.

[moritheil]

Dear RDFs,

I am sorry that my absence has caused you to take on an extra burden of late. Please rest assured that I will take my duties back as soon as possible, and that it is not necessary to slay adventurers on my behalf. I appreciate the gesture, but it is not needed.

Sincerely,

Moritheil

[ssar]

Bwahahaa!

That's awesome :)

I love how RDFs hitall, if only they had engaged Galzar in a hitall and smited he the event would have been all the more sweet.

If you can't do the time, don't do the crime. ;)

I do think all INN rent rooms should be flagged peace rooms, and there should be a couple more peace (but not silent) rooms around hometown/big city central areas perhaps.

Hmmm.. RDF exp, anyone?

[Thilindel]

The hitall all crap is just as stupid as khelvos or whatever bossman's name is in scardale. His goons hitall all as does he when you're in the room. It's not newbie friendly in that zone, and a RDF, so-called 'Protector of the Innocent' SURE the hell shouldn't be indiscriminately whirlwinding thru a crowded room. The judge should hop off his peace room ass and go beat down on some rogue RDF's...

While your at it, remove the peace room that judge is in! Quite a few people owe that bastard something.

[Dranix/Straxin]

Remember, not only players can report you. Other Mobs can report you if they witness the crime.

[Corth]

Yeah so I afk once in a while... And twice those hitalling RDF's have killed me while afk. Surprise surprise!

Corth

[Ashiwi]

Can't tell you how many tie-up parties I've had at Turning Point or the Farmhouse... (Don't go there guys...)

But, but, but, but....