That's why we sing for these kids,
who don't have a thing except for a dream,
and a fuckin' rap magazine
who post pin-up pictures on they walls all day long,
idolize they favorite rappers and know all they songs
Or for anyone who's ever been through shit in their lives,
till they sit and they cry at night wishin' they'd die
Till they throw on a rap record and they sit,
and they vibe.
We're nothin' to you but we're the fuckin' shit in they eyes
that's why we seize the moment try to freeze it and own it,
squeeze it and hold it,
cuz we consider these minutes golden
and maybe they'll admit it when we're gone.
Just let our spirits live on,
through our lyrics that you hear in our songs and we can...
Sing with me (Sing!)
Sing for the year (Sing It)
Sing for the laughter
sing for the tear (C'mon!)
Sing it with me
Just for today
Maybe tomorrow
The good Lord will take you away...
-Eminem/Steven Tyler
-Sing for the Moment/The Eminem Show
*********************************************
A lot of people don't understand rap,
they dismiss it thinking it is nothing
more than preaching violence.
for many of us who grew up with violence,
this is our outlet.
It is such a tragedy that such expression
goes unheard . . . when that deaf ear is
the reason why the message needs to be told.
It is a tragic cycle of ignorance.
*********************************************
-Daz
------------------
One, I don't know who in the hell you are.
Two, I don't CARE who in the hell you are.
This isn't personal.
THIS IS A GAME.
Erevan
. . . . .
-
Grungar
- Sojourner
- Posts: 967
- Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2001 6:01 am
- Location: Somewhere on the east coast, usually.
- Contact:
Not much of an Eminem or Steven Tyler (his lips are frightening. But his daughter has some damn spiffy eyes) fan. More of a Tribe, Public Enemy, KRS One, Run DMC, and of course Icy Hot Stuntaz man myself when it comes to hip hop. I get the weirdest looks when people hear A Tribe Called Quest (if they can even identify it) or Public Enemy coming from my speakers. It's great. "But but but... You're white. Ghostly white. You make Casper the Friendly Ghost look tan..." It's even better when they're standing there, mouths agape, and Winamp randomizes to something like Beethoven or some of the random arias I have from Andrea Bocelli. They just kinda shake their head and walk away, muttering 'white people...'
The lyrical talent of the Icy Hot Stuntaz just amazes me. I didn't think anyone could rhyme the word 'fuckin' with 'fuckin', but hey- they're geniuses. What can I say?
I left my wallet in El Segundo.
- Grungar "Nothing to contribute, as usual" Forgefire
The lyrical talent of the Icy Hot Stuntaz just amazes me. I didn't think anyone could rhyme the word 'fuckin' with 'fuckin', but hey- they're geniuses. What can I say?
I left my wallet in El Segundo.
- Grungar "Nothing to contribute, as usual" Forgefire
Hehe, Rap! I spent most of my teen tears listening to Rap partaking in it lyrcal movements, Bah I almost hate it now, I like a few songs still...ones with an actual melody. I found rap to be very lifting at times, I was able to really touch base with the lyrics in alot of the songs, till I realized that they were nothing but exaggerated points of people who wanted to make themselves look like some bad az! brilla off the mutha fukn streets of compton!
It was funny the way we acted togather! I never sported any colors except to mock a gang, nor did I participate in any gang related activity invlolving babies. But I did get to visit some cells and eat crappie food, why... for being a bad az! I dont regret those days nor do I praise em, the bad stuff I did I have paid for now, I am clean and happy, when I listen to rap I laugh my ars off! and when I go see my old Homies, heh! all 2 of em left I laugh even harder, I have now found comfort in my old friends from elementary school! Love those G,s So my point is! I feel some rap music, {not DMC, or Loc} influences alot more youths than people realize. Younger generation see that it cool to do hard drugs, Role peeps on the corner, and to Pimp out there lil bow wow,s! Talk smack! Multiple sex partners and have a zillion babies!, well I guess some of that can be associated with other things! blah blah! anyway rap is a negative influence on todays youth, it is simply not music anymore! Clean up rap! praise the lord without talking about jacking his car! and PLEASE! put a melody back in Rap!
It was funny the way we acted togather! I never sported any colors except to mock a gang, nor did I participate in any gang related activity invlolving babies. But I did get to visit some cells and eat crappie food, why... for being a bad az! I dont regret those days nor do I praise em, the bad stuff I did I have paid for now, I am clean and happy, when I listen to rap I laugh my ars off! and when I go see my old Homies, heh! all 2 of em left I laugh even harder, I have now found comfort in my old friends from elementary school! Love those G,s So my point is! I feel some rap music, {not DMC, or Loc} influences alot more youths than people realize. Younger generation see that it cool to do hard drugs, Role peeps on the corner, and to Pimp out there lil bow wow,s! Talk smack! Multiple sex partners and have a zillion babies!, well I guess some of that can be associated with other things! blah blah! anyway rap is a negative influence on todays youth, it is simply not music anymore! Clean up rap! praise the lord without talking about jacking his car! and PLEASE! put a melody back in Rap!
you are thinking of hip hop.
rap is a way for people who are 'problems' to express themselves, and be heard by like-minded people. the crap you are talking about is not rap, its glorified gangsta hip-hop. rap is not about doing drugs, slapping hoes, or killing people. you hear that out of context. rap is about how that is part of life. im sure you can sit back and laugh, you grew out of your 'yo-years' grats.
some people dont 'listen' to rap, they feel it. rap is listening to a piece - bobbing your head, and feeling "man, thats just how i feel!" i really really dislike a lot of the crap that is made by once good artists, for commercial sales - but fuck it, god bless america - i ain't mad.
rap is for people who took what they got, who grew up before their time, who fought because they had to, not because it was cool. rap is for people who tell you what neighborhood when you ask where they are from. rap is only a phase for middle class suburban white kids, who listen to rap as a way to be rebelious without entering a world that is more over their heads than they know. its a sore subject, but im getting more personal than i need to here. ill come back and defend all the arguments i have made from people saying i am wrong.
------------------
One, I don't know who in the hell you are.
Two, I don't CARE who in the hell you are.
This isn't personal.
THIS IS A GAME.
Erevan
rap is a way for people who are 'problems' to express themselves, and be heard by like-minded people. the crap you are talking about is not rap, its glorified gangsta hip-hop. rap is not about doing drugs, slapping hoes, or killing people. you hear that out of context. rap is about how that is part of life. im sure you can sit back and laugh, you grew out of your 'yo-years' grats.
some people dont 'listen' to rap, they feel it. rap is listening to a piece - bobbing your head, and feeling "man, thats just how i feel!" i really really dislike a lot of the crap that is made by once good artists, for commercial sales - but fuck it, god bless america - i ain't mad.
rap is for people who took what they got, who grew up before their time, who fought because they had to, not because it was cool. rap is for people who tell you what neighborhood when you ask where they are from. rap is only a phase for middle class suburban white kids, who listen to rap as a way to be rebelious without entering a world that is more over their heads than they know. its a sore subject, but im getting more personal than i need to here. ill come back and defend all the arguments i have made from people saying i am wrong.
------------------
One, I don't know who in the hell you are.
Two, I don't CARE who in the hell you are.
This isn't personal.
THIS IS A GAME.
Erevan
-
Grungar
- Sojourner
- Posts: 967
- Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2001 6:01 am
- Location: Somewhere on the east coast, usually.
- Contact:
Woo, 450th post!
Problematic people can express themselves in a variety of manners. We punks are considered 'problem' people. We have our own brand of damn spiffy tunes to tickle the cochlea. Nor is the artistic expression of problems limited solely to the auditory medium. Jackson Pollock is a prime example. He was one crazy messed up dude, yet his work is world famous. A lot of abstract art type stuff stems from the same sort of feelings expressed in rap. Only these people chose a different medium through which to convey those feelings and emotions and whatnot. Nor is this expression limited to art in and of itself. Some people go do crazy wacky stuff. Creepy stuff. Anyways, I'm getting off topic.
You get the trendy, watered-down, sell-out stuff no matter where you go (Blink 182 is a prime example). I dunno that for all suburban white kids rap is a form of rebellion. Many of them do it just for the trend appeal. Many of them do it because the rappers use profanity, and profanity, to kids, is cool. Many of them may identify with the feelings of angst, isolation, or alienation. Many of them may just like the beat.
You mentioned something along the lines of "rap is for people who took what they got, who grew up before their time, who fought because they had to, not because it was cool." A lot of folks who grew up during the Great Depression or during the Viet Nam War eras went through that sorta stuff, yet I don't see old people or Viet Nam vets listening to rap. Ragtime and Creedence. =D
Yeah, and as long as this generation is the sound byte generation, dominated by the media, you're always going to have an ignorant throng ready to denounce something when told to do so by the almighty cathode ray tube sitting in their living room. Hell, I'm sure Carson Daly could start qute the revolution, if he armed his legion of prepubescent screaming girlies and told them to kill for N'Sync. People are cattle. Moo.
Not trying to be argumentative or anything here, just posting my views, avoiding doing the work I should have started 12 hours ago... And I wonder why my grades are in the toilet?
Oh yeah, Daz, I was wondering what you thought of Christian Rap. If you look in Winamp, they have a category for Christian Gangsta Rap. That makes me laugh. Anyways, I'd look forward to debating this stuff with you, if only I knew how to debate. I mostly make up random stuff that goes nowhere, and ends up confusing the hell out of people. I'm going to make a great tutor next year to the organic chemistry kids. Heh heh heh.
- Grungar "Whatever happened to Vanilla Ice?" Forgefire
Problematic people can express themselves in a variety of manners. We punks are considered 'problem' people. We have our own brand of damn spiffy tunes to tickle the cochlea. Nor is the artistic expression of problems limited solely to the auditory medium. Jackson Pollock is a prime example. He was one crazy messed up dude, yet his work is world famous. A lot of abstract art type stuff stems from the same sort of feelings expressed in rap. Only these people chose a different medium through which to convey those feelings and emotions and whatnot. Nor is this expression limited to art in and of itself. Some people go do crazy wacky stuff. Creepy stuff. Anyways, I'm getting off topic.
You get the trendy, watered-down, sell-out stuff no matter where you go (Blink 182 is a prime example). I dunno that for all suburban white kids rap is a form of rebellion. Many of them do it just for the trend appeal. Many of them do it because the rappers use profanity, and profanity, to kids, is cool. Many of them may identify with the feelings of angst, isolation, or alienation. Many of them may just like the beat.
You mentioned something along the lines of "rap is for people who took what they got, who grew up before their time, who fought because they had to, not because it was cool." A lot of folks who grew up during the Great Depression or during the Viet Nam War eras went through that sorta stuff, yet I don't see old people or Viet Nam vets listening to rap. Ragtime and Creedence. =D
Yeah, and as long as this generation is the sound byte generation, dominated by the media, you're always going to have an ignorant throng ready to denounce something when told to do so by the almighty cathode ray tube sitting in their living room. Hell, I'm sure Carson Daly could start qute the revolution, if he armed his legion of prepubescent screaming girlies and told them to kill for N'Sync. People are cattle. Moo.
Not trying to be argumentative or anything here, just posting my views, avoiding doing the work I should have started 12 hours ago... And I wonder why my grades are in the toilet?
Oh yeah, Daz, I was wondering what you thought of Christian Rap. If you look in Winamp, they have a category for Christian Gangsta Rap. That makes me laugh. Anyways, I'd look forward to debating this stuff with you, if only I knew how to debate. I mostly make up random stuff that goes nowhere, and ends up confusing the hell out of people. I'm going to make a great tutor next year to the organic chemistry kids. Heh heh heh.
- Grungar "Whatever happened to Vanilla Ice?" Forgefire
I...just can't resist flaming here...rap and/or hip-hop, whichever name you want to assign it, is awful. Just awful, and it will only get worse as the cash rolls in at the record label and the search for more and more *ahem* talent grows. I don't have anything against rap in particular, but more against any sort of super-trendy ultracool music. It's just that rap/hip-gop seems to have the biggest crap-farm going. No one will get better music until people start demanding it.
------------------
Zellin group says 'I'm still here buddy =)'
Zellin has left the group.
------------------
Zellin group says 'I'm still here buddy =)'
Zellin has left the group.
opinions are like assholes .. and everyone has them ... but mines not wrong just cause i disagree...
why must we call anything we dont like awful???? that is so closed minded and intolerant!!! (i still love ya zellin just dont agree with your message:P)
I am a 34 year old, blonde haired, hazel-blue eyed white girl who likes rap!!! and the way i dress and look people always assume im into country or something like that
sure i got some garth brooks cd's but they sit right next to the jay-z and eminem !!!
i gave a couple of my classmates a ride to the galley yesterday (err in civilian speak thats where young sailors eat free) ... they got in the car (2000 4-runner with leather seats) .... i started it and eminem started jumpin ... they were like holy shit .. AE1 (err my job title) rides in style AND listens to rap?? who knew huh!!!
so THERE :P
and damn i may be listening to jay-z while we zone
scary thought!!!!
------------------
Ambar -= Big Pimpin' =-
[This message has been edited by Karikhan (edited 05-31-2002).]
why must we call anything we dont like awful???? that is so closed minded and intolerant!!! (i still love ya zellin just dont agree with your message:P)
I am a 34 year old, blonde haired, hazel-blue eyed white girl who likes rap!!! and the way i dress and look people always assume im into country or something like that
sure i got some garth brooks cd's but they sit right next to the jay-z and eminem !!!i gave a couple of my classmates a ride to the galley yesterday (err in civilian speak thats where young sailors eat free) ... they got in the car (2000 4-runner with leather seats) .... i started it and eminem started jumpin ... they were like holy shit .. AE1 (err my job title) rides in style AND listens to rap?? who knew huh!!!
so THERE :P
and damn i may be listening to jay-z while we zone
scary thought!!!!
------------------
Ambar -= Big Pimpin' =-
[This message has been edited by Karikhan (edited 05-31-2002).]
-
Grungar
- Sojourner
- Posts: 967
- Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2001 6:01 am
- Location: Somewhere on the east coast, usually.
- Contact:
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Sartorix:
<B>i lvoe you guys
i just want o say that the mud is really cool and then tmy bachlero party is tontite and that i lov ethe mud
thsi keyboard suckas
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
A drunken Sartorix. Now that's something I'd pay to see =D
Grats on everything, man!
- Grungar "Of all the ings in the world, I like sleeping the best" Forgefire
<B>i lvoe you guys
i just want o say that the mud is really cool and then tmy bachlero party is tontite and that i lov ethe mud
thsi keyboard suckas
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
A drunken Sartorix. Now that's something I'd pay to see =D
Grats on everything, man!
- Grungar "Of all the ings in the world, I like sleeping the best" Forgefire
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Daz:
<B> rap is for people who tell you what neighborhood when you ask where they are from. rap is only a phase for middle class suburban white kids, who listen to rap as a way to be rebelious without entering a world that is more over their heads than they know.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Daz, your views are so skewed that I wonder whether you can even comprehend your own thoughts. Quite frankly, I find your blanket generalizations to be outright insulting and demeaning.
I am now 23, but have listened to rap as far back as I can remember, and so happen to fall into the category that you kindly coin as "middle class suburban white kids." Yes, I'm white, yes I'm originally from a snobby town, yes I have $$$, but to link those character traits to my taste in music is outright insulting.
The problem with music these days is the egotistical puds that run around proclaiming what is "OK" to listen to, thus influencing young kids on what the "in" thing is to purchase. Let people listen to what they want, if they can relate to it then so be it, but at least have the intellect not to stereotype the underlying motivations for an entire subgroup of people.
Lastly, if any mention of women or drugs in rap represents the struggle of these people's lives, then why would Eminem, who I'll assume you respect judging by your first post, write Purple Pills? Do you honestly think the lyrics of that song represent his way of life? No, it represents entertainment, which you conveniently fail to consider. Not every song is gonna be as real as tupac, or nas' illmatic, but apparently the different varieties of "rap" (yes, it's all rap buddy) have been lost amidst your own elitist views.
I'd love to break down the rest of your post but I fear my own reply becoming biblical in length ... until next time.
PS - "diggity daz outta the cut ..." oops wrong thread, that should be properly placed under the debate of letting in famous names into the MUD (chuckle).
<B> rap is for people who tell you what neighborhood when you ask where they are from. rap is only a phase for middle class suburban white kids, who listen to rap as a way to be rebelious without entering a world that is more over their heads than they know.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Daz, your views are so skewed that I wonder whether you can even comprehend your own thoughts. Quite frankly, I find your blanket generalizations to be outright insulting and demeaning.
I am now 23, but have listened to rap as far back as I can remember, and so happen to fall into the category that you kindly coin as "middle class suburban white kids." Yes, I'm white, yes I'm originally from a snobby town, yes I have $$$, but to link those character traits to my taste in music is outright insulting.
The problem with music these days is the egotistical puds that run around proclaiming what is "OK" to listen to, thus influencing young kids on what the "in" thing is to purchase. Let people listen to what they want, if they can relate to it then so be it, but at least have the intellect not to stereotype the underlying motivations for an entire subgroup of people.
Lastly, if any mention of women or drugs in rap represents the struggle of these people's lives, then why would Eminem, who I'll assume you respect judging by your first post, write Purple Pills? Do you honestly think the lyrics of that song represent his way of life? No, it represents entertainment, which you conveniently fail to consider. Not every song is gonna be as real as tupac, or nas' illmatic, but apparently the different varieties of "rap" (yes, it's all rap buddy) have been lost amidst your own elitist views.
I'd love to break down the rest of your post but I fear my own reply becoming biblical in length ... until next time.
PS - "diggity daz outta the cut ..." oops wrong thread, that should be properly placed under the debate of letting in famous names into the MUD (chuckle).
I don't ned to explain anything to make rap have credibility the sales speak for themselves .... trivia question here .. what other group has had to release a CD weeks early because people wanted it so bad they bootlegged it beyond belief???
as i said before .. opinions are like assholes............. everyone has one
yours isnt right or wrong .. nor is mine
yours just happens to be more close minded than mine
I also happen to love alternative, chants, soul, hiphop, r&b (yes soul and r&b are different), relaxation ... if i feel really upset some classical can relax me ... hrrm
by the way :P two people have been at traffic lights beside and have asked me what kinda speakers i had (yup BLASTIN The Eminem Show!!!)
------------------
Ambar -= Big Pimpin' =-
the sales speak for themselves .... trivia question here .. what other group has had to release a CD weeks early because people wanted it so bad they bootlegged it beyond belief???as i said before .. opinions are like assholes............. everyone has one
yours isnt right or wrong .. nor is mine
yours just happens to be more close minded than mine
I also happen to love alternative, chants, soul, hiphop, r&b (yes soul and r&b are different), relaxation ... if i feel really upset some classical can relax me ... hrrm
by the way :P two people have been at traffic lights beside and have asked me what kinda speakers i had (yup BLASTIN The Eminem Show!!!)
------------------
Ambar -= Big Pimpin' =-
-
Tanji Smanji
- Sojourner
- Posts: 765
- Joined: Thu Apr 18, 2002 5:01 am
- Location: Atlanta, Georgia
-
Grungar
- Sojourner
- Posts: 967
- Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2001 6:01 am
- Location: Somewhere on the east coast, usually.
- Contact:
Should you so desire, go check out:
http://www.thebrpage.tierranet.com/
Click on discography and poke through the lyrics.
And:
http://www.badreligion.com/badreligion/essays/essays.jsp
Greg Graffin's essays are great. He's a genius. The only PhD I know of in a punk band =D
Not quite rap, I know, but you'll probably find a lot of the same sentiments. And perhaps different ones you can relate to. Perhaps not.
- Grungar "Blah blah blah" Forgefire
http://www.thebrpage.tierranet.com/
Click on discography and poke through the lyrics.
And:
http://www.badreligion.com/badreligion/essays/essays.jsp
Greg Graffin's essays are great. He's a genius. The only PhD I know of in a punk band =D
Not quite rap, I know, but you'll probably find a lot of the same sentiments. And perhaps different ones you can relate to. Perhaps not.
- Grungar "Blah blah blah" Forgefire
Ha! Just as I thought...there is no logical explanation for what B. U. M. B. means! =)
As far as being close-minded, sure, my p.o.v. on music (or television, or movies, or books, etc.) is incredibly close minded. If I opened the floodgates and let all the crap in my brain would be toothpaste!
------------------
Zellin group says 'I'm still here buddy =)'
Zellin has left the group.
As far as being close-minded, sure, my p.o.v. on music (or television, or movies, or books, etc.) is incredibly close minded. If I opened the floodgates and let all the crap in my brain would be toothpaste!
------------------
Zellin group says 'I'm still here buddy =)'
Zellin has left the group.
that is kind of my point man. they say the same type of things - but rap is heavily biased in the media, yes punk is rebellion - but the media targets rap as their outlet.
------------------
One, I don't know who in the hell you are.
Two, I don't CARE who in the hell you are.
This isn't personal.
THIS IS A GAME.
Erevan
------------------
One, I don't know who in the hell you are.
Two, I don't CARE who in the hell you are.
This isn't personal.
THIS IS A GAME.
Erevan
-
combatmedic
- Sojourner
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2001 6:01 am
- Location: Seattle, WA
Ahh! the good ol days of rap. I guess you could say that i still listen to some of that stuff. I remember hooking up or cd playas and speakers to the electrical system in our armored ambulances, and we would blast some of old school and new hip hop while doing our war games. I called it "fighting words!" and "war music". Curious to know how many of you out there are black, and how many of you are the..um.."middle class suburban white kids." hehe, just wondering...
Take care~!
------------------
Aram the novice paly
Take care~!
------------------
Aram the novice paly
cleanin out my closet is pretty powerful actually... and i also kinda dig white america ... hell i like the whole cd ...
was watchin the dvd that came with it earlier ... cleanin out my closet will be in a movie coming out this year ... stars Marshall and Kim Basinger ...
what kind of music do you listen to zellin??? i'm curious....
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Ambar -= Big Pimpin' =-
was watchin the dvd that came with it earlier ... cleanin out my closet will be in a movie coming out this year ... stars Marshall and Kim Basinger ...
what kind of music do you listen to zellin??? i'm curious....
------------------
Ambar -= Big Pimpin' =-
8 mile
yeah thats it
and he doesnt deny most of his lyrics are from his life .. he says he probably puts TOO much of reality out ... but its his way of dealing with it
he also says not to put too much into it ... that he has a life just like us ... but since his is public .. its more hyped ...
who knows??
sure would love ONE of his paychecks tho...
------------------
Ambar -= Big Pimpin' =-
yeah thats it
and he doesnt deny most of his lyrics are from his life .. he says he probably puts TOO much of reality out ... but its his way of dealing with it
he also says not to put too much into it ... that he has a life just like us ... but since his is public .. its more hyped ...
who knows??
sure would love ONE of his paychecks tho...
------------------
Ambar -= Big Pimpin' =-
Hi,
Just got a question..
Why does music have to be about what a person can 'relate' to? Can't it just be about really enjoying it? I'm only asking because I truly love music. There is some from both the present and the past that I think is real trash, but I would never feel comfortable selecting my music based purely on my personal experiences in life. Isn't music about reaching past all that?
I guess it might seem a bit odd to some folks to hear it, but music to me is more than just something I listen to. I am an extremely senstative person when it comes to sensing the feelings and emotions of others around me. Music represents *other* peoples lives. Whether the artist is performing stories from his/her own life or if they are singing about someone elses circumstances it really doesn't matter to me.
Achieving an emotional/mental/spiritual (whatever) connection with others THRU music happens around the world regardless of where you grew up or what stereotype you happen to fit into.
Remember that music is about more than just songs or lyrics... it's about communication even without words. I have listened to songs in languages I don't understand and have still been truly moved by them. That doesn't mean that I came out with a pure understanding of what they were *trying* to communicate, but regardless... If it moves you, isn't that what it's all about anyway?
Nitania
------------------
(edited cuz I realized I had used the word 'pure' 4x! *scratch*)
[This message has been edited by Nitania (edited 05-31-2002).]
Just got a question..
Why does music have to be about what a person can 'relate' to? Can't it just be about really enjoying it? I'm only asking because I truly love music. There is some from both the present and the past that I think is real trash, but I would never feel comfortable selecting my music based purely on my personal experiences in life. Isn't music about reaching past all that?
I guess it might seem a bit odd to some folks to hear it, but music to me is more than just something I listen to. I am an extremely senstative person when it comes to sensing the feelings and emotions of others around me. Music represents *other* peoples lives. Whether the artist is performing stories from his/her own life or if they are singing about someone elses circumstances it really doesn't matter to me.
Achieving an emotional/mental/spiritual (whatever) connection with others THRU music happens around the world regardless of where you grew up or what stereotype you happen to fit into.
Remember that music is about more than just songs or lyrics... it's about communication even without words. I have listened to songs in languages I don't understand and have still been truly moved by them. That doesn't mean that I came out with a pure understanding of what they were *trying* to communicate, but regardless... If it moves you, isn't that what it's all about anyway?
Nitania
------------------
(edited cuz I realized I had used the word 'pure' 4x! *scratch*)
[This message has been edited by Nitania (edited 05-31-2002).]
i guess that would make sense if i had a flower colored tye-dye headband on and wasn't sure where i had been for the last week, but modern music is mostly about the lyrics, bar a few genres that defy this classification. i listen to music so i CAN relate to someone, and i know i'm not alone. ever hear misery loves company? music works. as far as sitting around a campfire feeling the spirit of the blair witch . . . no, not really. there are plenty of fun drugs that can recreate that experience. my time with music is for relation.
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-Daz Proudwolf, Tapestry Pirate
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
One, I don't know who in the hell you are.
Two, I don't CARE who in the hell you are.
This isn't personal.
THIS IS A GAME.
Erevan
------------------
-Daz Proudwolf, Tapestry Pirate
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
One, I don't know who in the hell you are.
Two, I don't CARE who in the hell you are.
This isn't personal.
THIS IS A GAME.
Erevan
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Zellin:
<B>Ha! Just as I thought...there is no logical explanation for what B. U. M. B. means! =)
As far as being close-minded, sure, my p.o.v. on music (or television, or movies, or books, etc.) is incredibly close minded. If I opened the floodgates and let all the crap in my brain would be toothpaste!
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Big pimpin
We spendin' cheese
Check em out now
Big pimpin'
On B.L.A.D.'s
We doin'
Big pimpin' up in NYC
It's just that Jigga-man
Pimp-C and B.U.M.B.
Check em out now
so you misquoted the lyrics, and BUMB is a slang term referring to 'a state of poverty' or something to that effect.
------------------
-Daz Proudwolf, Tapestry Pirate
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
One, I don't know who in the hell you are.
Two, I don't CARE who in the hell you are.
This isn't personal.
THIS IS A GAME.
Erevan
[This message has been edited by Daz (edited 05-31-2002).]
<B>Ha! Just as I thought...there is no logical explanation for what B. U. M. B. means! =)
As far as being close-minded, sure, my p.o.v. on music (or television, or movies, or books, etc.) is incredibly close minded. If I opened the floodgates and let all the crap in my brain would be toothpaste!
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Big pimpin
We spendin' cheese
Check em out now
Big pimpin'
On B.L.A.D.'s
We doin'
Big pimpin' up in NYC
It's just that Jigga-man
Pimp-C and B.U.M.B.
Check em out now
so you misquoted the lyrics, and BUMB is a slang term referring to 'a state of poverty' or something to that effect.
------------------
-Daz Proudwolf, Tapestry Pirate
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
One, I don't know who in the hell you are.
Two, I don't CARE who in the hell you are.
This isn't personal.
THIS IS A GAME.
Erevan
[This message has been edited by Daz (edited 05-31-2002).]
I agree with Nitania
on this one.
If you need somethign to relat to, join a 12 step group.
I'm white. I grew up in a lower class white family on the west bank of New Orleans in a little section of the city Named Algiers. I went to a 90% black school (O.Perry Walker reprazent)and listened to rap for a long time. Some of it I could relate to, some of it I couldn't understand why they would even want to produce.
Cut to the present. I am 27 years old, still poor white trash (the bumper sticker on my car says so) and a bit wiser than I was back in the day. Life experience has given me all I ever want to relate to. I could give a shit less about someone elses problems. Problems? They are the ones rollin in cash, and I am still a poor broke mother tryin to get my ass thru college so I can make something for myself.
I listen to almost nothing but electronica now. Much of the stuff has the really good beats that I origionally listened to rap and hip-hop for in the first place. The think I like the most about it is that I don't have some lame ass singing about his problems in my ear while I am trying to enjoy the music.
I have much respect for the classics. Music was invented to make you feel somethign inside yourself, weather it be sorrow, anger, happiness ect. It isn't supposed to be a medium for debating political policy, how much money you have, how much time you spent in jail, or how many ho's you can get to bump nasties with you.
No disrespect to those that actually LIKE this kind of stuff, but if you are so adamant about defending any one style of music you need to get a little perspective on your life and realize that there is more to it than what that millionaire is spitting into your ear.
Summer summer sum-mer time...Time to sit back and unwind...
Moo
on this one.
If you need somethign to relat to, join a 12 step group.
I'm white. I grew up in a lower class white family on the west bank of New Orleans in a little section of the city Named Algiers. I went to a 90% black school (O.Perry Walker reprazent)and listened to rap for a long time. Some of it I could relate to, some of it I couldn't understand why they would even want to produce.
Cut to the present. I am 27 years old, still poor white trash (the bumper sticker on my car says so) and a bit wiser than I was back in the day. Life experience has given me all I ever want to relate to. I could give a shit less about someone elses problems. Problems? They are the ones rollin in cash, and I am still a poor broke mother tryin to get my ass thru college so I can make something for myself.
I listen to almost nothing but electronica now. Much of the stuff has the really good beats that I origionally listened to rap and hip-hop for in the first place. The think I like the most about it is that I don't have some lame ass singing about his problems in my ear while I am trying to enjoy the music.
I have much respect for the classics. Music was invented to make you feel somethign inside yourself, weather it be sorrow, anger, happiness ect. It isn't supposed to be a medium for debating political policy, how much money you have, how much time you spent in jail, or how many ho's you can get to bump nasties with you.
No disrespect to those that actually LIKE this kind of stuff, but if you are so adamant about defending any one style of music you need to get a little perspective on your life and realize that there is more to it than what that millionaire is spitting into your ear.
Summer summer sum-mer time...Time to sit back and unwind...
Moo
-
Kerath
- Sojourner
- Posts: 62
- Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2001 6:01 am
- Location: Thornhill, Ontario, Canada
- Contact:
There's one thing I don't understand about rap. See, I personally don't like it, but that doesn't mean I'm going to go around denouncing it. People can listen to what they want, whatever floats your boat. But, it's the nature and classification of rap that I've never really understood.
What I mean is, why is rap considered to be part of the music industry in the first place? Now everyone's free to correct me, I'm just speaking from my own personal learning and experience. Basically, the way I understand it, the word 'rap' originated as an acronym, standing for Rhythmic American Poetry. And to me, that's precisely what it is. Poetry. It really started out with beat poets during the 'hippie' years, with guys like Alan Ginsberg, and evolved into what we see today. Now, there's poetry in a lot of music, after all that's basically what the lyrics to any song are. However, in my experience, rap has a very heavy rhythmic emphasis, and a virtually nonexistent melodic component relative to other forms of music. It almost never features what is commonly accepted as singing, and the musical component usually consists of a one or two bar figure looped endlessly, present solely for the purpose of keeping the rapper in time and giving you something quick to hum to yourself when you're bored. Basically, I think it's a hell of a lot closer to what guys like Frost and Tennyson were doing than it is to other prevalent forms of music today.
So, what are your thoughts on this? As you can guess, I'm a music nerd. I've been playing music since I was 5 years old, and hope to continue playing it as a hobby until the day I die. I just thought I'd bring this up as an aside.
-- Kagrar, troll warrior/jazz bassist
What I mean is, why is rap considered to be part of the music industry in the first place? Now everyone's free to correct me, I'm just speaking from my own personal learning and experience. Basically, the way I understand it, the word 'rap' originated as an acronym, standing for Rhythmic American Poetry. And to me, that's precisely what it is. Poetry. It really started out with beat poets during the 'hippie' years, with guys like Alan Ginsberg, and evolved into what we see today. Now, there's poetry in a lot of music, after all that's basically what the lyrics to any song are. However, in my experience, rap has a very heavy rhythmic emphasis, and a virtually nonexistent melodic component relative to other forms of music. It almost never features what is commonly accepted as singing, and the musical component usually consists of a one or two bar figure looped endlessly, present solely for the purpose of keeping the rapper in time and giving you something quick to hum to yourself when you're bored. Basically, I think it's a hell of a lot closer to what guys like Frost and Tennyson were doing than it is to other prevalent forms of music today.
So, what are your thoughts on this? As you can guess, I'm a music nerd. I've been playing music since I was 5 years old, and hope to continue playing it as a hobby until the day I die. I just thought I'd bring this up as an aside.
-- Kagrar, troll warrior/jazz bassist
i am not single minded. dieselboy. paul oakenfold. paul van dyke. vnv nation. thievery corporation. plastikman. portishead. enigma. other odds and ends.
i also like toby keith, garth brooks, alan jackson, trisha yearwood, kenny rogers.
and korn, stabbing westward, adema, marilyn manson, metallica, dope, papa roach.
limp bizkit, trik turner, icp, twiztid, nelly, dmx, eminem, dre, 2pac, lil kim, foxy brown.
n'sync, shakira, christina aguilera, blink 182, bbmak, will smith.
the list goes on. dont look at me as narrow minded, please.
------------------
-Daz Proudwolf, Tapestry Pirate
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
One, I don't know who in the hell you are.
Two, I don't CARE who in the hell you are.
This isn't personal.
THIS IS A GAME.
Erevan
i also like toby keith, garth brooks, alan jackson, trisha yearwood, kenny rogers.
and korn, stabbing westward, adema, marilyn manson, metallica, dope, papa roach.
limp bizkit, trik turner, icp, twiztid, nelly, dmx, eminem, dre, 2pac, lil kim, foxy brown.
n'sync, shakira, christina aguilera, blink 182, bbmak, will smith.
the list goes on. dont look at me as narrow minded, please.
------------------
-Daz Proudwolf, Tapestry Pirate
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
One, I don't know who in the hell you are.
Two, I don't CARE who in the hell you are.
This isn't personal.
THIS IS A GAME.
Erevan
-
Kerath
- Sojourner
- Posts: 62
- Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2001 6:01 am
- Location: Thornhill, Ontario, Canada
- Contact:
As I said, Daz, from what I've researched it was the original root of the term 'rap'. I'm not saying that's necessarily it's current meaning. My guess is it's just a word that got tossed around a lot over the decades, so much so that it gained a different or broader meaning than it originally had. Lots of people probably heard 'rap' and though exactly what you just posted, but that doesn't necessarily make that its origin.
As for what it is, rap is rhythmic, it originated in America, and it's poetry. I didn't think it was a difficult concept
[This message has been edited by Kerath (edited 06-01-2002).]
As for what it is, rap is rhythmic, it originated in America, and it's poetry. I didn't think it was a difficult concept
[This message has been edited by Kerath (edited 06-01-2002).]
What do I like to listen to? I couldn't really list a specific genre. I like to listen to anything that pushes boundaries and what I feel makes an artistic statement (yes what is art is debatle from person to person) .
I don't really listen to underground music of any type because generally there's a reason it's underground: It's not refined or palatable by any means.
My favorite bands are Nine Inch Nails, Radiohead, Tool, Tori Amos, Massive Attack, Portishead, David Bowie, Pink Floyd, Aphex Twin, Autechre, Beck, and Bjork.
Recently, I've started browsing a little in other genres. I picked up a copy of Bitches Brew by Miles Davis recently and found it quite appealing. All of the OST soundtracks to the Cowboy Bebop series are excellent, and span a wide range of musical styles (excluding rap/r&b/*american* pop).
The only types of music I exclude just by the very nature of their genre are country, pop, and r&b. Occasionally, I find rap songs incredibly funny, but I could never take them seriously as art. For example: ODB. This guy is hilarious. Wesley Willis. OMG.
Yup...there's your answer.
Oh, and, Daz? Explanation of B. U. M. B. is great and all but I'll never buy it until someone can actually tell me what it stands for. =)
------------------
Zellin group says 'I'm still here buddy =)'
Zellin has left the group.
I don't really listen to underground music of any type because generally there's a reason it's underground: It's not refined or palatable by any means.
My favorite bands are Nine Inch Nails, Radiohead, Tool, Tori Amos, Massive Attack, Portishead, David Bowie, Pink Floyd, Aphex Twin, Autechre, Beck, and Bjork.
Recently, I've started browsing a little in other genres. I picked up a copy of Bitches Brew by Miles Davis recently and found it quite appealing. All of the OST soundtracks to the Cowboy Bebop series are excellent, and span a wide range of musical styles (excluding rap/r&b/*american* pop).
The only types of music I exclude just by the very nature of their genre are country, pop, and r&b. Occasionally, I find rap songs incredibly funny, but I could never take them seriously as art. For example: ODB. This guy is hilarious. Wesley Willis. OMG.
Yup...there's your answer.
Oh, and, Daz? Explanation of B. U. M. B. is great and all but I'll never buy it until someone can actually tell me what it stands for. =)
------------------
Zellin group says 'I'm still here buddy =)'
Zellin has left the group.
I grew in a primarily black/hispanic town in New Jersey. So I grew up listening to rap. I've come to hate most of it now, brings me bad memories of alcoholic binges and all night parties with bad results. My brother is obsessed with rap, thinks it is the only good music out there. Occasionally I will hear a song he is playing and thing its good. I rather like some of the songs from Eminem's new album. His song writing is good when he isn't saying f**k every other word. Most of the music I listen to now has nice accompaniment, deep lyrics, good vocals, and evoke strong emotions mostly.
VNV Nation, Dot Allison, Lacuna Coil, most of the Final Fantasy OSTs and Piano Collections, songs from Neon Genesis Evangelion and Tenchi Muyo.
------------------
Jennie
@}--`--,---
VNV Nation, Dot Allison, Lacuna Coil, most of the Final Fantasy OSTs and Piano Collections, songs from Neon Genesis Evangelion and Tenchi Muyo.
------------------
Jennie
@}--`--,---
My point still exists, i think ...
people are saying what THEY think is or isnt artistic ... it's all in what a person wants to hear isnt it?? i personally dont like impressionistic art .. but a LOT do ... so i dont say they shouldnt like it ....
there wouldn't BE a RAP music if people didnt listen to it ..
it's all about freedom of speech and expression, and a perosn's RIGHT to these things ...
bottom line .. dont like it?? dont listen .. dont diss it .. change the radio station ... or turn the channel on the TV .. easy to do ... they make remote controls now
yeah zell i like all that stuff too .. i have such varied interests its not funny my cd collection goes from classical to rap ... and everything in between
all im asking is for you to respect others opinions... just cause you dont like it doesnt make it crap .... this is the thing that i have the most trouble with in my own life ...
just because you and i disagree doesnt make you more right
it is more easy to accept *ok i dont like it but that doesnt mean you cant* than *i hate it so you should too*
and as far as exploring what a song means?? its not for us to do .. its all in what the artist meant ... maybe we should dissect James Brown ... noone could understand him but everyone loved his music?? giggle
------------------
Ambar -= Don't Hate, Appreciate =-
[This message has been edited by Karikhan (edited 06-01-2002).]
people are saying what THEY think is or isnt artistic ... it's all in what a person wants to hear isnt it?? i personally dont like impressionistic art .. but a LOT do ... so i dont say they shouldnt like it ....
there wouldn't BE a RAP music if people didnt listen to it ..
it's all about freedom of speech and expression, and a perosn's RIGHT to these things ...
bottom line .. dont like it?? dont listen .. dont diss it .. change the radio station ... or turn the channel on the TV .. easy to do ... they make remote controls now
yeah zell i like all that stuff too .. i have such varied interests its not funny
my cd collection goes from classical to rap ... and everything in between all im asking is for you to respect others opinions... just cause you dont like it doesnt make it crap .... this is the thing that i have the most trouble with in my own life ...
just because you and i disagree doesnt make you more right
it is more easy to accept *ok i dont like it but that doesnt mean you cant* than *i hate it so you should too*
and as far as exploring what a song means?? its not for us to do .. its all in what the artist meant ... maybe we should dissect James Brown ... noone could understand him but everyone loved his music?? giggle
------------------
Ambar -= Don't Hate, Appreciate =-
[This message has been edited by Karikhan (edited 06-01-2002).]
Kinda off topic, but I still wish I was the first one to throw different colors of paint on a wall, call it abstract painting, and then sell it.
I never saw art as something to be defined. Art is an expression of ones self. How they choose to express themselves is their choice.
Music though.... hehe, I listen to just about everything. No lie. I play classical violin, and listen to country, rap, hip hop, rock, heavy metal, oldies. It's all good music to me.
[This message has been edited by Galkar (edited 06-01-2002).]
I never saw art as something to be defined. Art is an expression of ones self. How they choose to express themselves is their choice.
Music though.... hehe, I listen to just about everything. No lie. I play classical violin, and listen to country, rap, hip hop, rock, heavy metal, oldies. It's all good music to me.
[This message has been edited by Galkar (edited 06-01-2002).]
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Daz:
<B>i guess that would make sense if i had a flower colored tye-dye headband on and wasn't sure where i had been for the last week, but modern music is mostly about the lyrics, bar a few genres that defy this classification. i listen to music so i CAN relate to someone, and i know i'm not alone. ever hear misery loves company? music works. as far as sitting around a campfire feeling the spirit of the blair witch . . . no, not really. there are plenty of fun drugs that can recreate that experience. my time with music is for relation.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I think the only reason you post is to see you're own words in print because no one listens to you in rl. You take a very coherent and well-thought-out post by Nitania and rip it because it doesn't fit into your realm of possibility. More than that -- Nitania is saying the exact same thing as you are in a rather eloquent manner. If you don't understand the big words Nitania uses then don't post about it.
Music is music, the same stuff that is said about rap and rappers today is the same crap that was said about Elvis Presley and a gazilion other rock and rollers in their time -- but then maybe you haven't listened to Marshall's lyrics as closely as you'd like everyone to think. It's nothing new, so don't feel you're so special just because you think you're in touch with the controversy.
Zetey
*sick of reading dumb posts*
------------------
Zetey tells you, "Where can I get a pair of gaudy pink, thickly padded, handcuffs?"
[This message has been edited by Zetey (edited 06-02-2002).]
<B>i guess that would make sense if i had a flower colored tye-dye headband on and wasn't sure where i had been for the last week, but modern music is mostly about the lyrics, bar a few genres that defy this classification. i listen to music so i CAN relate to someone, and i know i'm not alone. ever hear misery loves company? music works. as far as sitting around a campfire feeling the spirit of the blair witch . . . no, not really. there are plenty of fun drugs that can recreate that experience. my time with music is for relation.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I think the only reason you post is to see you're own words in print because no one listens to you in rl. You take a very coherent and well-thought-out post by Nitania and rip it because it doesn't fit into your realm of possibility. More than that -- Nitania is saying the exact same thing as you are in a rather eloquent manner. If you don't understand the big words Nitania uses then don't post about it.
Music is music, the same stuff that is said about rap and rappers today is the same crap that was said about Elvis Presley and a gazilion other rock and rollers in their time -- but then maybe you haven't listened to Marshall's lyrics as closely as you'd like everyone to think. It's nothing new, so don't feel you're so special just because you think you're in touch with the controversy.
Zetey
*sick of reading dumb posts*
------------------
Zetey tells you, "Where can I get a pair of gaudy pink, thickly padded, handcuffs?"
[This message has been edited by Zetey (edited 06-02-2002).]
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